RobD
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Posts posted by RobD
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Just reviewed the ride again on a different forum, I'll re-post it here because it's more in depth, and possibly less 'picky', atleast maybe some people will be able to see where I'm coming from, anyway, please feel free to disect, offer your opinions on the differences you noticed, but please bear in mind the comparisons I'm making, and please, no one start the 'if Baco doesn't ride well everywhere, it's rubbish anywhere debate', just base this on front row experience.So, my review. I rode yesterday, 3 times, front left, middle right, rear right.Before I start, I want to point out I am comparing this ride, in the most part, to Baco (front row, yes, I know it's pedantic but that ride does offer very different experiences throughout), Dragon Kahn, and Nemesis.So...ThemeingI'll start by saying an effort has been made with themeing. That's the credit I will give. Unfortunately, the atmosphere created is more reminiscent of a scrap yard with a church in the middle. From all the hype that was given about the themeing, I was expecting Nemesis mk.2, something where Merlin had really up-ed their game but it simply is not that. The themeing creates no substantial atmosphere and the actors do no add to it. To me, the ride is trying to show you a destroyed town, attacked by The Swarm that will gradually take the rest of the world. It really does not. It shows a church and a nice assortment of trashed vehicles. What’s more, a massive detraction is as you enter the area, you have a towering coaster to the left, and a tent/gazebo with a very well kept lawn to the right. It's not even subtle, it's clearly there and simple takes any feel or atmosphere away. You walk into the area and it's JUST like SAW plaza, lots of metal containers, and a building. Unfortunately, SAW has an advantage, it has 7 movies about it so the majority of guests naturally associate the area with the notions of the film, The Swarm has no movie, so the area needs to tell the tale. It doesn't, in fact, I couldn't follow any sort of story at all, I will admit I did not watch the TV's, but, that shouldn't make a huge difference. I also highly dislike the fact that there are no buildings. It's so so open, you can see across to the rest of the park and there is no feel at all to the place, lost city and SAW create a better atmosphere, unfortunately.So, in terms of items of 'themeing', yes, they have tried, but in terms of any atmosphere or story being created thanks to this themeing; it's weak, and lacks any real consistency.The RideReally, really, nothing special. Yes, it has wing rider seating, which I can imagine, that in itself must be a real novelty for anyone who has never ridden one before, but, looking at the ride itself, it really is just very very average. The drop was not very good at all, in fact, I'd have preferred a normal one with a bit of lovely floater air time at the top. The zero G was very very nice in the centre of the train, but unfortunately it rode horrifically at the front and back. This followed for the rest of the ride; the train is so heavy that elements you expect a B&M coaster to ride beautifully through, it simply feels wrong. For example, the front rows slow very very noticeably as you go through the zero G, to the extent it feels like a soft set of brakes. The rear is dragged through too forcefully and doesn't give anything like 'zero' G, the incline loop rides very similarly; it's slow and fast in all the wrong places, in a way that makes the ride un-enjoyable (in my opinion anyway). The ride itself is lack-luster, the near misses are there but not really anything special, and I just think it did very little to take my breath away. The trains also suffer very much the same issues as Furius Baco; certain rows already ride differently; the problem is as a result of wheel flats; when a wheel is not a perfect circle, and these will naturally develop. Baco amplifies the issue through speed, The Swarm is nowhere near as bad, but still suffers. It also has the same issues of forwards-backwards jerkiness, again, nowhere near as much as Baco does but still to the extent I noticed them and it detracted from the ride. It is also horribly painful, the flying vests are too tight and really cut into your shoulders, although it is fair to say the degree to which they do this will vary from person to person, based on height and how well built you are.Overall, I'd say it's very similar to air. Nothing to write home about, but a different experience. It's just like Inferno, smooth and re-ride-able, but that's about it. It simply didn't take my breath away, it didn't achieve what Baco does so well; an amazing feeling of speed, fast pacing, and good near misses (in the through, the 'tunnel', the inline just over the ground). Baco also has more atmospheric themeing (well, of course it will, it's in a much better park
), it creates a story and takes you into it, a fine example of how I don't understand the words, but do understand perfectly what's going on. While people will complain 'oh but it has cattle pens', well, that really makes no difference, it's cattle pens, in a building, surrounded by storyline and actually creating quite an atmosphere, while The Swarm still has cattle pens, just ones that cut back and forth and confuse you.I think, 'like air' is the best summary I could give. The concept has so much potential, but The Swarm really does not take advantage of it. It's enjoyable, but when the thing I enjoyed the most about it was trying to touch the water on the swoopy turns, it doesn't say much for the rest of the ride.Sorry Fanboys and girls, and people who think 'it's UK B&M, therefore must be awesome', it isn't, thoroughly average and deserves a 6/10, maybe 6.5 at a push. It really doesn't 'do' anything special, it's average, just, with fancy seats. -
