JoshC.

Moved this thread to The Future. We've got a few different threads going now for things related to the 2025 season, with our General 2025 Season thread, the Amity Beach work thread and now this. Happy to keep them separate for now though. --- As for Sparkle 2025, I think it's worth tempering expectations a bit, in the sense that nothing has been officially confirmed. Whilst the park did say they hoped / intended for the Sparkle Project to continue on in future years, it was never confirmed. And with the Thorpe Park Passholder Group closed, we've no way of finding out what the next step is. The park did say they intended to remove Slammer this winter, so that's something to keep an eye out for. Colossus obviously sits half repainted, so it will be interesting to see if the other half gets done. Things like Inferno and Rumba could definitely benefit from some attention. Even Swarm could too. As I say, I think it's worth tempering expectations, not just because we've got no confirmation that Sparkle 2025 is happening, but also because of murmurings of cuts. At present, that's just rumours, but I think there's never smoke without a bit of fire at least. And naturally, bits of TLC will be the first thing to get cut. Of course, whatever happens with the Beach could be considered part of a Sparkle project in itself, but I think that's worth treating as separate for now.

Lucifer's Lair has been an absolute crown jewel of Fright Nights this year. The atmosphere in the area resembles that of a scream park rather than a Halloween event at a theme park. The variety of shows makes it easy to re-visit on the same night, or just pass through. The amount of fire is wonderful. The actors and theme give the opportunity for a more dark humour and adult tone (whilst still keeping it PG given its an event anyone can visit), which isn't something that any other attraction on park achieves. It's been my favourite FN attraction both this year and last. But tonight, when the park was heaving, just to be able to spend time there, watch a couple of the shows and see the electric atmosphere that there was, really does show that this is a superb zone, and I really hope the park continues to run it in future Fright Nights.

There had been a fair amount of discourse about the "Final Beach Party" poster that appeared by DeadBeat... With the date being today, last day for season, and time being advertised as "8.25pm". There were some people expecting something to happen on the Beach at that time. There was a small gathering of people by the Beach at this time, but actors from the Creature Campus dance show told people the party had relocated to Stealth. At 8.30pm, the final Creature Campus show of the season played out as normal, no additions. Now, with work currently happening to dig up the Beach, it seems like something is happening there. And the aim of the poster is to tell us the Beach is going, with the time of "8.25pm" being a nod to "20.25", ie it being replaced for the 2025 season. Seems like it didn't gather enough steam to become an issue. But this is perhaps a cautionary tale for Thorpe to try to not be too clever with their Easter eggs... Also, does again seem to suggest we're seeing a Beach replacement in 2025. Again, with no indication of plans submitted, no tease beyond what we've got, and the location we have, I expect we're not in for a new ride. Flattening out the area and turning into a space for the stage, with permanent seating, would be a good option in my books.

Looks good. I'd assume it isn't just a copy and paste job as there would have been some thought about publishing it. I don't think these tend to get finalised until later in the year / early 2025, so we could see some tweaks yet, as well as additions / later closing times like we did this year. But yeah, stable opening times is a win at the moment. Hopefully they can experiment with some later closings over summer, but even if they stay as is, I'm happy with what we've got.

Make Poland another trip. I get you want to do a lot and are excited by the prospect of doing Energylandia and the country in general, but it's better to try and localise things. Waiting longer for Poland, for example, won't mean you'll miss out on anything (in that, everything you want out there will still be there a year or two later), but it'll be much easier to do. Another general note: from a personal perspective, I found it took me a couple of trips before I was able to minimise costs, whilst still keeping quality good. That might just be a me thing, but if you cram in too much in a first trip, you also run the risk of the cost spiralling more than how it might have been over a couple of different trips

