JoshC.

I don't think so, but I grant you it's a bit suss that two accelerators are experiencing extending periods of downtime at the same time.

I would expect it to be closed for a long period of time from what I've heard. Frankly, I find it crazy that Thorpe haven't confirmed that on their website or social media in any way. I get that no park likes confirming a long-term closure, but surely from a customer service perspective it's better than saying nothing?

No, they shouldn't. This is precisely the point I'm trying to make. The resources, motivation and set up of Europa Park is completely unlike any other park. No park should see them as an example to work towards, because they cannot operate like them and cannot achieve their successes in the same way. Lessons can be learned, but they're obvious and basic ones. It wouldn't. There would be a small period of downtime, to fix/replace chain (whatever is more appropriate) and, because it's the UK, reassure the public that everything is safe. But there would be no need for the HSE to force an extended closure (especially given no one was injured).

Oh, definitely - credit where credit is due, Europa do what they do very well. There's no denying that. All I'm saying is it's easy to take for granted the unique situation the park is in, and how much that effects the operation of the park. They have a vested interest to run their Mack rides in the best way possible, meaning they can throw money at getting high level of staff, and high quality staff, to run the rides, along with expert engineers. And that naturally means any non-Mack rides have to be in the same position. Few parks could justify the level of investment it takes to upkeep the park to the standard Europa are able to, nor the way the park operates on a day-to-day basis. That's not to take away from what Europa do; they're brilliant and tick all the rights boxes. But still, they are the exception to the rule.

Let's keep in mind that Europa have access to a vast amount of engineering power, and have a space to keep a huge amount of spare parts / resources (thanks to being Mack). Very few parks in the world have that option, and I'm sure many parks envy the position they're in. Equally, it's incredible from a H&S perspective that they're in a position to reopen the ride less than 24hrs later - even if a UK park, for example, were able to replace and test a chain in such a time frame, a H&S investigation would delay a reopening. --- In a slightly more light hearted accident, Billybird Park in Zeelandsedijk, Netherlands, has had to close down a recently opened slide in their park, following a few incidents like this: Just looking at the slide, you have to wonder how this wasn't foreseen...

I mean, Mack are the European distributors for GCI, so it's as good as being a Mack

Fun transformation tweet from Simworx:

Not really anywhere appropriate to put this, so this'll do: http://igvofficial.com/german-theme-park-forced-to-shut-down-ride-resembling-nazi-swastika/ German theme park recently builds a Gerstlauer Sky Fly type ride, looks like two flying Swastikas. Oops. Apparently no one realised until someone posted a video online saying so. Double oops. The ride is now closed and the manufacturer is redesigning the ride so it only has 3 arms on each side.

Wouldn't happen at Europa Pa- Oh wait

It will have walls! Instantly better than Big Top 2015 right? Hopefully we can an announcement soon. Given the location and the quiet summer, it would have been a good way to drum up interest ("oooh, the abandoned Loggers Leap sawmill is having work done to it..what's happening??")

POV shows that the ride is going for the 'short but stunning' type of ride. Like yes, it's a short ride cycle, but it packs so much in. The speed is mental, and the little wobbles in the early half will certainly be felt. Going to be a crazy experience for sure. The park's owner has also confirmed the following: -The park will open the Vekoma double launch and a Vekoma mine train (still rumoured to be of a similar scale to Colorado Adventure at Phantasialand) in 2020 -The next few years will see the park open a Vekoma tilt coaster and 4 other unique/mid-to-large scale coasters The EU funding runs out for rides opening next year. So that's still mental expansion.

Ignoring the unnecessary sarcasm in your post, when you're at a theme park you've never visited before and want to make the most out of your day (especially with a 4 year old) you use the advertised queue times as a means of doing that. When some are completely out of the ball park in terms of accuracy, it's frustrating. And yes, it's the same for every other theme park which struggles to give accurate queue times. Doesn't make it any less of a valid point. NB: Walibi parks, Toverland, Efteling, Phantasialand (minus Taron) have all been pretty good at giving accurate queue times in my experiences.

