Ian-S

Wow, stunned at the ignorance that reeks in this topic. As someone who has ADHD, I'm quite offended by Altitude's posts...but I won't take it personally and at least most people are understanding
Unfortunately, there is still a lot of ignorance and misunderstanding surrounding ADHD (and I know that with a lot of people it's not intentional - as others here have pointed out, it can be hard to understand mental health conditions unless you have personal experiences with it). Poor media - such as TV documentaries that only show extreme cases and are advertised as programs about "naughty children" - doesn't help. Thankfully, there are plenty of blogs and websites which are informative and give real, personal accounts of what it's like living with ADHD.
There is so much I want to say and luckily, most of it can be said through this image:

Also to add to that: sensory processing disorder. Something which can occur in people with ADHD as well as those on the autism spectrum, and would make queueing at a theme park extremely difficult.
Difficulty with social interaction/peer rejection due to their behaviour and struggling to follow/keep up with conversations.
The difficulties with regulating emotions and sensory processing can cause overwhelm, which can sometimes lead to meltdowns. And somewhere like a theme park can sometimes be over-stimulating for them.
Treatment can help ADHD, but it isn't a cure and they may still have difficulties queueing.
So yeah, there is a LOT more to it than just the diagnostic symptoms. I personally haven't had issues with queueing because of ADHD, no doubt because of my love of theme parks and how in awe I felt as a child when I visited. But I can fully understand how it could cause issues for other people.
Oh and by the way - the evidence that a guest needs to show in order to get the RAP needs to be dated within 6 months. So I couldn't just go with my diagnosis letter from 2011 and get a pass, for example. This means that either they need a recent letter from a consultant, ie a diagnostic report, or a report/letter which they may have through having regular appointments or ongoing treatment, or a letter written by a doctor specifically stating how/why they are unable to queue. Not sure when this came into place, but it's how it is currently, and I know that it hasn't always been this way; it used to just be a letter/report from a doctor/consultant etc (plus they no longer accept DLA letters for RAPs, unless it's the high rate). And no, it's certainly not a "perk" and people aren't being "rewarded"! Are people here for real??

^^ This....
 
If The Smiler reopens under the same name Alton Towers will no doubt be criticized and called insensitive, if they rename it then they will still get criticism - probably accusations of trying to cover something up etc

The aim is not to be a perk but to make queueing bearable for sufferers of mental or physical illness who cannot queue

This guy?
http://www.theladbible.com/articles/this-lad-s-attempt-at-getting-a-thorpe-park-fast-track-pass-seriously-backfired

This guy?
http://www.theladbible.com/articles/this-lad-s-attempt-at-getting-a-thorpe-park-fast-track-pass-seriously-backfired

The abuse comes when someone has the band who doesn't need it and can queue, they use the pass then while they wait for their next pass use to be allowed they queue in a normal queue. They are then effectively queuing for two rides at once and will pretty much get twice as much done as a person not using it. It obviously can't really be abused by people who are genuinely unable to queue!
 
It really doesn't take long at a park to notice a not unsubstantial amount of people abusing it in exactly this way.

The first one is a generalisation as to the opinion you expressed as being similar to those expressed by the majority of people, who in turn make the disabled feel a burden, it is not saying you are ignorant, if I wanted to say that, I would have said, you are ignorant.
Ignorant means lacking in knowledge, it is not a term used to create offence, I'm not a brain surgeon so a brain surgeon would be well within their rights to call me ignorant of the procedures of brain surgery, and he would be absolutely correct in his assumption but it's not something I'd get offended at, he's 100‰ correct. If we were to get really technical, then yes, I used the term to describe your comments which were similar to those reflected by others, but this should also be taken into the context in which it was used, you had expressed a lot of opinions as to how the RAP system works and said some rather nasty and condesending things about people with mental illness (paraphrasing you said why should a person with ADHD get to the front of the queue because their brain lining is thin and they a impatient, they should find something to do to occupy themselves instead of jumping the queue etc.), so in a way, saying your views exhibited ignorance, was absolutely correct, plus I am not the only one to say this about your comments, so I'm not sure why you have singled me out as the perpetrator.
There is a difference between saying someone's opinion on a particular subject is a bit ignorant or shows ignorance and saying that they are an ignorant person as a whole, I said the former and this is very different to saying you are an ignorant person totally.
The second one I'm totally lost as to how you think that I am saying you are a narrow minded git, first off the comment wasn't even direced at you, it was in answer to toofpik's question about whether I would or have given up my seat for an able bodied person, at no time did I say, Altitude is an ignorant narrow minded git, now if I'd have said that, you'd be every right to get upset over it, but that's not what I said.
What I said was that I am old enough to know there's more to life than being a narrow minded git like the other person in the queue who had told the girls to f*** off just because they selfishly wanted to ride that exact train instead of waiting 30 seconds, the final comment was a bit of humour to the effect of saying 'but given the conversation of the last few pages, Altitude may well disagree and think that I am a narrow minded git'.
At no time did I call you arrogant either, I don't even think anybody in the thread has even used the word other than yourself.
I hope we can now put this behind and move on, if you still think I called you an ignorant, arrogant narrow minded selfish git (or whatever it was), then there's nothing I or anybody else can say that will convince you otherwise.
Now, again, can we please hear your ideas for making the RAP system better?