^^ Because you're one of these people who think if a ride is rough in certain seats it's therefore terrible whereever you sit? I know this is the case because I've read your other posts Benin. That's fair enough, but as I say, roughness is down to wheel flats, so The Swarm could (and I believe is in the early stages of) experience similar roughness, depending on maintenence routine.As for themeing, again, I'm refering to atmosphere created in the queueline. A cattle pen can be very well themed. Just like a festival for example, it's a muddy field, but there is atmosphere. The same applies. (may well be a bad example, I'll see what people make of it). Besides which, The Swarms queueline is terribly cattle-pen esque, you cannot deny that.Anyway, I'll leave it there. I feel it was pretty average, if I change my mind I'll let you know but at the end of the day, I'm reflecting on what I experienced, and the only chance of my opinion changing is to go back and see what I make of it next time.
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No offence, but, when you look at the towering recreation of hogwarts just to the right, I hardly think this is on the same scale as a great white tent with well kept lawn directly across the path from a scene of sheer devestation by a creation on a mission to destroy everything.... How nice of the Swarm to leave thaqt conference centre. It is a nice little creature isn't it....And also, I'd put money on that picture being pretty much out of public sight? Not just off the main path into the area (I cannot say, I haven't been to Florida since the constructionof hogwarts).You obviously missed this debacle then.
I do agree with the consistency of the themeing. It has good setpieces but it would be nice to have some burnt out buildings, etc. Then again, all I see in the Saw queue are pieces of rust, some plants and an blue and yellow train cruising along. Oh. -
^^ Baco WIPES THE FLOOR with this, in terms of themeing, near misses, speed, everything! Have you ridden front row?(and for those who think I'm wrong because this is not a shared opinion, venture off the Thorpe Park fansite, and you'll find it's a lot more shared).
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It's not about items of themeing, because if we're talking themeing items, we could say, since when is tubular metal (plane) themeing, etc etc. It's about atmosphere, created through themeing. Yes, there is themeing, which I did say, but, there is not overall effect, no consistency, no atmosphere. Compare it to disney or Universal and you will understand exactly what I mean. You are totally misinterperiting what I originally posted.As for general consesnus, I suppose it may well depend on what other coasters you have ridden. I am basing this comparison on the only other wing rider I have ridden; Furius Baco.And final comment.. since when does no queue have any bearing at all on ride experience? ahahahaI'm sorry since when did we class badly painted black fibreglass boards theming? Concrete floor and corrugated metal are also not theming, the only theming the ride has is what they could drag out the cupboard. SAW is anything but themed imo.
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Apologies for not joining the fanboy rave about a new ride.Firstly, I am quite aware the conference centre has been there for years, but, I think you'll find it was certainly well hidden before. What you will also find is that if you look at Disney, (who Merlin pitch as their rival), Universal, or Busch, you would NEVER see this anywhere near any of their attractions. SAW atleast succeeds in taking you into it's own little area, once you go under the track you are immersed in SAW themeing, and relatively isolate through use of plants etc. The Swarm lacks this because use of plants is not consistent with the theme. I accept this, but buildings such as houses where people could have lived, or even tents, dotted arounf to make the place look like a town, would very much have added to the concept. But frankly, it looks like a scrap yard meets aircraft graveyard.As for the ride, no, I'm not trying to pick faults, it has little worth of credit. It's thoroughly average. There is little feel of speed, the harness is uncomfortable, the elements don't really do anything, and the front row rides terribly. Yes, the near misses are good, and the track is smooth (doesn't detract from the wobbling and jekyness) but when the best thing you can credit a ride on is good near misses, it's really not saying a lot.Also needs to be noted...Forgive me if all you want is an indie opinion, but you do realise the tent has been there for years and has no affiliation with The Swarm at all? You claim SAW is better themed and then set about a vicious onslaught on a tent. Yet surely if you consider the island's surrounding environment as part of the theming then SAW would automatically suffer the same problem by default, what with the rather awkward ninja warrior supposedly sitting inside a lost atlantic city right next to the area entrance. The tent is barely visible from inside the The Swarm plaza, and doesn't draw much attention to itself. Samurai is bright blue and swings around hysterically over the area. I know it's your opinion, but at least be consistent if you're going to compare it. Otherwise it looks a bit like you're just trying to pick out as many faults as you can and it becomes difficult to respect that opinion.