Went to Paultons yesterday; went with my mum and 4 year old brother. A quick review: I'll start off with the negatives, because I do think that shaped a fair bit of frustration which underpinned the day and took away enjoyment from it.. -Their height measuring was all over the place. My brother has been 1.1m since about April/May, probably about 113/4cm now; so well over in context. Got him quickly measured at the start of the day (he was over 1.1m) in hope of getting a wristband saying so, but turns out they only do them for 1m (bit silly given there's a few rides reliant on that restriction, but okay). Went to Cobra; he was very clearly under the height stick. By a good 2-3cm. Standing up straight, etc etc, but very clearly under the bar. At the ride entrance, he was borderline. So, after doing more rides, popped to guest services to see what's what. Height checked again, clearly over, get a manager to sign a wristband confirming he's 1.1m. Try our luck with Magma. Had a bit of wait, get the front. Once again, my brother is under the height stick (and yet closer than he was at Cobra!). Try explaining we've had management confirm his height, but point blank refusal. At this point it's becoming obvious there's no consistency with their height sticks. Another trip to guest services to explain, another manager measures and confirms his height to be above 1.1m. Now says that for any future rides we have problems, get the operator to call so-and-so a person and they'll confirm to let us on. Problem sort of solved I guess, but in a way which undermines staff at the ride (if I was in that situation, I'd be feeling pretty uncomfortable). Further problems happened later in the day on one of the Peppa Pig rides, showing that my brother was again under 1.1m at the entrance according to the height stick, but over 1.1m according to the restriction board and the height stick before going onto the ride. This was a particular issue as the restriction determined whether he had to ride alone or with an adult. In fairness, all our issues were resolved and most staff handled it well. But this was an incredibly frustrating issue which underpinned the day and caused a lot of it to be wasted. Another, more minor, thing: pricing. Damn Paultons are cheeky. The food places in Peppa Pig World are more expensive than the rest of the park. Literally the same food is more expensive; we're talking less than 50p extra, but still. Left a bit of a sour taste in my mouth when I noticed, and feels very sly. So, rants out the way, the rest of the park: -Lost Kingdom is a great area. Little rough round the edges, but well done with perfect rides for the park. -Peppa Pig World hits the bullseye for what it aims to do. And with a very good selection of rides for kids. -I didn't quite realise before my visit how expansive their zoo was. However, I really enjoyed it. -Outside of Peppa and Lost Kingdom, the park feels rather tacky. I know a lot of that hasn't been touched in recent years, but it's very jarring. -Operations were okay. Some rides felt very slow and had very weird loading procedures which felt very inefficient. Some rides had very inaccurate queue times (one Peppa ride we queued for advertised a 45min queue when it was 10min..). Bit of a shame. Overall, had a nice time, though hurt a bit by the frustrations of height measuring, which impacted the day a fair amount. My brother enjoyed everything he did and really loved Lost Kingdom (despite not being 'in' to dinosaurs). One thing to note is how busy the park was. Peppa was RAMMED all day, queues advertised at greater than 30mins for everything pretty much all day. The rest of the park was rather quiet; didn't see or wait for anything above 15mins. A very jarring situation which felt like we were in two different parks. For all of Paultons' development and successes, you wonder just how reliant they still are on Peppa right now. Final note on Tornado Springs: construction looks alright. They have a radio loop playing alongside the advertising boards which is a good touch. Very much looking forward to that, as I'm sure that'll give an indication for the quality of things to come, and whether they'll be a 'nice park which is rough round the edges' or a genuine threat against Merlin.

Zadra opens this Thursday:

If Annual Passholders keep going back and riding it, does it really matter what they do to the experience any more? 🤷‍♂️

Storm Chaser's queue is partially complete... https://twitter.com/Lawrence_Mancey/status/1162351227373522944

For a recent example, Untamed cost €12m. Assuming a ground-up RMC would cost more, and then take into account Merlin inflating prices, a brand new RMC would probably be slated to cost between the £18-20m mark. Hardly cheaper than a 'big' manufacturer. Sure, Freespins would be a nice idea, but they'd be pretty low down on my list of rides I'd like to see go to Thorpe (or Towers really). It wasn't too long ago the idea of one them (or a similar-ish Intamin Zac Spin) would have been shot down for being ridiculous, due to their average throughput. Now it feels like that option would be brilliant because it's something. It definitely is. Alton did that with B&M in the 90s to be fair. Six Flags seem to have done it with RMC. But for every successful partnership, they'll be unsuccessful ones. Sure it's not coaster-related, but Merlin/Simworx is a prime example. Parque Reunidos work closely with Gerstlauer, but they've gotten very little out of it. It's a gamble, especially with smaller manufacturers, so it doesn't always pay off.

Thorpe went for a smaller and cheaper manufacturer for DBGT in Simworx. But Thorpe asked too much and Simworx over-promised (and had to get in multiple other manufacturers making it a cocktail of technology which didn't really mix). It doesn't matter what manufacturer you go for, it matters what brief you give them and how much money you put into it. With RMC's popularity ever-soaring, their prices will be going up. They're definitely not a 'small' or 'cheap' manufacturer these days. Exactly the same as with Vekoma, for example: rides like Lech cost £4m, but now they're charging significantly more for the new style rides because demand has increased. S&S's track record hardly does much for them. Few of their coasters have been trouble-free (even Steel Curtain had construction issues). If Thorpe went for a coaster from them, if..or rather, when..a problem came about, they'd be slammed for being cheap. It's simple: you get what you pay for.

Thorpe was incredibly busy today, long queues and what seemed to be a lot of people at guest services at the end of the day complaining about the reduced opening hours...

