How Many Trains?

[Tom]

I'm jealous of your lack of Colossus queueing. I queued at least 25 minutes today!

[Ricky]

Oh, and another of the "Thorpe can do no wrong" boys joins in. I won't be carrying on this discussion in this forum.

That's because you know Marc and I's common knowledge is correct. I dont back the park up in everything, I said from the start Saw Alive would be the worst attraction the park has invested 500k in and I still stand by that cos I stand right.

[James6]

Ok Even though it's not just me who have expressed the same opinion as myself, your still right. :PAnd ugh, really will be the last time now.

[Marc]

To be honest we are all aloud an opinion, neither of us are right or wrong.. If we all had the same opinion the world would be a very boring place

[Ricky]

Ok Even though it's not just me who have expressed the same opinion as myself, your still right. :PAnd ugh, really will be the last time now.

How old are you? or are you blinded by 'I'm a fanboy they have to please me'ism? ITS A BLOODY BUSINESS they have an objective to make as much money, they aint guna lose money they do not need to.

[James6]

:)So you've just been undermined by the "top dog" of this site, and your still determined that your right?And yes... I'm the fanboy, all the people I talk to regularly know how much I love the place That's why I've been Thorpe twice this year, and Alton and Chessington 10+ times each. Can't believe I've just been called a fanboy, because I'm disagreeing with how the park was run on this occasion, that's a new one...

[MikeyT]

If I'm being honest, it's probably people that have similar views to Ricky that are running Thorpe Park :)Nah, in all seriousness, yes, the parks make money and if you strip everything back to the bare bones of business, everything boils down to money and they're there to make as much profit as they can.However, you need to keep your guests happy; you need to provide an excellent service so that people return again, recommend a visit to other people and ultimately spend more money at the parks. I would totally accept it if there was a 10/ 15 minute wait with one train, any more though, it does get frustrating for guests. One of the big KPI sectors that the parks seek to improve is "queueing spoilt my day". As a nation we really hate queueing, even though we're good at it, and even a short wait can become tiresome for many people. Annoyed guests will be much less likely to return and recommend the park to others; this means less money in the long run.I'll use Chessington as an example- back in 2007, a few of the smaller rides were "dual operated", which meant that one operator would work one ride for a short time, then close it and move to another ride close by. This was obviously a budget cut enforced by Tussauds back in the day. When Merlin reviewed the operations in 2008, they realised that they were actually doing more harm than good, so they gave the extra budget to have the extra staff.Getting people to visit the parks is one thing, getting them to return and keep visiting is another.

[ThrillSeekerMatt]

All I'm saying about the forum is that it's impossible to come here anymore where it seems I'm free to have an opinion or debate about something, without someone coming to me and reading one park regulation or another and generally doing the parks job for them.

Amen to that.I honestly think Thorpe should stop cutting corners here. They know how much a ride costs to run every day at full capacity, and they are perfectly capable of running 2 trains on each ride, every day. It's just shameless money grabbing!If there was a queue of about 10 people then of course it would be sensible for them to run one train, I realise thay will want to save money when they can, but to make people queue needlessly for 20 minutes is simply ridiculous! Theme park tickets cost a lot of money, and customers should expect the best value for their money, no matter when they visit. It's not fair to start cutting corners and giving customers a shoddy service just because it's not high season.

[Ricky]

Amen to that.I honestly think Thorpe should stop cutting corners here. They know how much a ride costs to run every day at full capacity, and they are perfectly capable of running 2 trains on each ride, every day. It's just shameless money grabbing!If there was a queue of about 10 people then of course it would be sensible for them to run one train, I realise thay will want to save money when they can, but to make people queue needlessly for 20 minutes is simply ridiculous! Theme park tickets cost a lot of money, and customers should expect the best value for their money, no matter when they visit. It's not fair to start cutting corners and giving customers a shoddy service just because it's not high season.