Thus the reason I didn't use the word rough. It suffers jerkyness, not roughness. Jerkyness is the forwards and backwards movement of the trains, and the up/down wobble of the wings (this happens, only slighly but is a natural effect of the ride type), and it still caused me a noticeable pain in my back, very similar (but admittedly not as bad) as Baco does. If you have ridden Baco numerous times, you'll also know not every seat induces pain; the pain comes from wheel flats, which, again naturally happen, it may well have been a miniscule amount of wear particularly relavent to one specific row (again, as per Baco), so, it may just have been a temporary thing, only time will tell!Definitely not rough. Very smooth ride, I sat in all 4 corners of the ride today and although very different rough isn't a word I'd use!
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Well, I must say it was thoroughly average, really nothing to write home about at all.So, to disect....ThemeingGenerally poor. Infact, I'd go as far as to say SAW is better themed. As you enter the island, yes, there is a big rollercoaster to the left, but a VERY generic tent thingy on the right, shockingly generic as it's an unthemed conference centre, with a well kept lawn..... Anyway, ignoring that terrible entrance, you then get into an island, which, seems to have been home to all of a church, a few containers and lots of emergency service vehicles. No consistency what so ever. If I'm supposed to think I'm in a small town, it fails miserably, it feels like a scrap yard, with a rollercoaster inside it. The station building is an excellent effort, but terrible at the same time. Yes, it's a good effort, but VERY inconsistent, and lacking continuity with the overall feel. It didn't blow me away, infact, it hardly made me notice anything at all. It could have been so much more than it is.RideRode 3 times, middle right, rear right and front left. Ok. Well, right hand side vs left. Personally, very little difference, I just hate with a passion that blood rush to the head on the left, similar feeling to going upside down bum first on Slammer. Otherwise, more water touchy feeling on the right, which is nice. Front is horrific, it's jerky and doesn't flow smoothly AT ALL. The ride slows HORRIBLY into the zero G, the incline loop makes me want to commit, no no no. All wrong, sorry front row, you are horrible. However, back and middle are nice, especially the zero G which is absolutely mmmmmm, great effect. Other than that it's all pretty average. It still suffers all the jerkyness and jolts of Furius Baco, just without the incredible speed. I'm not overally impressed.6/10
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^ I agree with everything and have no problem ahaha, it was simply the absolute disregard for the purpose of the inital post, and the fact that abz reply was more just to score points in a belittling manner.Just disagree about the areana, before 2007 it was more used, but, yes, everything else is quite right, the park is shifting it's audience entirely.
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Does sound very standard. Once again, people forget Samurai really isn't designed for this type of wrok; it's a fair ride, designed to work for a couple of weeks at most before a full strip down. What's more, the windmill position is the standard position to attach/remove the seating, take down/put up, pretty much the norm. Most fairground Top Scan's could probably be operational within 24 hours from the situation it sounds like at Thorpe.
