Sidders

Let's not.

I think he's referring to location only, Sam. The locations aren't as well-publicised as the events themselves and only a few know where the mazes will be until Thorpe make a further announcement/Fright Nights starts. It doesn't look likely the Sunken Gardens will be chosen though.

I'm loving a new BBC drama called What Remains. Very atmospheric, wonderful acting and an excellent plot so far. It explores the idea that even when we're more connected than ever by technology and gadgets, we've actually never been more isolated. It's got David Threlfall (Frank from Channel 4's Shameless), Steven Mackintosh (DCI Reed from Luther) and Russell Tovey (lots of really rather good things including Being Human, Sherlock, Him & Her, Coming Up and The History Boys), as well as some great other talents. Really really enticing stuff. And very clever too. But what I love about it is it's so secretive and the first episode was just entirely setting the premise and learning about the characters' back-stories and turns a simple Whodunnit? becomes something much more frightening and schematic and very psychological. And also, one episode in and it's already better than Channel 4's utterly bewildering and painfully bleak Southcliffe. So win-win really. Here's a link to the first episode: http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b039ftc5/What_Remains_Episode_1/

Was literally just thinking this.

King Charles!

I don't like the idea that the maze could you the railway. Walk along the railway path by all means, but there's no such trains in the film and I'd hate to see the whole thing turn into a tourist-y ride-through experience where the noise of the train and the safety of it's carriages removes the immersion of being alone in the woods, on your own, with little light, with supernatural forces around you.

Gorgeous colour scheme.

Haha! Great find pluk! Got to hand it to Smidget on this one though. What a find! And so good to see Kingsley move on up in the world!

!? Think of the fish! Which is it!?

Some low-lit lanterns hanging from trees or even ground spots could work. Outlining the path and providing just enough light to illuminate the terrain would be ideal. Just so they keep enough of the darkness prevalent because let's be honest, it'd be pretty **** otherwise. My fear is that Thorpe will instead go for the simpler and stupidly cost-ineffective option of floodlights. The result would be drastically different to makeshift, camp-site-suitable lanterns powered by what looks like a camping generator. Or maybe even oil lanterns for that old-fashioned flickering in the dark effect, making it hard to make out the distance. You'd be properly isolated and it'd feel like you've really left civilisation as there'd be no electricity at all. So many more option than floodlights. Floodlights with no mood, no intimacy, and certainly no atmosphere. By all means, keep the floodlights as a safety measure. But I'd like to see more thought going into the immersion of the actual maze than having it floodlit from some external source.

Again, a good point, but the truth is evident with other parks: quality (I.e. a decent attraction over an easily-marketable gimmick) takes more time to bring in a profit, but it'll serve the park better in the long run. It's just a shame Thorpe aren't very patient.

Very true Benin, and I'm not generalising or stereotyping, but we all know that Merlin are a business and have a long track record for installing rides that can easily be marketed as something over-the-top, in order to generate as much of the profit they want as fast as they can, often compromising originality and quality (The Swarm not permitting but look how that ended for them). They'll want to see a quick return like you say, especially after the wobbly first year The Swarm brought in. It's a potential nail in the coffin - arguably Thorpe's best ride has the worst opening year on record at the park.

I guess it's an old one then.

Yes, because Merlin have always been concerned about how easily rides blend in at Thorpe.

In concordance with Matt's post above, Nemesis was hyped like no other before I first rode it. But I was still blown away because I'd never felt such force, intensity and speed from my otherwise very small list of coasters. Even so, I've ridden coasters more than fifteen years younger than Nemesis and still nothing beats her to the punch.

