Matt N

Interesting times!
 
Didn’t expect it, but great news it’s an indoor attraction.
 
There is quite a lot of room back there isn’t there?
I’d absolutely LOVE for this to be the next secret weapon coaster - something along the lines of Revenge of the Mummy at Universal would be the dream but who knows!
The timescales feel right for the SW cogs to be turning.
 
A flying theatre or other type would be cool too though.
 
I can’t see the Dungeons sticking around - perhaps they could go soon to make more space? That would be a decent space for a secret weapon, and bring some life to a bit of a dead spot  area of the park.
 
interesting times!
 

Hi guys. I have exciting news; it appears that Alton Towers is holding a consultation about building an “indoor attraction” on the former site of the Alton Mouse, within Coaster Corner (the area behind World of David Walliams):
Those “in the know” apparently think that this is to be the next Secret Weapon.
 
I’ve got to say, I think this is brilliant news! A new indoor attraction will definitely add some variety to Alton Towers’ lineup, which should hopefully allay recent concerns about the park lacking filler rides! With this being in/near TWODW, I doubt that it’ll be anything too thrilling, but I think the park needs more middle-ground things with a more universal appeal at present, so I don’t think that really matters myself.

My personal hunch is that this will be a dark ride or some form of indoor family coaster, but I could be wrong there.
 
What are your thoughts?
 
The consultation is on 19th September.
 
Also, just as a note for the moderators, I made a separate topic for this because it’s not confirmed that this is anything to do with SW9 despite the rumours, so I thought I’d better be safe rather than sorry. If you’d rather this be in with the SW9 discussion, though, I apologise.

@Matt N it sounds like this indoor attraction will be an expansion of The World Of David Williams. I would expect a Flying Theatre themed to Grandpa’s Great Escape. My other theory is that the Alton Towers Dungeons are being extended. This could be why work is happening with Nemesis Sub-Terra. My rationale is the Drop Towers could be relocated to the expansion. Many Dungeon attractions have a Drop Tower that simulates a hanging. If Nemesis Sub-Terra had its Drop Towers removed,Alton Towers could add this experience.

Ok so the EA has got back to Thorpe and they are withdrawing their third objection:- 
 

 
https://docs.runnymede.gov.uk/PublicAccess_Live/Document/ViewDocument?id=A9AD7DB3E5854B9686F139BE08E3D049
 
Objections 1 and 2 still remain, however. The only way these could be overcome would be to build the coaster elsewhere in the park which obviously won't happen, especially considering much of the park already lies within floodzone 3b. So now we just have to await the council's decision, whenever that may be.

I love being wrong. 

Definitely the right choice for the park, especially as they’ve needed a medium thrill family coaster for some time and this fills the gap nicely. 
 
Not to mention a decent replacement to the obsolete Raft Racers in pretty much every area. 
 
Let’s hope this gets approved. 

Great addition for the park frankly. I think another family coaster is exactly what they've needed, and this hits the spot pretty much perfectly. It makes the park even more well-rounded and adds some nice diversity to the park too.

Legoland have applied for a “certificate of lawfulness” to determine whether the installation of a duelling roller coaster on the site of Raft Racers is lawful: https://publicaccess.rbwm.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?keyVal=RH6D7GNIMSS00&activeTab=summary
It would appear that the park is planning to install duelling family boomerang-style coasters on the site of Raft Racers.
 
Interestingly, the track design and airgate design in the plans greatly resembles a Zierer Force coaster as opposed to Vekoma’s typical Family Boomerang design, suggesting that there’s a chance that Zierer could be the manufacturer rather than Vekoma. Merlin have worked with Zierer quite a bit in the past when it comes to coasters in Legoland parks, so I wouldn’t be overly surprised if it was a Zierer.
 
I actually think this will be a really good addition to the park! It suits the demographic well, in my opinion, and the duelling factor should ensure that the capacity is fairly decent!

