Matt N

Some new concept art has emerged of a very Joris En De Draak looking dueling woodie.

 

Now here's something out of no where: Legoland have shared a glimpse into the future, stating their intent to apply for plans for an adventure golf course, with a "new roller coaster investment" on the horizon too: https://www.windsorobserver.co.uk/news/19849032.legoland-windsor-plans-build-new-adventure-golf-course/
 
 
They're citing the potential threat of London Resort a reason for these investments:
 
 
An adventure golf course will certainly add to the park and resort in a worthwhile way. I honestly think that more and more resort parks should have adventure gold courses - compared to most theme park attractions, even a good quality one is only a comparatively small investment. They are low cost in maintenance, cheap to operate in terms of staffing and you can justifiably upcharge for it.
Plus, I think a Lego-themed mini golf just sounds like a great idea.

The "new coaster investment" is interesting. I've heard rumblings of a B&M going to Windsor. Personally, I think that's just rumours coming from people seeing the Legolands in China and putting 2 and 2 together to get 5. And I would have laughed the idea out the window a year ago. But with Chessington getting a B&M, and obviously multiple B&Ms in the Chinese Legoland parks looking likely, it's not the craziest suggestion right now.

Legoland Windsor has many planning obstacles, and they're low on usable space. Even with the focus on the younger market, they do need another family coaster imo. Their recent dark ride additions have been very 'for all the family' orientated, so having a new coaster catering for that market isn't out of the question. But yeah, will be very interesting to see what they do.


I do wonder if there have been an internal shift in philosophy about the likelihood of London Resort, given it's been quoted as a need for investment multiple times. Again, my opinion would be that they're still not worried about it, and still pretty sceptical that it will ever open, but there's certainly no harm in them playing off it to push through new investments.

Out of all the UK Merlin parks, Legoland has seen some of the most consistent and well thought-out additions over the last 7-10 years really, so this isn't anything new. But it's good it continue under the changes at the top of Merlin (even if it's not a surprise!).

I think mine are quite similar to @Martin Doyle
 
Roller coasters I like more than most
 
The Big One - Obvious first choice is obvious.  It has mixed opinions across enthusiasts, I've been told so many times that I "shouldn't" like it, but after hundreds of rides on it I'm still buzzing and grinning from ear to ear when it hits the brake run.
 
I adore this coaster because it has so much character.  Everything about it from the sound of the lift hill, the raucous nature of it, the 'unconventional' transitions, the way it slams you about, it's just incredible.
 
The first drop is still the best first drop I have ever ridden and I love the rest of the layout because it whizzes along at height and slams you into the turns, dips, banked hill crests, and I love the dives under its own and other ride's structures.  Going over the hill behind Skyforce then diving under Big Dipper and being slammed out of your seat into the MCBR is one of my favourite compilation of elements of any coaster.
 
Also - for better or for worse, the experience changes so much depending on the weather.  In 2021 it seemed to run better than ever, to the point where on a late night riding it was running so fast and wild, that it was the best ride I've ever had on it and one of the best I've had on any coaster.  It genuinely felt like they'd put an engine in the back of the train or something, it was absolutely wild.
 
So with all of that in mind.  I appreciate why it's not for everyone - to some people it's an archaic coaster with old tech - and that's fine!  But to me, it's an incredible feat of engineering, represents Geoffrey Thompson's amazing ambition and is a staple of the roller coaster industry.  Most importantly though, to me, it's still a phenomenal ride when pitched against modern coasters.  I'd describe it as 'timeless.'
 
Grand National - Again, predictable one from me.  Grand National is one of my favourite roller coasters of all time and like The Big One, still firmly sits in my top 10 despite me having been to various parks worldwide.
 
It's an absolutely wild coaster, packed full of insane amounts of airtime, laterals, unpredictability and really has that wild out-of-control feeling.  I love the layout of this ride, the way it gets more and more intense as it goes - the first big turnaround is quite calm, but by the last few you get these insane forces that really throw you across from one side of the seat to the other.
 
I have never, ever found this ride rough, it's absolutely mental but in the best way possible.  On top of that, factoring in its age and incredible history, it's a ride I have such a massive appreciation for and again - still stands up as one of the most intense, extreme rides out there.
 