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To just make a point:
a. ...Which is never used, and if you actually read the initial post, the point that was being got at, was that it could be put to better use.b. As already mentioned, this starts, and ends at Vortex. Once again, if you read the initial post, you'll find the point that was being made, was that in the queue at the entrance, there is little more than the view of a shabby wooden-clad entrance.c. Thanks for stating the obvious, now stop being needlessly rude and read the initial post, and comment constructively.d. What, and you know about marketing? Aside from anything else, I think you'll find music at the park is not marketing; it's guest experience.e. Seen as everything posted was factually correct, I have no idea what you are on about.(a) We have a huge 900 Seater Arena, located in Ranger County. Surprised you've missed it.(b ) I think the view of the rides that you see at the turnstiles, gives an ample amount of anticipation. (c )Thorpe Park hold an annual event called Sun Scream, which has been running since 2009. This is focused on a range of live music, shows and activities.The Park also launched Reload last year, the nightclub for under-18's, where selected rides are open and music is played in the Lakeview Marquee.(d) Your a fanboy, you want to hear the classic stuff. Well I'm sorry marketing just doesn't work like that I'm afraid.(e) Brush up on your facts before you post please
Don't apologize, you were needlessly ripped for doing nothing wrong, and rightfully should be offended.Tpkabz, I really couldn't care less about forum etiquette, I'm going to be in your face. You are repetitively rude and offensive to people, and this is essentially bullying. Why don't you take your head out of your a**e and actually give someone else's opinion and comments the same amount of time and respect you deserve people to give your belittling replies.Tpkabz I am acutally offended by your comment, on I should brush up on my facts before I post. If you could actually bothered to read the post more than just the average reader does on trip advisor you would understand what I mean. Like I don't know there is a bloody giant Arena, which I may add is mainly used for 1 week of stunt shows and Experiment 10. Sun Scream is not what I mean, If I wan't top 40 music, I want for a reason, thus a beach party style not any other time!Sorry to be so in the face of many readers on this topic, I just feel I want to get my point across without being run down by others!
- AdamY, Cornflakes, Whiteknuckle and 3 others
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I'd say apply now, if nothing else you look keen to the park, and they would be able to employ you from your birthday. You may well pick up some summer holiday work, if your lucky, and if nothing else it's good experience for you to go through the job application process for later life. Give it a shot, make sure you explain your situation and see how it turns out, after all, what have you got to loose?
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^ Bar experiment 10, yeah, it is pretty much the same mazes for the nth year now. Even experiment 10, is much more wide ranging than just TP entertainments department, that expands further into Studio's North etc, but, credit where credit is due, that was a very good maze.
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^ Marc, are you for real?Of course entertainments run fright nights.... who else would? Environmental services?The entertainments department are poor, unimaginative and just not up to par for a world class theme park. I give Alton Towers, and, well, pretty much any international theme park as prime examples of what can be done.
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It's certainly not an Airbus A340. Speaking as a trained pilot and RAF educated aviator (makes me sound all intellectual ahaha), I can tell you now, the general electric engines on the wing are far too large for the A340. The aircraft has relatively small engines that are not overly powerful. These engines are beasts. Also in the picture of the themeing, the outboard engine is not really there on any aircraft, the wing, if a real wing at all, is from a twin engined aircraft. I doubt if the wing is authentic at all, however, as it is certainly attached to an artificial body. The engines will most likely be a casing with everything bar the front fan removed; they're very expensive to buy, although a good way to tell, will be if the engines turn in the wind. The front blades will naturally spin with even a mild breeze, so look out for that one. If not, they've been adapted and are incomplete.The rear of the aircraft is, however, very real. I suspect sourced as a fuselage alone, it would make sense as engines are always stripped immediately from an aircraft, and often the wings too. It's certainly a Boeing 727/737/757 or an Airbus A310, passenger variant. When I see it in real life, I'll let you know.EDIT: Most definitely a Boeing 737.Also, Swarm looks amazing, woo, wow yay!....The Airbus A340 is a beauty!A cargo aircraft, would have been something like this, although the Airbus series is unknown, would have been a smaller version, perhaps the -200. The wings are clearly modified by Merlin studios to fit the ride, removing the wing flaps.As it's not a whole plane, it would have been bought scrap. Might have been a cargo plane might not have been, as it would look the same once its stripped out anyway. Generally the seats are reused because the 300 series still fly. Enough about the plane, lets bask in the SWARMS spotlight!
Still loving the picture above 
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^ I've touched on this in the other topic, it's really what you perceive as value for money I suppose. In terms of the fireworks, my main moan is that they don't achieve their full potential in achieving a really emotive display, like some of the international counterparts do. I just think we so often miss the opportunity to blow people away with truly amazing experiences, in favour of the cheaper and often publicity driven alternatives. It's a trend that seems to occur throughout Merlins'.
