Is Alton Still Going To Be No.1 In 5 Years Time?

[eee]

When I say getting to the park for 10, I mean at the gates at 10, not the car park... Regardless, I've never experienced problems of queuing aside from when the Monorail decides to pack itself in for whatever reason...the above kind of proves my point so you mean you get to the car park for 9.30.Oh I can assure you I know how long it takes to get to AT but I don't live in planet optimism I live in planet reality so whilst I accept I can get a good run, hell if I wanted I could roll up on the Ninja in no time, but generally it's pretty crap getting there. Living in stoke I'm sure it's no great hardship for you to get there and no doubt you can take many of your locally known little shortcuts. But the vast majority of people travel from all over so don't have your advantage. Damn, you could nip home for oatcakes at lunch and a pint with Robbie if you wanted. Me I'm stuck with thousands of others at the mercy of Britain's crap roads; hmm maybe merlin run them too. And actually we worked out that you can get to Thorpe from manchester in a little more than an hour longer and then when I get there my car won't be a million miles from the gate.I've been to Thorpe on a very busy day, however due to its nature there is a limit on the number of people they let in, whereas AT just lets them in by the million, and I had no problem. So I agree when Saw opened and broke and opened and broke it would have been pretty awful but are you seriously telling me you haven't been in AT when things break? Hmmm 13 maybe? Rita? It happens, it's a risk we take. I've been at TP when stealth broke virtually all day and there was no tidal wave running and still inferno etc didn't have queues as massive as AT. I have also been to the towers at several times of year but let's face it- it's too spread out, too busy, too remote and not open long enough during the day make up for that. I don't write this as a Towers Hater, I've enjoyed it many times, this is simply the reality as I've found it over the last 2 years or so. But if the fans can't see fault and the casual visitor doesn't know where to put their thoughts then its only going to get worse. Yesterday as we left Thorpe, 6pm in the car for ten past back in manchester for 9.30 (with a stop), we were planning the next trip with excitement. We then talked of AT and considered maybe halloween but then we decide no probably Thorpe again.

[AstroDan]

Thorpe Park like a southern european holidayspot? On a more serious note, as much as Alton isn't having its best ever season, I am very disappointed to read your remarks. I personally find Alton superior to the other parks in Britain. It is a shame though that they appear to have lost your custom and you think that the rides are all pretty poor. I think the park has had issues thus far in 2011, although things are already turning round. The upselling on Towers Street has massively reduced and they've a great marketing campaign underway to galvanize staff and visitors alike. This Halloween, the park will hold its biggest ever Scarefest and the brilliant Fireworks are also making a welcome return.I must question your "fleeced for food" comments. Food at the London Merlin attractions is actually fractionally more expensive.

[Fred]

I have to say, it sounds very much like a "visited towers too often, first time to thorpe" experience there.Majority of the time, the entrance of thorpe takes ages to get into. And it's not like towers.. it's cattlepens. Temporary cattlepens. Temporary which have been there for YEARS. Mmm, lovely entrance .I dunno, visit thorpe enough times and you'd find it boring as well. Everyone I go to thorpe with who live up north love the place, but its the opposite way around if you're down south.I do agree with one point though, towers rides (well, the flats) ARE boring. Thorpe is superior on that front, but thats about it. Food, all you have from thorpe (which is a merlin place) is the mexican, noodles and glasshouse.. all of which is an offering at towers.

[Benin]