Steeplechase - A ride that I feel doesn't get the credit it deserves.
 
It's not the most thrilling or big ride out there but it's so unique and different.  Being able to race two other lanes, sat on a horse on roller coaster track is just brilliant fun, and I also like how well the first half is landscaped and integrated with its surroundings.
 
Then the second half is fun with the interactions with Big Dipper, The Big One and Icon, and again it's just a ride that's so different and fun.
 
Nemesis Inferno - I joke that it's the only coaster at Thorpe I enjoy but I do enjoy it a lot.  It doesn't have to be "as good as Nemesis" to be good!
 
Inferno is decent in the morning but by the evening it's a wild, raucous blitz through inversions, forceful dives and turnarounds, and I just hit the brake run absolutely buzzing every time.

An extremely underrated ride in my opinion.
 
 
Roller coasters I like less than most
 
Icon - again, similar to above.  Icon is a ride I tried so hard to appreciate when it first opened at BPB, it had so much promise and the layout is very cleverly integrated with the park's other rides.  Also being a PB fan it was something I wanted to support.
 
Having ridden it enough times for the "new factor" to have worn off, I just really don't like it.  I don't think it's a terrible coaster so to speak, but it just doesn't do anything for me.
 
I find the pacing of it to be terrible, and a couple of decent elements don't save that.  Perhaps if the layout was taken faster it would be much more effective, but as it is, it just seems to meander round and also has the worst "finale" of any modern coaster.
 
It's also a huge shame that the elements that elevate it - mist, soundtrack, lighting - don't always work.
 
Almost every other major coaster at BPB slams into the brakes and leaves me grinning, Icon crawls into the brakes with a couple of boring s-turns, a dodgy airtime hill and the least effective near miss of the ride.  It's not even in my top 5 rides at Pleasure Beach, let alone the UK.
 
Such a bitter disappointment, but I'm glad that others seem to enjoy it more than me.
 
Oblivion - It's a masterclass in how to build up suspense through its theming - oh wait, no it's not, because the theming is broken and tampered with beyond repair.
 
It has a great first drop, but they forgot to build the rest of the layout.  It's like if Big One had its first drop and then went into the brake run, and it was built after?!   No, I appreciate elements of it were good, but those elements are knackered and the ride just doesn't hold up for me.
 
As much as the drop is good, a drop and a turn into the brakes do not make a good coaster.
 
Stealth - Similar issue to above, it's half the height of rides that existed before it and doesn't do anything ambitious or new.  It's like a diet Top Thrill Dragster and didn't even beat UK height records when it was built.

Coaster I like more than most
 
Grand National. Yes its rough and shaky as anything.....but what did people expect from a roller coaster well over 80 years old!!?? I find it good solid fun whenever I go to pleasure beach and its just an absolute classic. 
 
Big one. Sticking to the Pleasure beach, Big one may be a bumpy as heck coaster with little to no airtime but it has one of the best first drops I have experienced and is also just fun. A night ride on it is also legendary
 
Coasters I like less than most
 
Wodan. Now I do like Wodan, but I just feel it pales compared to other GCI coasters. Its airtime is not as good as that on Mystic Timbers and it also doesnt feel as rapid or as out of control as Troy. So whilst I like the ride, it just leaves me feeling short changed compared to the two I have just mentioned.
 
Icon. Now this ride is GOOD for the Uk market. I however just find it to be 10 percent decent elements and 90 percent slowly plodding around doing nothing. I can absolutely see why some adore this ride given its smoothness and interactions with the rides around it. I just want something more out of control,eventful and intense. This delivers none of that.

Couldnt agree more with the park guests!!
 
On all visits I have had its been full to the rafters with undesirables queue jumping and just acting like idiots around the park.
 
They actually make Thorpes very own clientele of undesirables look like saints and thats saying all one needs to know!!

An easy one
 
Crossing the causeway into Cedar Point. Nothing will ever beat that drive across lake eerie and seeing the greatest skyline of any park in the world just standing there before me after 14 years of badly wanting to visit!!
 