Night time video too, with what appears to be one person on the front row riding it:

?

Heh, nice. Looks like it could be a copy of Baa Express at Europa? Nice little investment for the park tbh. Good to see, and I'm sure it'll work for the park. Woo.

Yes, this is true. The reasons include: -A decrease in visitors compared to 2011. Despite the fact that 2011 was one of Thorpe's busiest and most profitable (and so, in that sense, 'best') years ever, Swarm still had to deliver an increase. It didn't, so Merlin saw Swarm as a failure, and immediately lost faith in whatever their thought process was behind that direction. -Weak brand. Swarm didn't capture people's imagination. It was very generic and not very recognisable. The end of the world vibe was overdone and it merged in with so many other things that went for that. -Experience didn't match marketing. For one reason or another, people expected an intense thrill ride, similar to Saw. Instead, Swarm offered a much more graceful experience, leading people to be disappointed. So basically, people had minor niggles about the ride, and less people visited Thorpe (which would have happened regardless). So, Merlin see it as a failure. Despite that, in the long term it's done a good job, is less generic these days and scores very highly in KPI scores, which Merlin love. So it's been a slow burner. But Merlin's model doesn't allow for slow burners. Just a couple more to add: Derren Brown's Ghost Train Going for a dark ride over a coaster was always a risk, but it was one which needed to be done in my opinion. Sadly, DBGT missed every single possible mark, which really damaged the park. It did attract attention, and it did cause attendances to rise. But it damaged the park's reputation by so much more than the worth of a few thousand visitors. Two big investments in a row that failed is a big recipe for disaster. You need a sure-fire win after that; something with minimal risk. But when everything is spiralling downwards, the pressure is even great, and the amount of risk you take has to decrease. Ultimately it leaves us in the situation we're in now: the best way to minimise risk is to not take a risk at all. Can't lose money if you don't spend money, right? Terrible Non-Big Investments You have to go all the way back to 2007 when the park added a solid non-big investment, in Flying Fish. Arguments can be made for Storm Surge (diversifies the line up and added a much needed family ride) and Walking Dead (a solid scary-themed indoor attraction at the end of the day). I guess you could say 2013 with turning X forwards but that slipped under the radar with the focus on Swarm backwards. But I think Flying Fish is the last one where someone would struggle to come up with a reasonable negative for it. Since then, we've had short term investments, based off fads or needless IPs, which have led to a mish-mash of identities and ideas, and nothing which has really improved the line up. This is coupled with a lack of general upkeep in the existing parts of the park. The bare minimum was done to rides, theming, presentation, etc., which eventually led to rides closing, theming being taken away, etc. Focusing too much on Scares Fright Nights works for the park. Regardless of its quality, it's still the busiest, best received, and most profitable time of year for the park, year in year out. The park tried to capitalise on that and make it work all year round (which, in fairness, isn't too unreasonable). It worked with Saw - The Ride, because that was handled properly. Saw Alive was a nice idea and helped absorb the busyness whilst it was full time. After that, Thorpe should have quit whilst they were ahead. Scare attractions don't work outside of Halloween in a theme park setting. Scary stuff doesn't work outside of Halloween in a theme park setting. One thing to compliment a line up, yes. But an overarching focus on it? No. Yet Thorpe didn't realise this. They didn't learn that in 2005 when Freakshow 3D was dead during summer because no one cared. They didn't learn that after Saw Alive's popularity dwindled in 2012. They didn't learn after Swarm. They didn't learn after Ghost Train. They probably haven't learnt after The Year of The Walking Dead. Keep scares for Fright Nights, and focus on a diverse line up. Not Learning Lessons Related to above, Thorpe make the same mistakes again and again. This likely comes down to management seemingly being a revolving door, especially in more recent years. A new person comes in, tries something, it doesn't work, leave. A new person comes in, tries that same thing in a different disguise, it doesn't work, leave. Repeat. They need to take a step back, look at what they've done for the past 15 years and realise what hasn't worked, and what has worked, and start building from that.

I wouldn't call it 'truly shocking'. Plenty of mid-sized parks out there adjust their opening times throughout the year to reflect how busy they are, including reducing them. It's not good obviously, and a sign of how the park are struggling. No doubt the weather at the start of the summer holidays hasn't helped with attendance, but surely with the weather now likely to be more normal for the rest of summer, it's time to recuperate and stay open longer when the crowds will be around. The back-end of summer is always busier, and reducing opening hours just feels like a shot in the foot.

I do wonder how much of the Loggers station they'll be able to utilize. If they can use most of it, it gives a solid amount of space to play with given they've got the undercover queue area too. Be nice for them to start pushing it a bit more now to try and gain more attention. Summer so far feels quiet so a big push for Fright Nights feels needed now more than ever (feel like I've said that before..)