Benin Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 HSE want to check the other coasters to make sure that a similar situation cannot occur... They do use common sense for the majority of the time them lot, as lamented as they are at Towers for erecting daft fences... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kerfuffle Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 HSE want to check the other coasters to make sure that a similar situation cannot occur... I think the most likely coaster that could possibly have a similar incident to The Smiler is TH13TEEN, considering how trimmed the thing is. Nemesis, Air and Oblivion are pretty unlikely, as they have no trim brakes or MCBR anywhere in the layout. I'm not speculating too much into this, so we can only let HSE do whatever they have to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt 236 Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 Hmmm, it's not good then. I wonder when the park reopen again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 I think the most likely coaster that could possibly have a similar incident to The Smiler is TH13TEEN, considering how trimmed the thing is. Nemesis, Air and Oblivion are pretty unlikely, as they have no trim brakes or MCBR anywhere in the layout. I'm not speculating too much into this, so we can only let HSE do whatever they have to do. They'll be checking everything with block brakes on it... So every coaster in the park needs to have the once over irrespective of it having trims, because the reason this happened was not because of trims at all... Hell, I'm still always worried that Oblivion's brakes will fail and a crash occur when I'm sat on the brake run for ages... The way that brake run shakes when a train hits it *dread* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Project LC Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 You don't know that trims didn't play a part of this. After all something made that train stall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 You don't know that trims didn't play a part of this. After all something made that train stall. I imagine they will be more concerned about how 2 trains ended up within the same block section rather than what caused the initial stall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian-S Posted June 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 Excuse the noob, but what are trims? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Project LC Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 I imagine they will be more concerned about how 2 trains ended up within the same block section rather than what caused the initial stall. True, but saying that the trims played no part at all may not be entirely correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 True, but saying that the trims played no part at all may not be entirely correct. I'd say the strong winds caused the initial stall... But as Marc said, the main focus should be on why the crash happened rather than a stall... Besides, the trims on Smiler are magnetic, so are constantly 'on' and don't tend to affect the trains as bad as Thirteen's one... HermanTheGerman 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nosferatu Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 I hope the injuries sustained by the crash haven't completely ruined the victims lives. You put your safety in the parks hands and for them to let you down like this is awful. Shocking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark9 Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 I hope the injuries sustained by the crash haven't completely ruined the victims lives. You put your safety in the parks hands and for them to let you down like this is awful. Shocking. We don't know that anything the park has done has let the people down. Lets not jump down the sensationalist route and automatically blame someone. OldFarmerDean 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LK_ Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 tiny bit off topic but what made me wonder was this http://gyazo.com/c8ca3c1c171d22df547acd7d679dd618 I understand the GP's concern and all, but I doubt the ride will be closed down completely, I would still happily ride it if it opens back up, I just think it's the media blowing it out of proportion and people reacting to it way more than they should Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPJames Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 We don't know that anything the park has done has let the people down. Lets not jump down the sensationalist route and automatically blame someone. Unfortunately this is what the GP have already done; it is now presumed that the accident was due to "human error" as the train was released before the empty carriage returned to the station which is not normal practice during normal operations. It is like the general public don't seem to realise that some rides can operate with multiple cars instead of two? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark9 Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 I know the GP have jumped to the worst conclusion. On here, we kind of know a bit about rides so I was hoping we wouldn't just throw blame at Alton's door. I want to throw something out there. When I operated Fury and Rattlesnake, rides with multiple cars, you wouldn't wait for each car to get back from an empty cycle before you start loading again. You'd wait for the first one to get back and then begin loading. As an operator you trust that the ride system will continue to keep cars out of the same block. Also with loading cars, it takes longer time then just sending out an empty train. On a ride like Nemesis you'd wait for the train to come back, that's obvious but with a ride that can run five trains it's not necessary to stack them all up before loading again. A few witnesses have said that a train was stuck on lift one for ten minutes before it finally made a move towards the crash. If thats true, why was the train able to continue towards the presumably vallied train. HermanTheGerman, Kerfuffle, Matt 236 and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian-S Posted June 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 According to a poster on Towers Street (who nobody seem to question), the batwing section is not covered by the CCTV system, so in theory, the operator in the control room would have had no idea there was a car stuck there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HermanTheGerman Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 Well I doubt that's true, especially when considering the ride has stalled there multiple times before, you'd think they'd have that area covered most. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coaster Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 Well I doubt that's true, especially when considering the ride has stalled there multiple times before, you'd think they'd have that area covered most. You would certainly hope so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitchada04 Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 Let's say it isn't covered by CCTV (then towers will get in trouble for that you'd assume) still begs the question of how the system allowed two trains in one block. Even if they can somehow manually override it, wouldn't the system show where all the cars are block wise and that one hasn't completed it's block? It's a really odd incident that like Varney said is theoretically impossible. The investigation results will be very very revealing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Project LC Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 I don't think you are allowed to operate a ride without all sections being able to be seen by the operator. I'm quite sure its a regulation they must meet before being allowed to open a ride. I would not be surprised if this comes down to miscommunication between the ride team and the engineers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian-S Posted June 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 LOL no, that's not how H&S works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitchada04 Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 WMAS assistant area manager for Stoke Peter Howell, aged 52, from Trentham said: "When we arrived, we quickly realised what a difficult and prolonged job we would be dealing with. A carriage with 16 people in it had collided with a stationary one at speed."It was almost like a road traffic accident, but in mid-air. The carriage had come to rest in a concrete basin or bowl and was about 20 or so feet in the air. "We could see the front carriage had taken the impact of the collision and the four people there were the most seriously injured. We could see the two girls had open fractures on their legs and were bleeding heavily. "The Alton Towers staff and first responders were already on the scene and had erected a scaffolding platform in order to reach the patients. It did not take long to erect a second so we could get our paramedics, air ambulance medics and doctors up to them. "It was very delicate work and it was really difficult to get the patients clear. In a road collision, it is relatively simple to remove the patient from the vehicle but with rides they are very specifically-designed seats with harnesses over the head and chest. "Our first priority when getting up to the patients was to provide them with life-saving treatment they needed to arrest the haemorrhaging. One of the girls was bleeding out quite profusely. "Once the bleeding was arrested we then worked out the safest scenario for getting them down. Eventually we managed to winch them to the ground, where they were reassessed, before they were put in the air ambulance via the same system. "When you compare it to a very serious road traffic collision, where it can take us up to an hour to remove just one patient, we managed to safely remove 16 patients in about four and a half hours. "We had to put the priority on the first four patients, however we had other paramedics up on the platform talking constantly with the other 12 people. "The other people were absolutely brilliant. They understood why they had to wait and why we had to deal with the others first. They were very patient and credit must go to them for waiting. "From a personal perspective, it would certainly be nice to get an update on how the patients are doing." Floating around on TowersStreet (no link with it). Shows you how tough it was and how well all the services did! The park for erecting a scaffolding structure quickly and the air ambulance crew, paramedics, fireman etc for getting all those people off safely and exceedingly quick considering the position and situation. It may have taken 4.5 hours which must have felt torturous (that was for all the people though, those seriously injured will have been off a fair bit sooner. Also, Varney just said on ITV News "accidents like this are very rare but even one is one too many and the health and safety of guests is always first priority." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian-S Posted June 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 Sounds like everybody did an fantastic job given the circumstances. I hope Merlin look after their staff and don't just brush them aside (I don't mean financially), paramedics and firemen are trained to cope in such situations, but a kid barely out of school in their first job, doubtful. Olistjj 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 I don't think you are allowed to operate a ride without all sections being able to be seen by the operator. I'm quite sure its a regulation they must meet before being allowed to open a ride. I would not be surprised if this comes down to miscommunication between the ride team and the engineers. I can tell you for a fact that Vampire doesn't have full coverage CCTV... Usually the CCTV is focused towards areas that the cars can stop on normally (I.e. MCBRs, lift hills) as those are the areas that it's usually required the most... Dark rides are obviously a different matter... Ian-S and Zach 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Project LC Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 It would seem I have been misinformed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky Posted June 3, 2015 Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 It would seem I have been misinformed. I've operated Storm Surge, which has 5 cameras, only about 40% of the ride is actually visible from the cameras. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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