 

Park I like less then most - Port Aventura. The most mediocre collection of rides in a park. The worst park guests I have ever encountered. Just a horrible place to visit, only Shambhala and Dragon Khan make it worth visiting. And even thats a push. 
 
Park I like more then most - Toverland. Not spoken about enough. An excellent theme park that continually renovates and improves. Such a gorgeous place to visit. 

It's true that this and Colossus will be similar, in that they are coasters which will have 'standard' trains and a 'standard' lift hill (assuming, of course, there's no surprises like spinning cars or whatever)
 
I wouldn't be surprised if this is being geared up mid-to-long term as a "like-for-like" Colossus replacement. When Old Town and the island behind Swarm are eventually taken up, you're not left with much room for expansion, so do have to consider removals and replacements, and Colossus would be the first choice in terms of major coasters.
Project Exodus would be a similarly iconic coaster for the park, and similar in terms of maintenance. (If anything, probably easier to maintain, given the problems the park have had with Colossus' supports around the lake)
 
At the same time, it's not hard to imagine Colossus staying for a good while yet. It is *the* coaster which put Thorpe 'on the map'. It's still pretty popular. And who knows, with a retrack, it may become smoother (and be a cheaper alternative than completely ripping it out and building something new).
 
So yeah, it's very 50/50 - I genuinely would not be surprised either way if we see it here or not by the end of the decade.

True - it could be.
 
They seem to have issues with the foundations don’t they apparently? 
 
Theres also a clone opening soon (supposedly at least), so it won’t even be unique to the UK.
 
on the other hand though there’s space available elsewhere for new rides in the future.

Park I like more than most - Walibi Holland. Yeah it aint the best park in the world but when you visit during the halloween season its a great visit and it helps that Untamed is one of my top coasters.
 
Park I like less than most - Europa Park. Again, I DO like this park. However I am far from being one of the many that think this park is the holy grail of theme parks. I find their coasters to be relatively middle of the road in that they are good without being spectacular and the fact their dark rides are disney knock offs doesnt really sit well with me.

For all my sins, Thorpe Park. Though even then, there's plenty of people who love it more than me.
 
I have a big soft spot for Walibi Holland, even with their brash, in-your-face marketing. I just can't help but smile every time I even think about one of my visits.
 
In terms of small parks I have a big liking for, I'll sing the praises of Plopsa Coo and Parc du Bocasse till the cows come home.

Can I just use this thread to reiterate myself and @Mark9's hatred of Bakken?
 
I guess De Waarbeek counts? But mostly because its a small park so probably more under the radar rather than people hating it.

No, can’t honestly see this happening for the reasons largely mentioned above. 
 
Disney World is ‘primarily’ aimed at families, hence why most attractions are in the medium-family thrill category as the new additions in Star Wars Land and Avatar Land for example have proven. 
 
Pretty much all the other Disney resorts have ‘thrill based’ parks not particularly far away and they are all able to generally operate successfully without this affecting their product and demographic.

Or like a dark gothic horror theme, with the area called the Dark Kingdom, and call the new coaster as Knightmare

Part of it was down to the fact that's where the space was, and that's where investment was going. The Canada Creek Railway was introduced when they introduced the Canada Creek area (including Loggers Leap). It wasn't just a means of transportation, it was also an attraction in its own right, and looping round Canada Creek and giving that - albeit minimal - interaction with Loggers Leap helped too.
 
The area by Rumba and what's now Inferno had other attractions, and didn't really have the space for a train station, train storage shed and a turnaround.
 
 
It should be remember that the farm was just that - a farm! It had animals and restaurant. It wasn't noisy or disruptive in any way. If Thorpe Park didn't exist, no one would bat an eyelid at that area being used as a farm.
 
It should also be remember that when Thorpe Park opened, it wasn't really a theme park. It was a leisure park, which slowly developed into a theme park, with rides added in at certain periods. A farm in that location made perfect sense in the context of what Thorpe Park originally was.
 
At the same time, having it far away from everything else made sense. It was a place for animals and for quiet, away from some of the louder and busier leisure activities at the park. 
 