Oh I can assure you I know how long it takes to get to AT but I don't live in planet optimism I live in planet reality so whilst I accept I can get a good run, hell if I wanted I could roll up on the Ninja in no time, but generally it's pretty crap getting there. Living in stoke I'm sure it's no great hardship for you to get there and no doubt you can take many of your locally known little shortcuts. But the vast majority of people travel from all over so don't have your advantage. Damn, you could nip home for oatcakes at lunch and a pint with Robbie if you wanted. Me I'm stuck with thousands of others at the mercy of Britain's crap roads; hmm maybe merlin run them too. And actually we worked out that you can get to Thorpe from manchester in a little more than an hour longer and then when I get there my car won't be a million miles from the gate.I've been to Thorpe on a very busy day, however due to its nature there is a limit on the number of people they let in, whereas AT just lets them in by the million, and I had no problem. So I agree when Saw opened and broke and opened and broke it would have been pretty awful but are you seriously telling me you haven't been in AT when things break? Hmmm 13 maybe? Rita? It happens, it's a risk we take. I've been at TP when stealth broke virtually all day and there was no tidal wave running and still inferno etc didn't have queues as massive as AT. I have also been to the towers at several times of year but let's face it- it's too spread out, too busy, too remote and not open long enough during the day make up for that. I don't write this as a Towers Hater, I've enjoyed it many times, this is simply the reality as I've found it over the last 2 years or so. But if the fans can't see fault and the casual visitor doesn't know where to put their thoughts then its only going to get worse. Yesterday as we left Thorpe, 6pm in the car for ten past back in manchester for 9.30 (with a stop), we were planning the next trip with excitement. We then talked of AT and considered maybe halloween but then we decide no probably Thorpe again.

You know you could speak to me in a more acceptable tone... Instead of making silly comments like you think you're talking to a 12 year old... Especially as I don't know any local routes from Stoke as I don't ACTUALLY live there, the only route I know is the signposted one from the M6, so don't assume that I'm totally oblivious to how bad the roads are... I've been to Towers when things break, but since Rita makes no difference to me, and indeed when I went once when Nemesis was broken it still wasn't busy... Maybe I'm just lucky with never actually experiencing these issues that constantly plague you? Difference is that when stuff breaks at Thorpe people don't have to walk further than 2 feet before meeting another coaster, indeed I always find Thorpe busy, narrow, depressing and generally un-exciting... I can go on only 4 rides and be done... Since there's nothing else to do at the park aside from enjoy the company of the general guests... Who are not very nice people (not to say Towers don't get their fair share, but they're easier to avoid)...Then again, I'm as bored and tired of Thorpe as you seem to be of Towers... Indeed because Thorpe is new to you you don't have this vision of it that I do... A barren island full of idiots with a terrible reliablitiy that on more than one trip has made me want to kill myself... Towers never has done that to me...And if you think the fans think the streets are paved with gold, you haven't read TowersTimes...

[AstroDan]

I would stick my head on the line here and say the average wait times at Alton Towers are, overall, less than those at Thorpe Park.

[Mark9]

I would stick my head on the line here and say the average wait times at Alton Towers are, overall, less than those at Thorpe Park.

Agreed with this, at Alton it generally takes quite a while for queues to really start to grow but at Thorpe, the size really works against it so if one ride starts to spill over into another it happens very very fast.See, I'm not sure on this one. Eee uses to comparison to Bolt, well are you going as slowly as a tortoise then because, having been to Alton very few times, arriving at 10:30 at the monorail entrance, waiting for non AP holders to buy tickets, walking slowly off to Oblivion and off to Forbidden Valley without the aid of the Skyride I can still easily get 10 or so rides in without speeding round like Speedy Gonzales. It's not like I'm buying fastrack or using single rider, I'm just taking my time ambling around the park, taking each ride as it comes.Thorpe is the opposite to me. From running out of food on the Ap day at the beginning of this season to having Stealth, Loggers, Slammer and Rumba (With Saw joing them) closed all day on '09 open day, Thorpe has given me enough bad experiences to make me not want to visit again.

[Evey]