"Same as any other GCI" isn't a bad thing when the closest one to the UK is in the south of Germany. And even less so when it happens to be one of the highest-rated European coasters there is. And as for Wood Coaster, gorgeous as it may be, Thorpe could never build something like that; as the park's name suggests, Knight Valley is filled with hills and ravines. Thorpe Park is flatter than Holland. If anything of that ilk is built by Merlin it'll be at Alton. But personally I'm against the valley coaster concept so I'd gladly not see any woodie in there. Goldstriker is just an example. I'd like to see a conventional woodie, with buckets of airtime and G-force to boot. I'm most impressed by Goldstriker because of how much speed it maintains through it's layout, and that would also be a welcome quality of a potential woodie at Thorpe.

No. Let's get Goldstriker if we must get a Woodie. Mute Alvey, for optimum enjoyment.

It's not an imperfection, per sé. It's the one point where B&M and Wardley said "Hey, were going a little too fast for the train/riders to cope here". It's called a stall turn, because that's what it does. It diminishes some extraneous kinetic force by reducing the banking slightly before diving into the last inversion. To put it into perspective, one of the fastest points on the ride comes after the loop, entering the stall turn, and you're already past the half-way point here. Most other inverters B&Ms are crawling at a comparatively pedestrian speed at their respective halfway points while Nemesis must still be dancing around 45mph - roughly 5mph shy of it's top speed. It made sense for them to want to slow the train down seeing as there's only a corkscrew and a helix left of the circuit. If they hadn't, you can guarantee there'd be more maintenance required on the track and supports here due to high G-forces (á la the first helix a couple of years ago) as well as a very snappy turn onto the brake run which could been very uncomfortable for riders.

Inta-logic.

But then we'd all complain about Tussauds/Merlin having yet another abandoned/derelict theme. I love Air, but as with the majority, I believe the theme should've been stronger and the budget better used.

Very true Josh. But I must protest that I think deciding which maze suits which style is very important. I think the CCR path maze absolutely, no exceptions, requires nothing less than nucleic groups. Being a relatively free-roaming environment out in those dark woods, and to then confine everyone to a tiny, narrow sliver of shaking people shuffling along at a snail's pace with every other second being filled with "Sorry" or "Didn't mean to stand on your foot" would greatly damage the benefits of having an entire forest to play with. I'll agree with you about The Sanctuary. It was excellent, and further testament that the right style of grouping can make or break a maze. And whilst it may have had the conga line idea, it doesn't need anything else as you are not being scared by actors in there. You are simply walking through and seeing actors... acting. They interact of course, but they don't jump out at you so much as they watch you and unnerve you. The maze works with the conga line because nothing's trying to hunt or kill you, so you don't feel as vulnerable to threat and there's no need to try and make the movement more natural. It's like an exhibition rather than a scare maze, and the scaring is left to your own imagination after seeing some of the surgical rooms and the effects of marmalisation on human beings. Also, parts like the arched corridor and the marmalisation room worked well because it felt like you were being processed in a long line of advocates. Being led by the person in front to whatever The Ministry had planned for you, with little or no say in where you went or wanted to go yourself. It was, mostly likely accidentally, an excellent form of submission right from the off. You were already being controlled. I'd love to see seasonal theming and generally a park that looks like every effort has been made to look like it's been well and truly taken over this year. And I don't mean Lionsgate merch. Hopefully Thorpe will do a bit better than the odd noose here and there too, and go back to the days when skeleton cages hung in the Colossus pit and green spotlights up-lit Stealth.

