JoshC. Posted December 16, 2013 Report Share Posted December 16, 2013 Interesting points but I think there's nothing immediately wrong with using another ancient civilisation as the basis for a new theme; it all depends on how imaginative Chessington is. Chessington "World of Adventures" is all built on the idea of discovering different historical lands/cultures (not necessarily ancient in the case of Transylvania), and so far there's been very little of ancient America, so I like the idea. An Azteca/Incan theme in its most generic form can be too similar to a generic ancient Indian/Egyptian/Oriental theme, but when considered properly they are all vastly diverse. Unfortunately I really don't expect Chessington to go all out with this because it's just a small Merlin-penned hotel extension rather than a themed area, so we might end up with a samey theme area after all. The name alone is so straightforward that I don't expect anything unique about this hotel! ...But I think it's a good choice of theme nonetheless and I look forward to seeing what's in store next year. The way I see it, we have: Wild Asia, Zufari, Forbidden Kingdom and, to a lesser extent, Mystic East all themed about around a lost / ancient world which has been discovered. That's pretty much half the park, and is most of the park's major rides as well. Yes, all the areas are very different, but the core of it is the same. Having yet another idea about a lost / ancient world bores me. When half the park is all about it, I'm really not interested in discovering yet another lost civilisation. I want to go exploring elsewhere, in a much more modern time. That's why I like areas like Transylvania and Mexicana; even though they're cheesey, they offer something which is completely different to the rest of the park (though, in saying that, Wild Asia is my favourite area of the park because it is done so well). To be honest, I'm not overly fussed by it all. It's a theme for a small hotel extension, which I will likely never need to use, and won't have the same 'story' about it as a park area does. But if the park do go for another one of these lost / ancient world themes for their next big thing, I'll likely be bored of it before it even opens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJ Posted December 16, 2013 Report Share Posted December 16, 2013 ...if the park do go for another one of these lost / ancient world themes for their next big thing, I'll likely be bored of it before it even opens. Well surely that's more to do with having a narrow mindset rather than any fault of the park! I know what you mean but there's so much that can be done differently with ancient cultural themes, it doesn't just have to be "lost" and crumbling stone buildings and all that. The entire park, not just half, is about discovering different cultures and lands because that's the very point of Chessington "World" of Adventures, but that shouldn't necessarily make it monotonous. With Terror Tomb, for example, Chessington didn't just do the expected "ancient Egyptian land being discovered" ride, they made it into a bizarre horror house meets Indiana-Jones-gone-wrong idea and fused it with early 90s metal. And it was great... while it lasted. See I love that kind of thinking, and Chessington created all their best rides using creative processes like that. These days Merlin's new rides are built on statistics and marketing, and are bland as a result. I know this isn't really relevant to the new hotel but your comments got me thinking. Ultimately I agree with you because I somehow don't expect Merlin to think outside the box with this project, especially when the hotel's name is just its theme with an "a" put after it, as if it were some option on RollercoasterTycoon3. I hope I'm wrong! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshC. Posted December 16, 2013 Report Share Posted December 16, 2013 Well surely that's more to do with having a narrow mindset rather than any fault of the park! I know what you mean but there's so much that can be done differently with ancient cultural themes, it doesn't just have to be "lost" and crumbling stone buildings and all that. The entire park, not just half, is about discovering different cultures and lands because that's the very point of Chessington "World" of Adventures, but that shouldn't necessarily make it monotonous. With Terror Tomb, for example, Chessington didn't just do the expected "ancient Egyptian land being discovered" ride, they made it into a bizarre horror house meets Indiana-Jones-gone-wrong idea and fused it with early 90s metal. And it was great... while it lasted. The trouble is, even though the areas I mentioned have different themes, they're only skin-deep and cosmetic. Look past the low-to-medium quality theming, and you have the exact same idea, just dressed up differently. I want to see loads of different things in one park, not essentially the same thing over and over again. Maybe I have too broad a mindset? Yes, the entire park is about discovering and exploring different lands and cultures, I totally agree. But half the park just feels like 'Oh look, there's an old / lost world, it's found and we're safe, yay', then the other half is actually 'Let's take you to this area so you can explore it in it's own right and have fun' (what I'd want) or just generic. Just a bit of outside thinking and creativity would do wonders and make each individual area feel a lot different and a bit more special. It isn't exactly Chessie's speciality though. As I say, not too fussed for a hotel (it's nice it even has a theme I guess), but if the next big thing goes for a lost / ancient world, it will likely feel like all the other lost areas dressed up a bit different. Chessington need to be a bit wild, a bit daring. SteveJ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coaster Posted December 16, 2013 Report Share Posted December 16, 2013 They only go for lost civilizations etc because they don't have to maintain the theming as much then! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJ Posted December 16, 2013 Report Share Posted December 16, 2013 They only go for lost civilizations etc because they don't have to maintain the theming as much then! ERUGERUGINR no! Just a bit of outside thinking and creativity would do wonders and make each individual area feel a lot different and a bit more special. It isn't exactly Chessie's speciality though. That certainly used to be Chessington's speciality (the way I remember it years ago) and it made all the classic rides very special for me. It's what got me interested in theme parks in the first place, that you really could explore and enjoy each ride in your own way. It was never trying to be massively impressive or showing off, instead it was cozy, quirky and charismatic. I agree completely that there needs to be more diversity, although I would blame Merlin overall and their studios or whoever has the creative lead for being uncreative rather than Chessington. It seems they can only either come up with "decaying, minimalistic and dull BUT AWESUM if you're a teenager" (everything they've ever built at Thorpe Park) or "bright, cheap and plain" when appealing to families. The Smiler and Thirteen are some of the only great ideas they've come up with, but even those were massively under-realised. The fact that all Merlin have done so far with Chessington is install three African areas, one of which is actually just called "Africa" and consists of a pavement (what? I can't believe what I'm typing, plus they already had a far better African area with Forbidden Kingdom), shows them up for being lazy and uncreative. Chessington should be like a great album, where all tracks are part of the same record with the same characteristic sound but each one does something different in its own way. The Vampire, BubbleWorks, Terror Tomb and to a lesser extent Dragon River (because it's older) all had that recognisable Chessington wit and were all based on historic cultures, but each still had their own individual character. There are endless possibilities of what can be done with an Aztecan theme, different colours, different characters, different imagery - if only they were to put their minds to it and make a great ride from it. As a hotel, let's just hope it's substantial. Kerfuffle 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TraX Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 Isn't a highly themed hotel, better than a non themed hotel/or hashed rockless RMT/Scorpian Express? Whilst I agree it shouldn't be on top of their to do list, it will be pretty good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 I'm personally glad they're actually doing something, investing in the park. Larger hotel.. hopefully leads to further guests on park. If not, a good hotel operation anyway. Least it should make Chessie look more profitable and worthwhile as a park anyway. Shame RMT will never be the same, but I think we all knew that was gonna happen. Hopefully Falls doesn't remain rockless and that £5m zufari cut was for absolutely nothing. Poor park, as always. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshC. Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 Big update - http://www.chessington.com/updates/ So apparently it's now a £14 million investment! RMT is now called 'Scorpion Express' (as had been alluded to by a couple of people). Themed around a train which was in Scorpion Valley, it will go around abandoned mines which are now protected by a scorpion. Looks like Mexicana could get a name change then? But THIS is what I was talking about; this is the sort of thematic idea the park should be going for. There's also a 'treetop adventure', where you can play with monkeys, which seems to be a new extension to the Zoo. This seems promising, so let's hope Chessie pull it off! SteveJ, Topsyturvy15, BigBobJones and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark9 Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 £14 million is more like it. I'm kind of glad that Runaway Train is going to be a little bit different and from the sounds of it, I'm relieved it won't be just a giant Scorpion train and will remain an old style train like its current form. Maybe, Creepy Caves which is currently down by Sealion Bay should be relocated over towards Mexicana to complete the experience. Still.. it needs to become fruition for me to be actually impressed. pluk and SteveJ 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coaster Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 Sounds interesting. If they pull this off, improve throughput on certain attractions (Vampire!) and repaint a few areas that desperately need it then I will actually have time for Chessington in 2014. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJ Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 But THIS is what I was talking about; this is the sort of thematic idea the park should be going for.Yay but it's still the same "old" and "abandoned" "ruins" that I thought you said you were already bored of before knowing anything about it? But I agree it's a great idea for a theme to start of with and just what Chessington used to be great at. In fact "ruins of the mines" and "abandoned town" sounds exactly like the original premise for Calamity Canyon way back when the park opened in 1987, which is nice and retro. Also it seems the change of Mexicana to Scorpion Valley will be connected to the new monkey enclosure anyway, although not all Aztecan explicitly... the wording is so vague on that webpage, I'll have to wait and see. Probably hardly any of that £14million budget is actually going to new designs for Runaway Train and Dragon Falls, but at least they're coming up with new ideas where necessary and not just rehashing old ones or leaving it plain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt 236 Posted December 17, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 Scorpion Express sounds very interesting, I just hope they do a good with this. Sounds like Mexicana may be getting a retheme by the sounds and I hope Zufari gets some attention for next year but seeing as it may be another ancient area sounds a bit cliche. The 14 million investment plan sounds promising, I wonder which areas will be worked on next year apart from Market Square and presumably Mexicana? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldFarmerDean Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 and dragon falls retheme... and that's probably all they'll do - we're lucky enough to get this as it is haha! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastercameron98 Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 I have to admit though, their description of Scorpian Express makes it sound really good and I hope it lives up to the description and not a rushed job and who knows it could turn out to be better than we all thought and better than the original Runaway Train Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 So, what areas haven't they updated now? Pirates Cove... LOTD... mystic.. Market Square? (Though they seem to be refreshing that as well now). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBobJones Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 This looks very good, lets hope this is done on time and to budget and it looks good. If you read the magical description of 'The Night Before Christmas' walk through attraction, you can see how well these turds can be polished. But I guess we have to wait until they open, I for one will be queuing up to visit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 I'll more than likely stay in the hotel, considering I love the current one, and because it won't have the HI association I'll actually be able to get decent discounts, or those discounts will actually be available to use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 £14 million eh? Guess that extra £9 million is due to the hotel/zoo bit rather than actual investment into the rides... Scorpian SOUNDS good, but Merlin PR speak is always dubious... Need further convincing... AMAZU? They must have hired someone from Cedar Fair recently because all the names sound absolutely awful in recent times... They should definitely move Creepy Caves (back) over to Mexicana now, could even expand the Sea-Lion Bay area as a result (if only for backstage times or stage)... Need to see if Scorpian Express delivers I would say though... SteveJ and MattyMoo 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyMoo Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 I think this will either be brilliant or awful, sincerely hope it's the first as Chessie needs it. As has been said though, be wary of the PR speak! At least Scorpion Valley fits in with having Rattlesnake located there too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kerfuffle Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 Sounds great but I only have one thing to say... GOODBYE CALAMITY CANYON REFERENCES! But wait... we now know what's happening with Runaway Train, but what about Dragon Falls? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merry-go-girl Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 I'm going to play it safe and not form any sort of opinion till we get a look at what they're actually doing, I think the best case scenario would be a near duplicate polished version of RMT but with a Scorpion character mascot. Hoping for anything more just feels naive. pluk and Kerfuffle 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pluk Posted December 20, 2013 Report Share Posted December 20, 2013 The lack of mention for Dragon Falls makes me think we might be waiting another year for that facelift? Why would they not include details now? It's clear there are a lot of other things being done around the park, some of which were unexpected, maybe the resource has been put elsewhere for this year. If it was found other things needed doing it would make sense as Falls can open in it's current sorry state, maybe some other things would not have been able to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kerfuffle Posted December 20, 2013 Report Share Posted December 20, 2013 The question is, WILL Dragon Falls still be in it's current state next year? I'd bet my gold coins on it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollercoasterfan Posted December 20, 2013 Report Share Posted December 20, 2013 Personally I'm really not sure whether I want to see Runaway Train changed into a scorpion theme, as I liked it the way it was. It could be good though if they pull it off just right. Dragons Falls is becoming a bit old and grotty - I think it should be improved next season otherwise it is a bad mistake from Chessington. Yet I agree it probably won't be any different in 2014. Kerfuffle 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt 236 Posted December 20, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 20, 2013 My bet is Dragon a Falls will look just as I impressive and neglected as this year. This is because there is no mention in regards to the ride's upgrades or improvements within the patk's web page or upgrade plan. I would like to be proved wrong and find a refreshed falls for 2014, but I can't see this happening, not next year at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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