Just on a more logistical perspective, how would you plan to carry around sufficient clothing? I'd imagine you're not planning on taking 3 weeks' worth of clothes, but then you need to factor in accommodations / time and places to do washing and drying of clothes. And that could well increase costs more than you initially realise. It would also be a lot to lug around when using public transport! Port Aventura, Europa and Phantasialand are parks you don't want to do in a day, especially if you're at the mercy of public transport and not able to guarantee getting there for opening / staying until closing. You certainly could get all the major / highlights done in a day, but they're parks which deserve more time. In general, as others have said, it's a lot of travelling to do. I will say it's sensible you've got non-theme park days; it's something you hear people mentioning of getting burnt out of theme parks after doing so many in such quick succession. I will add as well that, broadly speaking, the norm is that people will do these big multi-park trips whilst driving, as opposed to using public transport. It's possible of course, but harder. It may mean it's harder to get advice related to travelling to some of those parks by public transport though. Have you ever heard of coast2coaster.com ? It's a great tool for planning multi-park trips (or just for finding out if a park is near a certain place you're going). You're looking at doing multiple parks in multiple countries and, simply put, it's something which realistically should be done across multiple trips. You're already looking at some Dutch and Belgian parks, so perhaps consider something along the lines of visiting: Parc Asterix Plopsaland Walibi Belgium Walibi Holland Toverland Efteling (also not a 1 day park, FYI) Phantasialand You could chuck on extra parks like Europa / Energylandia if you wanted to travel further afield too. There's a couple of parks there that aren't on your list, but definitely worth looking at. Doing those parks also gives you some time to look at nearby cities / take breaks, which if part of your plan currently (although, again, different places). It significantly reduces the travelling, and also the length required. Obviously it's your trip and your plan, but I think anyone who's done a big multi-park trip before will strongly recommend you scale it down a touch, in regards to distance travelled and length of the trip.

Plopsa is a lovely little park and RtH has obviously been such a wise move for them. I've been to the park 3 times since its opened and never seen it on 2 trains (which included a trip in the middle of summer and it on a 1hr+ queue...), so hopefully they can operate and maintain it appropriately. Anubis is slept on a bit these days. Good ride. I'm intrigued to see what they do next. Their indoor Bumba World has no doubt filled a gap / extending the offering for younger audiences, but I thought it was a bit rubbish in comparison to the Maya Land, with the dark ride being quite weak. The park could probably benefit from a new, more modern, high throughput 1m restriction coaster. Vekoma/Gerstlauer have good offerings on that front. Big issue I have with Plopsa - as you noted - is the cost. Food is expensive and not good quality. Park tickets are reasonable enough, but then with parking, etc, it's not cheap. I've noticed that they've been doing more UK-focused marketing lately, so they do seem to be capitalising on their location more, so it'll be interesting to see what they do next. Looking forward to your thoughts on Asterix!!

Guys I think ParmPap lost their job at Merlin.

Yep. I think there could be some short term issues, with staff maybe relocating and jumping ship to Universal due to the name. But Universal is a premium name at a premium price. No doubt there will be people who will choose to save up for a trip there over somewhere like Towers or Thorpe. But Towers and Thorpe will settle in nicely, and somewhere like Thorpe might even benefit in a weird way, given its close location to Heathrow. Obviously very early, so hard to say for certain what will happen. But I'm not sure Universal will cause as many issues as some expect. Very similar for me on Sunday: I went in with low expectations and only really wanting to do 3 things (Nemesis, Hex and Compound). I got on more, but it is so easy to end up doing so little. What happens at the moment when you go to Dark Forest and Th13teen is experiencing an issue? Rita is dead, the Skyride isn't there to take you away, and Hex isn't exactly a thrill ride. So for those looking for a more thrilling ride, they've wandered to a dead end and now have to go all the way to X Sector or Wicker Man. That's a lot of idle walking time. And of course, if you don't want to do a coaster, you've got few options. Hex, Granny, Blade, Curse, Sub Terra, Rapids or Battle Galleons are the main options. Battle Galleons is more of a warm weather ride. Rapids are shut. Blade, Curse and Sub Terra are located very close together, in a more isolated area of the park. Granny is more a kids ride. Your options getting crossed off very quickly. Personally, I think the decision to add a flat ride in Forbidden Valley is not necessarily the right one. More flat rides, yes. Another filler ride in FV, when there's other parts of the park in dire need of support, isn't the best move. It's not a quick fix, it's a long journey. Let's not forget that right now the next installation is a ride type which was removed almost 10 years ago. They've got a long way to go to get back to where they were, let alone improve.

Another capacity sell out day today.

Was at Towers yesterday. It was also the day where a large number of the traveller community visit. All in, it wasn't a bad visit. Certainly better than my summer visit. But between Rita being closed (apparently waiting on a part) and Nemesis being on one train (apparently engineers need to do some addition work to it), Th13teen being temperamental, staggered openings, no Skyride, etc, it wasn't exactly a good visit either. Hex has certainly seen interesting changes. Broadly speaking, it's all a bit too light, and lacking in subtlety. The branch in the main show sequence is lit in what is best described as green Christmas lights for the whole ride, which I found distracting, and the ending has loads of little white lights across the whole room, which is a bit...eh. The park are really limping through to the end of season. I didn't visit until May, so I can't comment on what it was like at the start of the season, but I do wonder if Nemesis' opening disguised some of shortcomings Towers had anyway this season, and the season has really just taken its toll.