Legoland have applied for a “certificate of lawfulness” to determine whether the installation of a duelling roller coaster on the site of Raft Racers is lawful: https://publicaccess.rbwm.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?keyVal=RH6D7GNIMSS00&activeTab=summary
It would appear that the park is planning to install duelling family boomerang-style coasters on the site of Raft Racers.
 
Interestingly, the track design and airgate design in the plans greatly resembles a Zierer Force coaster as opposed to Vekoma’s typical Family Boomerang design, suggesting that there’s a chance that Zierer could be the manufacturer rather than Vekoma. Merlin have worked with Zierer quite a bit in the past when it comes to coasters in Legoland parks, so I wouldn’t be overly surprised if it was a Zierer.
 
I actually think this will be a really good addition to the park! It suits the demographic well, in my opinion, and the duelling factor should ensure that the capacity is fairly decent!

Potential Spoiler Alert

Went to EPCOT today and took a ride on Guardians Of The Galaxy: Cosmic Rewind. Towards the end of the coaster it did an e-stop (engineer said it was to do with the sensor detecting the train before it was expecting to) and we had to evacuate through the show building.
 
Took some photos with the lights on, thought might be interesting to see. 

I think they don’t really deserve the bad rep when it comes to dark rides.
Not anymore at least.
 
They have clearly tried hard recently to improve the situation. 
- Hex is still absolutely brilliant.
- Skylion is outstanding.
- Griffalo holds up really well.
- Walking Dead, although a bit meh, was an improvement and fairly well done considering it was only a minor project.
- Duel is going to be improved soon.
 
I think one problem is that Merlin very publicly s*** themselves with DBGT though.  A lot of effort and money wasted on a white elephant.  It was however done with good intentions - they set out to achieve a truly great dark ride, but unfortunately missed the mark horribly.
 
I think the reputation is improving tbh.
It’s a lot of the older rides that have been letting the side down.
Duel and Tomb Blaster for example.

In general I would say the offering by Merlin for dark rides isn’t great but I LOVE Hex.  Also really like Flight of The Sky Lion and Bubbleworks (not so keen on Gruffalo).  I wish there were more dark rides to chose from - something like Symbolica at Efteling would be pretty cool to have 

Think I’m going to have to go with Skylion.
 
I mean yes, ok it is basically “Lego Avatar Flight Of Passage”, which I haven’t ridden (yet) at time of writing, but I personally love it. 
 
The attraction is thrilling, immersive and really puts you into a whole different world. I’m so glad they went for this setting than the Lego Movie one. The facade looks great and reminds me a little of Vogel Rock at Efteling and the queue line ain’t too shabby either. 
 
Honourable mention goes to Gruffalo River Adventure, which is fun and a decent rethrme of Professor Drunk’s Bubbleworks. Monster Party is another one to shout at too. 
 
Some Merlin dark rides are definitely better then others. The likes of DBGT are generally poorly executed. I’m yet to ride the ones at Garda and Heide.

I think it was just after that turn where it does the corkscrew.

The park did trial single rider on Saw in 2009, 2010 and maybe even 2011-12 (memory is hazy). In terms of filling up seats, it worked well. It was always a bit of an organisational faff though, since it didn't have the infrastructure set up for it to work.
 
As I understand it, this is something which has been pushed to be tried by some staff for a while. So this is serving as a trial period to see if it works at improving utilisation scores (ie number of seats filled), and how it works from a practical / organisation standpoint. Then maybe they can go from there.
The issue the park will face is the same they have always faced - the majority of the park's rides aren't designed with a single rider queue in place. Really, Stealth is the only one which has the infrastructure to do it properly and not interfere with Fastrack / Ride Access Pass queues and ride exits. The current Exodus plans don't show a single rider queue either (though these can of course be changed).
 