I don't think the plane exhibits were in any different parts of the park than what exists now. They were located in various parts of the park, including what is now The Jungle, where Vortex/Zodiac are, and parts of where Loggers Leap are. When Loggers Leap an Canada Creek were introduced, some parts of the lake were infilled to create the area. This might be the separate lake that was spoken about.
 
It was separate. 
 
Treasure Island opened in 1983, so pre-dates CCR. Before CCR opened, one could take the waterbus to the Farm, or you could walk there. To walk there, you would go alongside the lake, from what is now roughly between Rumba Rapids and Inferno to the Farm. About a third of the way along was the station / entrance for Treasure Island. You can see a pathway in the video @Mattgwise posted.
 
When CCR opened, you could still walk to the Farm, and I believe walking was the only way still to get to Treasure Island.
 
 
Yes, the park own them. Treasure Island could function as a ride site, Thorpe Farm almost definitely not.
 
Here's a very crude picture:

Roughly speaking, everything within the yellow region is - in some loose definition - Thorpe's, or of Thorpe's responsible.
Everywhere within the red region (up to the yellow line) is pretty much where the park are allowed to develop rides currently. That's not to say that the park couldn't develop outside that region, but it would require a lot of extra work and changes with the council.
 
As you can see, Treasure Island lies within this region. Back when Treasure Island was an attraction, The Swarm island didn't exist, nor did the straight patch of land above it. In the mid 2000s, the park decided to build an engineering facility building (which is one of the buildings directly above where "The Swarm" is written, just under one my crude yellow lines). The new land helped create a service road to connect it towards the back of the park in an easy way.
 
The Farm is outside of this development region. The park currently use it as storage and work space for some teams (such as Landscaping and Waste Management). At least one of the buildings there is listed too, so can't be demolished. There is some stuff that's also just kind of chucked there (if you've seen the Big Top documentary from Jack Silkstone, you'll see that the clown entrance feature has pretty much been dumped there).
 
Again, it's not impossible for it to be used for something low key or quiet, but highly unlikely.
 
 
The park certainly has gone through several transformations over the decades. Especially in enthusiast circles, there's more and more people who weren't born when Colossus opened, and that was truly the turning point for the park becoming a thrill park. So there's lots of people like yourself who will never know Thorpe as anything other than a thrill park, and it's really strange.
 
If you're interested in learning more, there's a fair few sources out there, albeit less stuff pre-Tussauds
Thorpe Park Mania: We have an okay selection of history / archive bits, albeit a bit more recent stuff... https://thorpeparkmania.co.uk/
Memories of Thorpe Park: Memories of Thorpe Park have a good range of stuff too... https://memoriesofthorpepark.co.uk/ / https://www.facebook.com/MoTP.uk/
Thorpe Park Nostalgia: If you're on Instagram, this is a great account to follow from someone who worked at the park and shares lots of stuff from the later 90s/early 00s... https://www.instagram.com/thorpeparknostalgia/
 
And obviously, feel free to ask on here too!

Disney won't build anything like Velocicoaster.
 
The most thrilling coasters they've built are Space Mountain at DLP and Rock n Roller Coaster. They've never been interested in the out and out thrill market even when IoA first opened with Hulk and Duelling Dragons in Florida. Whilst California has Knotts and Magic Mountain nearby.
 
The newer coasters look firmly in the family thrill category (if Tron rides like the other Booster Bikes thrill would be a stretch anyway), which is Disney's demographic. Never been afraid to have a number of "bigger" attractions. The likes of Tower of Terror or Test Track for example are great examples of the type of ride Disney go for. 

Maybe. 
 
I don't think it would take Velocicoaster to cause a significant shift though. All of the Disney investment points at interactive family rides and I think thats how it will continue. It would take a severe drop in attendance that is unrelated to covid-19 restrictions that may force Disney to alter slightly. Right now though, no. 

I aint too sure. The thrill market as a niche is far smaller than the family audience. Disney will most likely always be the biggest family draw in the world so I cant see them rushing to put in thrill coasters purely because Universal have done so.
 
They would have moved to do that back when IOA first opened with Hulk and the Dragons.