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No (I'm going to just maintain some dignity here by pointing out that I did state this near the start), but I now see that I should. I think for me, I can agree with some of the moans about cattlepens and graffiti (although I must say in my most recent visit they had got rid of a reasonable amount of graffiti), but I just think the general atmosphere of PA is amazing and that in itself compensates for a small selection of rides. As I also said, to me, it's quality over quantity, and certainly Alton, has this the other way around. Speaking both from a personal level and the opinion of others, a day in Alton Towers sees it getting boring, a week in PA doesn't. As for investment, I'd suggest that while PA do not invest in rides, other investment is much greater. This has somewhat been my pivotal argument throughout. They spend a fortune on shows, staffing and other entertainment which all add to the experience, something the UK doesn't do. It's a similar case in Florida; we don't forever see more and more rollercoasters crammed into smaller and smaller spaces without any real themed tie in to their area as we do in the UK, we see (usually) far sighted, short term investment that appeals to a wide audience.Ultimately it's all a matter of opinion, as with everything on most forum topics, but for me the overall experience of PA is just one that is fantastic. It's a lovely place and you can loose yourself there, essentially the goal of a theme park. It's what people referred to as 'magic', that in the UK, only Alton Towers really achieved, and that was lost back in 2003? (Debate to be had (and indeed, regularly hosted) on ttf really).Rob - you been to EP?
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I'm not certain on the shows pitched to Cedar Point/Six Flags, but I think both the above are correct but incorrect, as am I. Fred, your on the right lines with market; as I stated; 'it's ability to provide a timeless experience for every member of the family.' (referring to PA). I speak from experience here. My entire family visited in 2008, this being my Cousins (14 & 16), Uncle (40+), Other Aunt and Uncle (45ish) My dad (40), partner (35), her son (10), myself and my brother (15 & 13) and my grandparents (65). Everyone enjoyed the park. It pitches to such a broad market that it retains a wide range of guests who DON'T just want rides. Maybe I tip toed around this point before a little too much, but in terms of physical park size, UK parks are similar to medium international parks. Yet they pull less guests. Why? because they pitch (increasingly so) to only one market. As I said before people go to Florida and Disney for a whole number of reasons, some for shows, and some for rides, and while the brand is a selling point, even the best brand cannot sell a poor experience. Alton Towers and most UK brands are all about rides, Alton Towers was not always the case, but is now much more so than it ever was. This leads to smaller less general markets and an experience pitched to only a smaller group. Clearly this doesn't work as well as a broad market group, as seen by the success of Florida parks. Essentially, people in the UK do want shows, but theme parks do not develop the shows well enough to attract the audiences required to justify them. The brand identity of UK parks is far too ride centric, and certainly Alton Towers, should look at how it can once again pitch to more than just ride enthusiasts. I think, as I read on coasterforce, the defining factor for what makes a good theme park is how much you can enjoy your day without any of the rides.Different markets. I don't know, but does Six Flags or Cedar Point offer entertainment to the standard you're talking about, seeing as most people compare thorpe to them?Again, it's market, and its attendances to the parks themselves and then to the entertainment. Disney Paris gets 10m visitors a year. So naturally they can afford, and will be able to do, an amazing show which will capture all audiences.Our parks are far, far smaller. Therefore it's only right for them to target their main audience, in the way that'll get the most amount of attendance possible and best ROI.
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Your right, we have digressed from the point. The point is, as stated in the first place, for a similar sized audience, the UK put together a much more generic and average firework experience than that delivered by international competitors, once again letting the UK down on an international level.How's it show that the UK invest less? Surely the amount of rides put in at the parks which have similar attendances equal the amount of investment put into entertainment. As mentioned in the other topic, different markets.Why are we mentioning PA fireworks display, when you are only comparing it to Towers due to comparative audiences? Why are we in this thread?