*Resurrects* What's wrong with this picture? And this one: Yes. Rita. Blasé, overdone argument I know, but I'm not talking about the piss-poor ride experience. I'm referring to the fact that from the minute you stand at the entrance to Dark Forest, you've got a red and black Intamin launched coaster ruining everything remotely dark about the place. Rita should not be Dark Forest's major attraction, Th13teen should be. Also, notice how it divides Dark Forest into two halves: one half looking like a construction site fell onto the money-making game stalls at a travelling fair, and the second half looking like a construction site in a wood clearing. You have to go past Rita's queue and launched track before you get to Th13teen. Now, don't get me wrong, I like that Th13teen is hidden. Most of the ride is hidden from view and that's what should be the case with all ride in Dark Forest. So here's what I'd do with Rita if I had full creative control. I'd build a launched Mack coaster. Since Thorpe isn't likely to get one, I'd give it to Alton. It'd be themed very similarly to Liseberg's Helix. The theme would revolve around the idea that there is more than just the crypt-keepers and wraiths protecting the forest. During the excavation that led to Th13teen's discovery, construction workers woke the tree spirits, but they remained dormant until now. That's as far as the typical excavation story goes. There's no new excavation discovering this ride, it's the spirits that were dormant until now since the original excavation. The ride will, like Th13teen, hide most of it's goings-on in the trees. And, like Rita, it will be launched. But it will also have a lift hill. This map show a vague idea of the new Dark Forest. Th13teen will be left untouched in this post. May return to that later. On this image, the green circles are trees, concealing the area, reducing sunlight, and hiding the rides. Also, you'll notice that I've removed all games stalls and eateries. The grey area is the queue line. Deliberately non-cattle pen, weaving in and around some of the ride's elements and the trees, and at some points coming into very close proximity with the track. The slightly lighter grey area underneath the "5.5" is where to queue will close if the extension is not needed. The triangles at the side of the grey lines represent stepped bridges. The black line is the lift hill, the blue line is the rolling launch section, and the red line is the brake run. The red shape to the top of the image is the station, without façade(s) or maintenance shed. Quick Facts Theme: Enchanted forest Colour Scheme: Dark green track, brown supports. Max Height: 69ft Speed: 49.5mph (calculated drop speed), 65mph (launch speed) Inversions: 4 G-Force: Unknown Key 1) Station onload/offload. 2) Pre-lift section. Includes a few turns and a dip under a queueline bridge. 3) Lift hill begins. 4) Lift hill ends at a height of 68.9ft (same as Rita's highest point, where the lift hill will be). 5) Helix that rolls over into an elongated corkscrew. 5.5) A small bunny hop into a curving dive. 6) Highly-banked turn into Stengel dive. 7) Elongated corkscrew. 8) Rolling, inclined launch section (air-time hill). 9) Inclined Norwegian loop. 10) Inline twist (think Blue Fire's last inversion). 11) (hidden a bit) Downwards, inclined helix. 12) Brake run. That would be a start for me. Will need time to theme properly.

That final inversion features, to my knowledge on only one other coaster - an Intamin launched inverter at Kings Island's sister park, Kings Dominion. It's called Volcano: The Blast Coaster, and it looks terrible. It has three inline twists.

For certain. They will have held focus group and look at which are the most popular, rather than which cover the broadest spectrum of scares. Nothing wrong with thinking like a business and at the end of the day, they're going to listen to these films' popularity rather than the hopes of a few people with drastically different tacks. You could say it's unfair, yes, but I'm just not that into mindless gore Pluk! I don't find it clever or remotely entertaining but I thoroughly enjoyed The Blair Witch Project and Cabin in the Woods' twist was worth the entry fee. I just prefer horror films with more psychological elements is all. I may give them a go if accounts suggest MBV, SAW and YN's scare zone are up to scratch though. I wasn't asking for entirely IP-based mazes? I don't know anyone who has?

That's all you can pick up on about my post? My doubts as to how much money Thorpe will make? And fair enough, I should've added that I commended Thorpe for Experiment 10 and The Passing's unique walk-through style last year, but nonetheless, I'd rather they didn't return to conga lines year. But that still doesn't defend Thorpe's incessant pushing of the gore genre. There is more to horror than this. I doubt SAW and MBV will be distinguishable from each other. The only difference will be Billy the Puppet and a pickaxe. Add to that the fact that You're Next, when stripped of appropriate film time to establish the story, will simply become SAW in animal masks, and it looks like there's only one maze that differs from the rest, in both source material and maze infrastructure.