So yeah, hopefully it works, and hopefully longer term the park can implement ways to make single rider queues work properly. But at the same time, it should be stressed this is just a trial, and even if it does go down well, there's no guarantee it will mean it stick.

Sure we love rides but lets face it, the music is the best part of the theme park experience. Rides make up ten or so minutes of the day, music is all round you, encompassing you, selling you the experience. No one has been in that Baron 1898 queue and not hummed along to the tune.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but... you know Nathan Graveson, who teased that he was working on SW9, and who I talked about above?
 
Well, I've been informed that Nathan Graveson is likely to be a troll who tricked people into thinking they were an Intamin designer.
 
If you search "Nathan Graveson Intamin" into Google, the first thing to come up is the profile of a CoasterForce Forum member named Intamin Forever: https://coasterforce.com/forums/members/intamin-forever.47106/about
 
This is relevant because indexed in the search result was an indicator that their forum signature used to say "Nathan Graveson"...
 
The only other vaguely relevant thing to appear was my TowersStreet post talking about them...
 
Also, it was later discovered that VelociCoaster's layout was designed by Keith McVeen, a Universal Creative employee, rather than anyone named Nathan Graveson:
[MEDIA=twitter]1335395925158744068[/MEDIA]
 
From having asked on CF (I genuinely believed this person to be genuine), they apparently have somewhat of a reputation on there for telling tall tales, and it would appear that this was one of those. Because another CFer who knows Merlin employees said that their employee friend checked the Merlin employee database... and no one called Nathan Graveson works for Merlin.
 
Sorry to mislead, folks... it appears my lie detector was broken. I do sincerely apologise...

@Matt N too some a complete reinstallation of the original Haunted House may seem fuddy-duddy. The original incarnation of the Haunted House predates me by 7 years. There’s been many technical advances in my life but in my opinion classic rides like The Haunted House should return. More modern Dark Rides lack character and Theming. Take Professor Burp’s Bubbleworks at Chessington for example. This ride was amazing for all ages with marvellous Theming and Gags. It’s successor The Gruffalo River Ride Adventure is missing all of the above. The ride is 95% TV screens and projections. I’d much rather the 1992 Haunted House return then a cheap and tacky ride with TVs occupy the space. I must confess the Gruffalo River Ride Adventure is far better than Bubbleworks Imperial Leather. Despite this the ride isn’t even an inch on the Professor Burp version.

Hi guys. It's been 4 years since Alton Towers' 8th Secret Weapon, Wicker Man, opened, so I thought SW9 deserved its own speculation thread!
 
I made this thread, however, because we've now had confirmation as good as any that SW9 is well and truly in the pipeline; Nathan Graveson, a designer who worked for Intamin and designed the likes of VelociCoaster, Toutatis and the Parque Warner Madrid launch coaster, has announced that he is now a project director for Merlin Magic Making, and has stated SW9 to be one of MMM's upcoming projects. He said the following, and the bolded explicitly references SW9:
"I also have a massive announcement. Since my recent departure from Intamin as a thrill coaster designer, I have recently been hired by Merlin Magic Making and have officially been made the project director and designer for Alton Towers, Thorpe Park and the Legoland parks. This means I have now moved from just coaster layout design, to full coaster and theming design, which will test my artist qualifications I got at University, all them years ago. When I worked for Intamin I was actually allowed to do some area design as well, so you will see that at Parc Asterix for Toutatis, which I designed the theming for and looking back, I worked closely with Universal Orlando on the Velocicoaster project. I can officially say that the final project that I did for Intamin was the new Batman coaster at Parque Warner Madrid, which I can tell you is the best layout I have done for a coaster, which I look forward for you all to see and ride. So, look out in the future as us at Merlin Magic Making are going to be developing some incredible attractions, Alton Towers' Secret Weapon 9, Thorpe Park's Project Exodus, Chessington' "World of Jumanji", and the various Legoland Projects coming. So I say thank you for the amazing reception to my coaster designs at Intamin and I look forward to your reactions to our future attractions!"
Source: https://towersstreet.com/talk/threads/chessington-world-of-adventures-resort.97/page-293#post-374226
 
So what do we think SW9 might be, then?
 