Obvioulsy you havent been on a day like it was today. it's not money grabbing its common knowledge you will find it when you drive too on a motorway you will petrol significantly more expensive then a station not on the motor. In this case they know their target market are going to have money they need to make money as do the produces for example Picsolve need to make a profit as does thorpe park. Again, Coke-cola co. need to make a profit they sell for one price you sell for an other no point selling it at 60p a bottle and make no profit. It's how a business will work always have done, and always will do!

[MikeyT]

As a final thought from the overall impression I got from people....I'd like to just point out that whilst it can feel as though you cannot voice your opinion here about anything; be that in the Thorpe, Chessie, Alton or other sub-forums across the site, it shouldn't be that way at all.The whole point of discussion and debate is that people are entitled to challenge other people's opinions in the correct way. If you're arguing your point in the correct way (taking the word argue as a civilised way of writing) then you are adding to the discussion that's constructive and can be really interesting to read the different opinions, even if it can be frustrating if people don't always agree with you. It can undoubtedly become heated at times but it's important to remember that they are people's opinions and ultimately we must respect them, as much as it could pain for us to do so.Also, although it can seem that way, we're not here as a marketing tool. Everything that has been said has been our own personal opinions and honestly not connected to the park in any way, shape or form. Some people prefer to voice their negative comments elsewhere; ie- via formal communication with the park.

[Rich]

A business is a business!!! On quiet days at Paultons Park we open the rides from 10.30am - 4.30pm, so thats already saving money on rides wages! We don't open Edge & Raging River Ride till 12pm due to them both using a lot of power and it's not cost effective to have them running from 10.30am when at 12pm they will both be walk on anyway! Some of the smaller rides are run 2 rides between one to again save wages and the fact there is NO need to have an operator at each ride when they won't be doing much! E.g. Seal Falls & Digger Ride run togeather as does Magic Carpet & Flying Saucer, Dragons Roundabout & Ladybird Ride, Go Karts & Rabbit Ride, Jumping Bean & Jumping Jack. If it is really quiet then Kontiki & Teacups will run togeather! Cobra runs with 3 cars instead of 5, that means the other 3 are in the workshop and can have work done to them as well!For all you know regarding Stealth, Colossus and Nemesis Inferno, they could actually be having their Annual Inspection on the trains so it's one less thing to do over closed season! E.g. stripping down one carriage a day on a train and inspecting the wheels and hubs for damage and if needed, replace them, this over the course of 2-3 weeks (Septemeber when it's quiet just after the busy period) is enough time to get it done and at least they don't have to do the trains during closed season!!

[Mark9]

Very interesting debate. I'll put it to you a few things. People seem very hung up on people not able to waltz onto rides willy nilly whilst the staff struggle to fill seats. To be honest, I don't actually think 20 minutes is to much when you are talking about a parks main rides. With the gate figures as low as they are, the park wouldn't see it as financially viable to run all three of its major coasters on two trains. People have been using Alton Towers as an example, but that really is the exception when it comes to empty parks. I mean, even Europa Park only had two trains on Silverstar during my visit, and it had a half an hour queue.I can completely understand why they'd use the quiet period to have trains off, as Rich said they are probably doing some maintenance on them. Cause afterall, the parks about to go into its busiest period of the year and it wouldn't want to have problems with trains when there are so many more people ready and waiting to moan...

[D4n]

The bottom line is, if Thorpe want to compete with Towers for the spot as the UK's No.1 theme park, the first thing they need to do is run rides at maximum capacity, even on quiet days. The only way that I could accept 1 train operation is if it was walk-on on that one train.

I mean, even Europa Park only had two trains on Silverstar during my visit, and it had a half an hour queue.

Oh, and because Europa Park does it, that makes it OK, does it? (Although that is very unlike Europa, to be honest, I'd assume that there was a problem with the 3rd train).

Cobra runs with 3 cars instead of 5, that means the other 3 are in the workshop and can have work done to them as well!