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Right ok. So your saying that the British audience do not go to Florida because they don't appreciate the shows? Your saying that British market isn't one of Disney's strongest because they don't appreciate the entertainment value of the park?No, because your totally and completely wrong.British theme parks fail at delivering shows because all they have ever provided (certainly in my expereince) is narrow market shows aimed at a specific audience, with poor levels of investment and an overall feel of tackyness. Take, for example, Thorpe Parks SunScream shows. They deliver a show pitched at thrill seekers; they market it as such, which appeals to mostly males in the late teens/early twenties. It's delivered in an environment which is reminiscent of being in a normal street, it doesn't make people want to try different things and certainly doesn't market the shows as part of the experience. This is not the case at disney/Universal/Busch parks. Animals, shows, and entertainment are delivered as a crucial part of the package. They are set in immersive themes and so tempt people towards them as if they are a ride or attraction. It's also broadly aimed, so appeals to a much wider audience, and the set generally is well kept and well presented. Your right, shows don't work in the UK, but it's not because the audience don't want them, it's because the parks do not provide the correct setting, atmosphere or budget to deliver a well presented rounded performance that is part and parcel to the overall experience.Not really.. different markets.It's pretty much been proven that very little amount of people in the UK care about entertainment. Otherwise they would've turned up to the shows they had. They don't invest heavily in shows because people don't turn up. Everytime they've tried, they've failed.The UK relies on rides to get people to their parks. They come to ride rides. The more rides there are, the more variety and choice there is, the more people want to come to ride certain/all rides, and the less queues there are.For the UK, the parks have definitely gotten their priorities right. Ents can come as an additional bonus to reducing long queues.
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^ That's kind of my precise point though Benin. The overall gist of the arguement is that PortAventura is a theme park, that relies on far more than ride investment to maintain it's customer levels. As you rightly say, ride investment is comparatively low to UK parks, yet their gate figures have risen substantially (if 2010 saw 3mill+ visitors, and also the 15 millionth, certainly in the early days, the park must of had even less than 1 million guests per year). Basically, the park must be doing a lot right, investing in the overall experience; 'the magic' that so often people say Alton Towers now lacks, than just throwing money at new rides. To spin this off the other way, if for the next 5 years Alton Towers built no new significant rides, but instead invested in the park to bring it to a standard similar to that of Universal or Busch, I strongly suspect they would see massive growth in gate figures over an extended period (10 years onwards) and deliver a far better overall experience than they ever could, simply by installing yet another gimmicky and relatively poor 'worlds first' ride.
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If you read my post in the other forum the calculation is explained; it's a 15 year average based on PA's overall season (which includes Christmas). I've calculated it like this because investment in show quality, themeing and overall experience (everything bar rides) has been very consistent, and even in terms of new rides, very little has been added (Baco and sesame street, basically). It just shows how little the UK will invest, when the likes of PortAventura's Fiestaventura have been around since 1999 (12 of those 15 years). The average audience for Fiestaventura is 10k (it will undoubtably peak at much higher than this during the day).Oh and just to mention, PA isn't the only example, Disney do a fantastic fireworks display, as do many other European/American parks on a daily basis. I'm just using PA as an example because their fireworks display just shows up how poor the UK efforts are, despite (especially in the case of Alton Towers) attracting comparative audiences.Mate, as much as you seemingly love PA and hate merlin... I can ASSURE you that PA does not get an average of 4200 in its park.Towers average over the entire season is 11k. Based on 2,750,000 visiting over the 240 days of the season.In 2010, PA had 3,050,000 guests. Over 365, that would make 8300 a day. And pretty certain they're not open 365?Edit: Fun fact. Based on Kevins statement that chessie got 1,450,000 this year, thats an average of 3983 guests per day (closed for christmas day). Hmm, doesn't quite stack up about PA, sorry!
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Average gate figures based on a 15 year running average over the entire season (Christmas openings, early season etc etc). Reasons for doing so are stated above. The cattlepens I can excuse in the majority of cases simply due to the fact that they are themed cattle pens. They work. Rita's has no theme; it's a queue. Kahn's queue; literally a cattlepen, makes me feel like I'm waiting in line at a chinese museum or temple; it works because it's themed. I really suppose that's a matter of opinion, but I am certainly not alone in my views on the park.Sea Odyssey left because Universal refused the park rights to screen it. It was produced by Universal studios in the early days of the park (relatively speaking).10'000 is also a bit low... Considering how massive the park is... Maybe Shambalalalalaladingdong will get a few more thousand in, but for an average of 4200 which is probably what Chessie can boast, the park must not be doing everything right surely?Dunno, I should probably go back soon, but effort, cos it's in Spain and the queues there were absolutely VILE when I went last, with the general nice atmosphere of the park being balanced out by claustrophobic and dank cattlepen queuelines that would make even Rita's blush... Plus they got rid of Sea Odyssey...