I'm not really sure myself. I personally reckon it could be some sort of Intamin Blitz Coaster or similar, but I'm not sure whether that's just me saying what I want rather than what I think will happen. Whatever happens, though, I don't think it'll be your typical ride; both Chessington and Thorpe's recent new coaster announcements have certainly been pretty crazy, out-there choices, so I don't see why Alton's wouldn't be the same!
 
But what do you guys think SW9 might be? I'd be really keen to know!

In an interesting development, John Burton (creative lead for Resort Theme Parks) posted this on Twitter yesterday:
Could this be a further hint towards the ride returning to its roots somewhat?

Sorry to reply to a 2 month old post, but I think the illusions and Smiler graphics on the back of the trains were removed in favour of clearer safety signage following the crash. The back of the seat in front where the illusions were is certainly where the safety signage now sits, and I seem to remember that changing after the crash.

In an interesting development, John Burton (creative lead for Resort Theme Parks) posted this on Twitter yesterday:
Could this be a further hint towards the ride returning to its roots somewhat?

Hi guys. It's been 4 years since Alton Towers' 8th Secret Weapon, Wicker Man, opened, so I thought SW9 deserved its own speculation thread!
 
I made this thread, however, because we've now had confirmation as good as any that SW9 is well and truly in the pipeline; Nathan Graveson, a designer who worked for Intamin and designed the likes of VelociCoaster, Toutatis and the Parque Warner Madrid launch coaster, has announced that he is now a project director for Merlin Magic Making, and has stated SW9 to be one of MMM's upcoming projects. He said the following, and the bolded explicitly references SW9:
"I also have a massive announcement. Since my recent departure from Intamin as a thrill coaster designer, I have recently been hired by Merlin Magic Making and have officially been made the project director and designer for Alton Towers, Thorpe Park and the Legoland parks. This means I have now moved from just coaster layout design, to full coaster and theming design, which will test my artist qualifications I got at University, all them years ago. When I worked for Intamin I was actually allowed to do some area design as well, so you will see that at Parc Asterix for Toutatis, which I designed the theming for and looking back, I worked closely with Universal Orlando on the Velocicoaster project. I can officially say that the final project that I did for Intamin was the new Batman coaster at Parque Warner Madrid, which I can tell you is the best layout I have done for a coaster, which I look forward for you all to see and ride. So, look out in the future as us at Merlin Magic Making are going to be developing some incredible attractions, Alton Towers' Secret Weapon 9, Thorpe Park's Project Exodus, Chessington' "World of Jumanji", and the various Legoland Projects coming. So I say thank you for the amazing reception to my coaster designs at Intamin and I look forward to your reactions to our future attractions!"
Source: https://towersstreet.com/talk/threads/chessington-world-of-adventures-resort.97/page-293#post-374226
 
So what do we think SW9 might be, then?
 
I'm not really sure myself. I personally reckon it could be some sort of Intamin Blitz Coaster or similar, but I'm not sure whether that's just me saying what I want rather than what I think will happen. Whatever happens, though, I don't think it'll be your typical ride; both Chessington and Thorpe's recent new coaster announcements have certainly been pretty crazy, out-there choices, so I don't see why Alton's wouldn't be the same!
 
But what do you guys think SW9 might be? I'd be really keen to know!

Natural England have today Withdrawn their objection(s) to project exodus.
 
If I have got this correct, this is separate to the environment agency’s objection which relate more to flooding then anything else.

One less hurdle and hopefully stuff starts to pick up as we reach September.
 
Maybe a sign of things to come….  Or maybe not 😝
 

Looks like the Duel redevelopment could be coming very soon 👀

(via @ThemeParkGuide on Twitter)