Paulton's Park is a small, independently run theme park which NEEDS to save money wherever it can. Thorpe is run by the 2nd biggest theme park company in the world. There's a difference. ;)

[Rich]

Air Dan the principle is STILL THE SAME!!! Nemesis at Alton is on ONE train, AIR is on two trains with ONE station, Oblvion is on ONE station operation....Lets go to Chessington, I expect Vampire is running 1-2 trains whilst one is taken off at a time for maintenance and the fact it doesn't need 3, I bet Rattlesnake isn't running that many cars, I also bet Fury is on 5 cars....Legoland I expect Dragon Coaster is on 1-2 trains... get the message? And Thorpe used to open and I don't know wether they still do it, but they used to on quiet days have Slammer & Samurai opening at 11. All the water rides opening at 11 as well....As I said, the principle is the same, get your facts before you come up with a stupid excuse like "Paulton's Park is a small, independently run theme park which NEEDS to save money wherever it can. Thorpe is run by the 2nd biggest theme park company in the world. There's a difference. "Thanks!!P.s. it's Paultons not Paulton's

[Ryan]

These posts have been moved from trip report topic, enjoy discussing

[JoshC.]

How old are you? or are you blinded by 'I'm a fanboy they have to please me'ism? ITS A BLOODY BUSINESS they have an objective to make as much money, they aint guna lose money they do not need to.

I find it very ironic how you pull the business card yet in the 2011 topic you say "This is The Nations Thrill Capital. We would prefer a forceful flat ride or small intense coater. not Depth Charge in a round dinghy that twists." So, if the park "aint guna lose money they do not need to", then why would would spend money on a forceful flat when they'll be just a successful for getting the cheap round dinghies?

For all you know regarding Stealth, Colossus and Nemesis Inferno, they could actually be having their Annual Inspection on the trains so it's one less thing to do over closed season! E.g. stripping down one carriage a day on a train and inspecting the wheels and hubs for damage and if needed, replace them, this over the course of 2-3 weeks (Septemeber when it's quiet just after the busy period) is enough time to get it done and at least they don't have to do the trains during closed season!!

In my eyes, this is the only reasonable 'excuse' the park can have. To be honest, I wouldn't put it down to laziness - I'd put it down to maintenance (this of course without knowing the real reason). But just letting a queue build on one train makes the queuing experience worse, and decreases guest satisfaction - one of the key priorities of any theme park!

And Thorpe used to open and I don't know wether they still do it, but they used to on quiet days have Slammer & Samurai opening at 11. All the water rides opening at 11 as well....As I said, the principle is the same, get your facts before you come up with a stupid excuse like "Paulton's Park is a small, independently run theme park which NEEDS to save money wherever it can. Thorpe is run by the 2nd biggest theme park company in the world. There's a difference. "Thanks!!P.s. it's Paultons not Paulton's

Thorpe used to, when they were a lot quieter. I doubt they do that any more, or only do it rarely. As for the second comment there, excuse me? What facts has Dan not got exactly? And Paultons is a very different park to Thorpe - comparing the two on operations is like comparing Waitrose to a small, simple non-chained supermarket. The business card that people pull always annoys me. Yes, the park is a business. But does that mean they have to compromise guest satisfaction? No.

[Rich]

I understand they are different BUT THEY BOTH HAVE THE SAME INTENTIONS!!! They are BOTH businesses, they are BOTH quiet, they WILL BOTH save money, Why won't fanboys understand the concept of saving money, if they didn't some parks would crippled and their future devlopments won't be as big!

[JoshC.]

Here's a question for everyone...How much extra would it cost to run a second on, say Stealth?I've heard Rita's launches cost about 23p, so slightly more than that (I'd assume) to launch Stealth - and then just the motors in the station? For guest satisfaction to be increased, is it really that much more of a cost? I'd say no..