There's also a handy bit of info here: https://memoriesofthorpepark.co.uk/treasureisland.html
 
I'll follow this post up with more later, but again, Memories of Thorpe Park can give a nice bit of info about Thorpe Farm and CCR:
https://memoriesofthorpepark.co.uk/thorpefarm.html
https://memoriesofthorpepark.co.uk/ccr.html
 
 

Treasure Island was halfway between Thorpe Farm and the park, virtually a little west of where the vacant island next to Swarm is. Thorpe Farm was nowhere near Canada Creek/Old Town. The railway was shortened to just a loop when the farm shut.
 
See image below and watch the attached video. At 2:31 you can see the interchange for the Treasure Island Railway. Waterbuses used to also run from Model Village (next to where Sunken Garden is now over to the jetty you can see just east of my Thorpe Farm label. 

 

Sorry to double post, but unsurprisingly, the opening has now been officially pushed back to 2025: I think they’ve got a far better chance of meeting 2025 than 2024, personally; 2 years seemed like a phenomenally short amount of time to build a new park from the ground up, whereas 3 years seems perhaps more achievable, in my opinion.   On a side note, it would appear they’ve altered the concept art a fair bit; the British and French flags from the huge dome buildings are gone, for a start! Could this be the altered concept coming out of the SSSI designation?

Heres another of mine and I aint sure how "unpopular" it is. I will assume it is given the massive fanbase and popularity Europa has in the theme park/coaster community. Full disclaimer, I really like Europa before anyone things likewise!! 
 
Of the two top German parks, I FAR prefer Phantasia to Europa. I believe the following reasons are valid enough.
 
1. Whilst Europa has a far large coaster selection, I much prefer Taron and Black Mamba to ANY coaster at Europa. I actually personally find most the Europa coasters "middle of the road" with the exception of Wodan. I would rather one world class coaster to a handful of "good ones". Quality over quantity.
 
2. With water rides. Again, Europa has a far bigger selection but I would have Chiapas and River quest over any of the Europa water rides. Same as I said in point 1.
 
3. Dark rides. I personally prefer Maus Au Chocolat to all Europas dark rides. I personally cant warm to the dark rides at Europa as I find them to be blatant rip offs of Disney dark rides.
 
4. I find it a more manageable park in regards to not feeling knackered when walking around and trying to fit it all in. I liken Phantasia to a dish where the portion is just right and the food is incredible whereas Europa is a buffet where one has gone mad stacking the plate high.
 
5. I think Phantasia has a more unique overall feel to it and the theming quality in my book is far higher. Rookburgh and Klugheim optimise that.
 
6. I prefer the food options at Phantasia. Rutmoors tavern is heaven and the noodles in China are gorgeous!!.
 
So yeah. They be my reasons for having the opinion of Phantasia being the better park to Europa.
 
 

One that came to mind after how both rides have been running this year.
 
I'd say that Infusion is much more intense, fun and thrilling than Icon.  It also looks cooler and delivers a much higher throughput based on both rides' performance this year.
 
The only thing that holds it back from being better outright is inconsistency and the fact it's sometimes horribly rough.  If it ran at its best, all the time, I'd genuinely consider it a "better" coaster than Icon.

Yes. Yes you are!! 😛
 
For me the obvious small coaster that did a lot with its space was wild mouse at blackpool. Just an absolutely brilliant nostalgic ride and is truely missed. The other I will go with is Balder at liseberg. Doesnt take up that huge a space at all and is a quality wooden coaster.
 
Big coaster that wastes its size. Now the one I am gonna go with is either Diamondback or Silver Star. Two absolutely naff hypers. Sorry if that triggers any of the "Europa is perfect" brigade 😜

Obvious one here, Nemesis. Everyone knows why.
 
 
Big coaster that is a waste.. mmm. Leviathan at Canadas Wonderland. Behemoth in the same park is a much better ride are is basically the same, just longer and with far more air time.
 
I'll throw in Top Thrill Dragster as well. Waiting for the thing is a nightmare because of the risk of roll back. You go on it and sure, it is thrilling. but I want more than just twelve seconds of actual thrill, it severely under-delivers.