There's plenty of things to say about how the park operates when it's that busy, but from a purely numerical business perspective, it is so good to see the park hitting capacity numbers.

I imagine that the capacity would have been reduced following the closure of the farm? That took out a lot of physical space for guests to be spread about. Even if a quarter of guests weren't using that area, it would certainly have helped with things in theory.

The park do not need a planning application to remove it. However, if the park intend to use the space for a flat ride, it is better to leave it until they submit the planning application. This is because it makes it easier/quicker for the application to go through ("We have a ride here, we're replacing it with something of a similar size and scale"). If they remove the ride, turn it into a blank space, then put in an application, it's slightly more effort to put through (not to mention a general faff too). The park did say they'd look at removing it this closed season, but beyond that statement there's no indication either way whether that will happen. As you say though, there's no planning application in place as of yet, so it's unlikely we'll see a new ride in its space in 2025.

Seems to be a quick fix for now. If the ride stops at the top of the lift hill, there's no guarantee it can reach that increased speed in time. Also think that moving forward it's only something they're doing on test trains (which tbf, is when there's problems). But yes, good news that it's back on 2! I believe today is one of the busiest days of the season, so very much needed!

I think the branding in general is an upgrade. It's great to see a consistent, clear tone across marketing, and it feels like the park knows itself now. I totally agree that in isolation it's a bit bland and easily missed. It doesn't exactly scream "theme park" either. But when included in videos or within other things, it works well. I also think it's got extra versatility. I loved how they used the infinity logo in different ways in the past Fright Nights blood, Oktoberfest pretzel, etc). But it was harder to achieve and only done infrequently. The current logo can be easily tweaked to suit ride/event colours and style, and it makes everything feel a bit more natural. For example, we can see Colossus, Hyperia and Fright Nights versions of the Thorpe logo, and they blend in nicely with each individual identity, but still feel part of the Thorpe brand. I still prefer the infinity logo, which probably has a bit of nostalgia attached to it anyways. But the current logo is modern, in style with how logos work these days, and is still versatile. And, more importantly, the park have a consistent brand identity, which has been a big issue in recent years.

I mean, they are running it with dummies during testing. For a whole hour, who knows. But should a ride have to run with dummies for a whole hour every day before opening? Sure it's new a is still bedding in, but that feels like a Mack issue there. Also doesn't help if the ride shuts down for a prolonged period and the park need to do test runs, which is where the ride has been running slowly.

Yep, I believe Zodiac also has a smoke machine too. Marc grabbed some awesome photos last night: Does seem like Fright Nights has had an awesome glow up - literally - with lighting. Hopefully that can be maintained in future years, and things like smoke machines become more appropriately common place too. And next, they can do some proper audio!

Nah, the land behind Swarm is fine and ready for a coaster, unless there's something seriously wrong with it. You don't need that long for the land to before you can build on. If we take a look back in 2005, none of the infilled land was present. That includes Saw, Saw Alive path, Swarm, island behind Swarm and the road linking up the old Treasure Island to the Engineering area, plus Hyperia's infilling. 2005: Google Earth allows you to look at 3D models of current buildings too. It's not accurate, but gives a rough look: Fastforward to 2008. The land for Saw was infilled and settled (completed by 2007). The park are starting on Saw Alive pathway, and the two islands. What's noteworthy is that Saw's had been completed and constructed on between 2005-2008, and neither Swarm nor the other island are complete yet. 2008: Go again to 2010 (annoying Google Earth doesn't have yearly looks). Saw open, Saw Alive pathway being used. Swarm island complete. Adjacent island almost complete. 2010: 2012. Swarm opens and Thorpe flops, apparently. Tidied up of Swarm island land. The adjacent island is now completely infilled, even featuring some of Swarm's layout. All is golden. 2012: I also haven't mentioned the building of the hotel. We see nothing in 2008, the land almost complete in 2010, and by 2013, the hotel exists. We can also see with Hyperia, some supports were built on reclaimed. Compare 2024 vs 2022. 2024: 2022: The island behind Swarm has been complete since 2012. Whilst no doubt there is a level of needing the ground to settle, it will be settled by now. If not, there's major integrity issues and the park would either be actively doing work to resolve that, or not be considering the area for rides at all. However, before Swarm's failure, a coaster was planned there for 2015. A coaster was considered there for 2020. The project that ultimately ended up with us getting Hyperia was considered for there. The park have actively considered rides there, and as I understand, it's the front runner location for the next major investment.