[Rich]

Josh, you don't get the point at all do you???????They will be doing ANNUAL MAINTANENCE on the trains, this means they don't have to do it over christmas which is one less thing to do which means the ride may actually be ready for opening, It makes perfrect logical sense!!

[D4n]

Air Dan the principle is STILL THE SAME!!! Nemesis at Alton is on ONE train, AIR is on two trains with ONE station, Oblvion is on ONE station operation....

Umm... no they're not. Nemesis is currently on 2 trains, Air was on 2 trains for a period of time whilst the 3rd train was getting fixed, and is now back on 3 trains / 2 stations, Oblivion may be loading 1 car at a time but it's walk-on anyway (as I said previously, I have no problems with reduced capacity if the ride is still walk-on.).

[JoshC.]

Josh, you don't get the point at all do you???????They will be doing ANNUAL MAINTANENCE on the trains, this means they don't have to do it over christmas which is one less thing to do which means the ride may actually be ready for opening, It makes perfrect logical sense!!

Firstly, any need for all the question marks - just looks immature. Secondly, if you read back, you'll realise the VERY FIRST thing I said regarding this matter was thinking it was regarding maintenance. Quote is here:

I wonder if they only want to operate on one train to help ensure that they don't have issues on any major coasters for FN; which would be even worse?

Finally, what has that point got to do with your main point about saving money during the season?

[James6]

Wow, you either agree or disagree on this topic, very much a marmite subject. I am finding some of the arguments put forward by some members, quite honestly, laughable... By people I respected too.So, Rich, how do you know that without any shadow of a doubt, they are 100% doing maintenance on every ride not running at full capacity? Oh and wasn't the whole point of Stealth having 3 trains, so that Annual Maintenance can be carried out whilst the ride still runs at full capacity?

[Rich]

I work at a park, I know what they are doing, it makes perfect logical business sense. The rides are virtually walk on anyway, they will be working on one carriage at a time, doing a complete service.Also Alton is busier than Thorpe so it wouldn't surprise me. Anyone ever actually thought why Submission only runs one side when both are fully working? Yeah exactly! No real big queues for it, pointless having both sides running and more staff costs!

[AstroDan]

I will add my two pence here.I used to work at Alton Towers on the former Team Rita. Unless there was literally a walk-on situation, then the ride would always run on two trains. If there was an inadequate number of people to fill both trains, then one train would run with front row availability only - so to keep the front row moving. As soon s the queue was more than about 2 trains wait, then the other train would be fully opened. They same tended to apply on Corkscrew unless the ride was literally walk on. Case in point - I visited Alton Towers on Sunday. It was VERY quiet - under 8,000 guests I would say which for Alton is dead. Nemesis had a 5 minute wait and was running 2 trains all day. Air had a 3-craft service with a 10 minute wait also. In fact it was almost walk on at one stage. Spinball operated 6 cars (could run up to 7) and Oblivion was also on double bay loading - although the ride still has a high capacity on one bayload. Th13teen was also running 3 trains with a 15 minute queue. These are all very short queues, but high throughputs were maintained to give guests the shortest queue time. It's also boring as HELL for staff on one train!Alton Towers are actually one of the best parks worldwide I have been to for running rides on good throughputs - it really is one of their strong points. When I went to Florida, many rides were running only 1 or 2 trains when they could have been running more. Thorpe have never seemed to place emphasis on such things.And "Annual Maintainence" on Stealth trains NOW? What?!

[D4n]

Also Alton is busier than Thorpe so it wouldn't surprise me. Anyone ever actually thought why Submission only runs one side when both are fully working? Yeah exactly! No real big queues for it, pointless having both sides running and more staff costs!

Submission's second arm doesn't work, and hasn't for years. It's being used for spare parts since the company that manufactured it (Chance I think?) went bust, so they can't get new parts.

I work at a park, I know what they are doing, it makes perfect logical business sense. The rides are virtually walk on anyway, they will be working on one carriage at a time, doing a complete service.

Yes. Because 30 minutes is virtually walk-on.