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Your probably very right, in terms of me having more of a rant at the UK industry, and your also very correct that it's all subjective; it's based on my opinion, and indeed, I haven't been to Europa Park, but I have been to some of the other's mentioned, and also draw comparisons to Disneyland and Florida. I'd further add my experience is based on the summer holidays, generally comparing like for like with other theme parks in the UK during summer, and other parks globally whenever I have visited. It is also subjective upon this, I will admit without that audience attending the park when I was there, and without some of the shows, I would not rank it quite as highly; but still consider it a quality park.Stampida and Kahn are not built under different era's of the park, they were both what I'll call the core rides, built a few years apart, but none the less always in the plan (you'll understand what I mean when you visit). Baco is a new addition, but it sits very well in the park and doesn't feel out of place *cough* Rita *cough*. Baco is a strange little ride, get it right and it will be pretty darn good, get it wrong and it's torture (literally). There always have been 2 sides to this argument; that a ride that painful can never be good, I stood firmly on that side of the line, until I was told repetitively that if I support that side of the argument I can not have had a good ride on it... and after re-riding, I realised how correct these people were; get the right seats and you can forgive all it's sins.I think I should also add my experience is based on several days on the park, staying on resort in a PA hotel. I do strongly believe you have to have a few days on this park before you can truly notice everything and appreciate it for just how special it is. It's another argument I've had on other forums, where people are of two very different mind sets; it's either a good park that's over-rated (in almost every case, based on the opinions of people who have visited for a single day outside of peak season), or an amazing park that people absolutely love (based on the opinion of those who visit during peak season or Halloween and spend a few days on resort). I'm sure you'll fall nicely into one of these two boxes.As for gate figures, I was basing this on a 15 year average; the park celebrated it's 15millionth visitor during it's 15 year anniversary celebrations (2010). The reason I base it upon this is because, in terms of event quality, shows and rides, the majority have been around from season 1, more highlighting how much other theme park operators are willing to invest compared to Merlins.When you say Port Aventura is the best in Europe. That is rather a large claim, rather brave actually. I wouldn't dare to say it isn't but considering how strong the competition is in Europe (Europa Park, Miribilandia and Phantasialand spring to mind) I'll take your praise with a pinch of salt.So onto Stampidia and Dragon Khan. Both rides approaching 20 years of age and built under a completely different era of the park. Sounds famililar to some UK parks actually.. Riding is quite subjective as it is. I don't doubt that Khan could be better then Nemesis actually, I certainly prefer the more American style B&M's like Katun and Superman / la Atracción de Acero over Nemesis. But that being said, Nemesis is still a classic B&M without a shadow of doubt regardless of whether the record breaking Khan is better then it.As for Furius Baco. If you have to ride a ride at a certain time, certain train, certain seat then I'll almost certainly hate it. To overcome so much just to get a decent ride is an effort I can't be bothered to put in when it comes to rollercoasters.
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PA attracts an audience of 10k to it's fireworks, that are on every night, for 2 months.... Gate figure wise, PA's average attendance is around 4200. It's prices for food and gifts are similar to Merlins', it's admission rates are similar to Merlins', and it's fastrack is substantially cheaper, yet the park invest SO much more in shows, themeing and overall experience. It's nothing to do with gate figures, it's Merlin's lining it's shareholders pockets.I imagine that it's due to park attendance, to how much they can and will spend.Thorpes fireworks in 08 had attendances as low as 8k.. From peoples views on queue times this year, I cant imagine it being tooo much busier this time round either.
The Swarm
in General Discussion
Posted
^ That's an in joke, PA is my favourite park, I don't deny it. It doesn't detract at all from my perspective, it sets a bar to compare against. I do accept this is a fan site, you won't take nicely to any disageement, but you have to agree with atleast some of my points. The tent, for example, does detract from the feeling. Don't try and cover it up, don't say 'oh you're being silly letting that ruin it', it's a massive detractor, and any theme park which cares at all for it's themeing would NEVER do something as glaringly bad as that.With regard to tear it apart, well, I'm commenting on my experience, I give it credit where credit is due; the themeing is a good effort, the zero G is lovely in the middle, but otherwise, it's not good. It's based on a fairly wide ranging ride background though, maybe you are comparing it to less rides? I don't know.Just to add to that, I do represent a very general opinion, a few members of the public who I over heard coming off the ride said 'it wouldn't be worth queueing for', 'it's alright'.