They did manage to get Timber Tug Boat and Lumber Jump without planning application. Equally the move of Lumber Jump to High Striker didn't require prior approval. Can't think of any other time that's happened, so I imagine it's because they're small rides which aren't technically permanent (ie if necessary, they could literally pick them up and move them at any given notice)

They're also charging £12 for a one shot maze ticket over Scarefest. TWELVE POUNDS.

Unfortunately not. The park need planning permission for any permanent ride (to the best of knowledge). Personally, I don't think a ride suits the Beach area. There's no natural landscape there, so it would be a blank slate, flat surface. It would need a significant amount of visual appeal to fit in and not be an eyesore, or spoil the the view. I'm not saying it wouldn't work, or that Thorpe couldn't make it work. But I just don't see it happening.

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Ahh man, we've had so much peace and quiet, but you've ding dong done it

I visited Thorpe on Friday and Sunday. I did the mazes again on Sunday. Friday was an interesting one: park was surprisingly quiet, as were maze queues. Not sure why, but just one of those things. Sunday was...less good. Bought the Fearsome Four package for 3-7pm. The park wasn't that busy, but it took us the full 4 hours to do 4 mazes. -Survival Games was walk on at 3pm. I was a bit disappointed that they double batched the cages. At that point, it's completely unnecessary. I'd rather wait a few extra minutes and get a smaller, more personal experience (and that's for any maze). Maze was more hands-ony that on Thursday though. -Trailers was next. Advertised as 60mins, took almost 2 hours. There were 2 shutdowns, although you wouldn't know that as they didn't do any announcements or update the app. I could tell from seeing staff going in and out of maze and not hearing anyone leave. But to someone less aware of FN operations, you'd have no clue why it wasn't moving. There's also a hidden queue line behind the building for it now, to stop the queue spilling out. Seems like a very poor design, and rushed, as there's no lighting, audio or cameras there. Maze was just as good as Thursday, though a couple less actors. -DeadBeat was a 15 minute wait. Same again as on Thursday. -Stitches was another long wait. Always seems to be, but can't figure out why. The park need to re-think the queue for this. There were multiple instances of people ducking under barriers and getting into the queue. That meant that people were getting in without paying and were queue jumping. Worse, when reported to security (as these people were being rude to other guests too), nothing was done. Maze itself was fine, again little difference compared to Thursday. Crows had improved compared to Thursday, and Lucifer's Lair was as fun as ever. There were a few operational issues too. Some of this is teething issues, some of this is staff frankly not being trained properly, of which I reported / complained at Guest Services. Needs sorting out. There were a few shutdowns too, which doesn't help when you've got the main coaster on one train. So yeah, not my greatest Fright Nights visit. FN attraction quality good, but outside of that, somewhat burdenous. I haven't watched the above vlog, because frankly I don't care to spend 20 minutes of life watching some randos talk about their day at a theme park. Especially if they wrote it all down and I could read it in 5 minutes. But there will be different opinions and all that. But honestly? I don't think the maze quality was that different between Thursday and Sunday. The bigger issue is that the park has struggled operationally. Not great security choices. Bad batching intervals. Dodgy operations and communication. A chain is only as strong as its weakest link, and right now Fright Nights' weakest link is not the attraction quality. The good thing is it means they can resolve that quickly, if they take action. On a tangential note, I went to The Howl (the little brother of Tulleys this weekend). I paid £30 for 6 mazes, as opposed to the £27.20 for the 4 at Thorpe (with discount). The mazes at Thorpe are vastly superior in terms of theming, scare and overall quality. The Howl is the second-closest Halloween scare event to Thorpe (after Tulleys), and it showed to me how far ahead Thorpe are on that front. In terms of UK theme parks, Thorpe's only potential competition is Towers, which has been a mixed bag for a while. Yes, there's much better events than The Howl out there, but Thorpe can only compete with what they're up against, but Thorpe are leagues ahead. I think it's easy to forget that sometimes.