Stop posting such common sense.

An argument on TPM...
...and it's nothing to do with me! 
 
My opinion is that it doesn't matter whether people have a physical or mental disability, if they cannot queue then that's that.

The wheelchair comments in the second post are pretty ignorant, that's why I posted it up...
 
Also this line:
 
 
It does reek of absolute ignorance and a general dismissive tone towards those unfortunate to have it...
 
At the end of the day it's still a mental illness, and to refer to Paige's post, people act differently with whatever might be wrong with them, those people who tend to have the lighter end of the spectrum don't usually use the RAP system, but there should always be a system in place for those people who might not be able to withstand the queue, and that's exactly the role of the RAP...

The thing with all this is that, regardless of whether it's a physical or a mental condition, people would handle or respond to it differently. For instance, I've found myself on crutches a number of times and have generally struggled, whilst a few weeks ago a friend found herself on crutches and managed perfectly well. Now, we both were entitled to the same thing that the school will offer you, yet we utilised different things to fit our personal needs, despite us having what aome may regard as the same issue.
My point is, such a thing shouldn't be determined by and based on whether it's physical or mental, but based on the individual and their needs.

No, he insinuated that you might think he is
Everyone needs to stop looking for personal attacks in these posts

Altitude, I didn't call you ignorant (neither did I call you arrogant, I can post up the definition of both if you want), I said your attitude was typical of the ignorance exhibited by a lots of people (there's a difference), which makes the disabled feel like a burden, sectioning up different disabilities into categories is not going to make the system work any better and could probably end up with the Park being done for Disability Discrimination. Alton and Chessie run a two tier system for able bodied and non-able, but at the ride, the procedure is the same.
 

In other words, in the eyes of the law, there is no such thing as mental or physical disability, the two are categorised simply as a disability.
You (and others) also seemed to be under the impression that the RAP gives the disabled person free fastrack, this is what some of us call ignorance too, I.e. you don't know how the system works, so have assumed how it works in your own head and though that ignorance, assumed wrong, I would hope that by now, nobody here still thinks that is the case (although I see from your last post you still think the RAP is a queuing privilege).
As someone else pointed out, it's extremely difficult to fiddle the system, maybe if there was more than one disabled guest in a party you could swap cards per ride etc. but overall it's harder than you think. Sure there are probably people who get the wristband who shouldn't, but I would imagine there are not as many people doing this as you think too, and of course, even if someone does get the wristband, it still doesn't gain them anything over a normal member of the public who has queued, because they cannot use the wristband again for the length of time that they would have queued for anyway, so I simple don't understand how, considering how many first hand experiences of the system have been conveyed to you in this thread, you still consider that it's some sort of queue jumping facility that gives everybody instant access.
If you have a better way for the system to work, put it here then and those of us who have experienced the system can say whether we think it's a good idea (or whether in fact, the system already does that).
toofpikk, yes I have, many times, usually not for a single person, or two people just wanting their ride quicker, but I have put people in front of me if they are in a group and it will help them, on Friday there was about 8 kids all wanting to ride Rita together, the Batcher put too many people on the platform so there were only six free seats, they asked some others who told them to f*** off (literally) then they asked us and I said sure go ahead, we went on the next train, not an issue for us. I'm no saint, far from it, I'm just old enough to know there's more to life than being a narrow minded selfish git (although Altitude may disagree lol).

Without sounding harsh, if the dude isn't happy in his job, perhaps he should look elsewhere.....in general the staff at Thorpe Park are pretty chirpy though I've had the odd one or two who have come across a bit meh, they might have been having a bad day but in any job where you are in contact with the general public, grumpiness doesn't tend to go down well

To be fair, unless you have experienced mental health problems, either first hand or if you are close to someone that has problems then you can't fully understand the impact that these problems have on day to day life.
I wouldn't even try to imagine how debilitating it must be to have a physical disability because I don't have one personally.  I think the point being made is that whether you have a physical disability or a mental health related one, people should be treated equally.
 
As mentioned before - the disabled access pass is not a fastrack - disabled people don't get to skip queues all day, they have allocated times to arrive at rides.  Of course there are people that are going to abuse the system but sadly, such is life.
 
Queuing might seem like a simple procedure in principal but in reality not everyone is able to stay in a long queue for whatever reason - and everyone has the right as a guest to theme parks, to experience the rides etc.

This is the kind of ignorance that makes disabled people feel like a burden on society, nobody said anything about the pens being emptied.
I won't go into detail but I gave up my seat on Nemesis last Friday for a disabled kid and his mum and it didn't make me feel the slightest bit discriminated against, but it made that kids day for the sake of me waiting another 30 seconds. If you got your way that kid would never get the opportunity to experience a rollercoaster and nobody should be prevented from enjoying something because thy have an invisible disability.

This is the kind of ignorance that makes disabled people feel like a burden on society, nobody said anything about the pens being emptied.
I won't go into detail but I gave up my seat on Nemesis last Friday for a disabled kid and his mum and it didn't make me feel the slightest bit discriminated against, but it made that kids day for the sake of me waiting another 30 seconds. If you got your way that kid would never get the opportunity to experience a rollercoaster and nobody should be prevented from enjoying something because thy have an invisible disability.

I can definitely vouch for the fact that a lot of people with mental illnesses are a lot more challenging than those with physical ones, coming from someone who works with disabled people on a daily basis.

I suffer from extreme anxiety and I'm on anti-D's and beta-blockers to help reduce this, but sometimes it gets so bad that I freak out even in shops if someone comes too close. Luckily for me, as I know Thorpe very well and have someone who can put up with my anxiety I don't freak out unless someone pushes infront or gets too close to me. Unfortunetely, in other situations (such as gigs and festivals) I have major panic attacks, I actually got lifted over Reading fest barriers last year because I was screaming and crying. I can empathise with those who do have anxiety and can definitely understand how they'd feel queueing up for a ride which itself can build up anxiousness (even if you are used to them). Like it's been noted above there is a system and there are restrictions. For people with ADHD and autism etc they probably resort to having a pass to not only make sure they feel comfortable, but those around them in the queue are comfortable. Just because it's not there visually doesn't mean it's not there

The same reason as people with physical conditions should, they have something that prevents them from being able to queue/stand/be in large group of people for a long time.

Harsh. He's not saying all users, he's not tarring all with the same brush, but to think this does not happen on quite a large scale takes an unacceptable level of naivety. Its not those with any genuine need that he's commenting on. Abusable system in getting abused shocker.
I'm sure the vast majority of users of the systems in place would not want preferential treatment for people to resent. I'm sure a system where they wait an equal amount of time but elsewhere would be welcomed by nearly everyone using it for the right reasons.
It's not wrong to say this.

It's people like you that are keeping the world in the dark ages when it comes to mental illnesses. Shame on you.

I know the trains aren't ready, it just seems ludicrous to open at all without scenic being open. 

Hey Ian,
Will readily hold my hands up in that one, I should of PMd you my contact details but must admit, when I was running around last minute you slipped the radar this time round as I know you were with your family and would 'say hi if you spot us' so in my head everything was dealt with. Which wasn't as you would still need them just in case.
So please accept my apology on that one and hope they'll be another opportunity in the future.
(PM sent for future reference)