I think the long and the short of this argument is do you prefer Alton Towers or Thorpe Park.Being a northern girl I practically spent my childhood in AT and had no wish to journey down south to TP. As I got older, and therefore more picky, I saw more and more problems with AT. Yes, the scenery is lovely. Yes, the majority of the rides are great. Yes, the reliability of rides are better. And yes, sometimes they get the theming right - this is important to me as I still call them theme parks. But the delightful spaces work against it. They let too many people in. This is a bad habit they do all year round and, in my opinion, has gotten worse in the last few years. These big spaces also take up more of your precious park time getting from ride to ride - Bolt or not - you have to admit that sometimes those walks are arduous - and even if you get you Sky Ride I object to queuing for what is, in essence, a transport device. (Don't get me started on the monorail and the crazy hike from the car park to the actual gates.) I have been at multiple times of year from crammed with school kids to random non school holiday weekends and the queue times have been getting more out of hand than ever. The answer is simple - stop being greedy and put a limit on the number of people you let in, Merlin! I am more than capable of planning my way around a park, but 7 rides has been my latest maximum - no ambling and with only 30 mins for lunch.Only in the past few years have I been to Thorpe Park and in all honesty, I found it a breath of fresh air. I was instantly hit with the theming of certain areas - I really enjoy Amity and wish this level could be taken around the rest of the park (I'm still confused by the idea of a volcano plonked in the middle of it all). The rides were a big contrast to AT - but that's a personal thing. The fact that it reasonably compact and you can get around it quickly is a huge plus to me. I was there on the first weekend of the school summer holidays and I was not crammed I was not pushed and there were still places to sit and have a moment of rest should I want it - oh, and the rides times weren't insane - the longest was an hour, which, again in my opinion, is long enough for any ride (my last visit to AT all the major rides had queue times of over 60 mins). Having said all this I was there on the AP holders day at the beginning of the season - it was pretty dire. Rides were out, the park was ridiculously packed and the whole thing just seemed inept. And no, Merlin, after driving down there staying in a premier inn the night before to make sure I wasn't shattered so I could actually have a good day there, a crummy money off voucher with a time limit on it was not an acceptable mea culpa.Both have their draw backs, for me, AT's biggest problem is the huge spaces filled with nothing. TP's is the reliability of the rides. I'm glad we have these two parks engaged in this fight because otherwise they would rest on their laurels and former glory.Right at this moment I'm in Thorpe's corner. visit for visit on the last 5 occasions TP has won hands down and even better - I've actually been able to feel my legs and feet at the end of the day!

[Mark9]

I think the long and the short of this argument is do you prefer Alton Towers or Thorpe Park.

I'd actually argue at the moment it's more "what park have you visited too much in the past." Because the two Northern people seem to prefer Thorpe and the people who've over-done Thorpe are in Alton's corner.I like this sort of discussion though, seeing what people prefer from their parks.

[eee]

I think the long and the short of this argument is do you prefer Alton Towers or Thorpe Park.Being a northern girl I practically spent my childhood in AT and had no wish to journey down south to TP. As I got older, and therefore more picky, I saw more and more problems with AT. Yes, the scenery is lovely. Yes, the majority of the rides are great. Yes, the reliability of rides are better. And yes, sometimes they get the theming right - this is important to me as I still call them theme parks. But the delightful spaces work against it. They let too many people in. This is a bad habit they do all year round and, in my opinion, has gotten worse in the last few years. These big spaces also take up more of your precious park time getting from ride to ride - Bolt or not - you have to admit that sometimes those walks are arduous - and even if you get you Sky Ride I object to queuing for what is, in essence, a transport device. (Don't get me started on the monorail and the crazy hike from the car park to the actual gates.) I have been at multiple times of year from crammed with school kids to random non school holiday weekends and the queue times have been getting more out of hand than ever. The answer is simple - stop being greedy and put a limit on the number of people you let in, Merlin! I am more than capable of planning my way around a park, but 7 rides has been my latest maximum - no ambling and with only 30 mins for lunch.Only in the past few years have I been to Thorpe Park and in all honesty, I found it a breath of fresh air. I was instantly hit with the theming of certain areas - I really enjoy Amity and wish this level could be taken around the rest of the park (I'm still confused by the idea of a volcano plonked in the middle of it all). The rides were a big contrast to AT - but that's a personal thing. The fact that it reasonably compact and you can get around it quickly is a huge plus to me. I was there on the first weekend of the school summer holidays and I was not crammed I was not pushed and there were still places to sit and have a moment of rest should I want it - oh, and the rides times weren't insane - the longest was an hour, which, again in my opinion, is long enough for any ride (my last visit to AT all the major rides had queue times of over 60 mins). Having said all this I was there on the AP holders day at the beginning of the season - it was pretty dire. Rides were out, the park was ridiculously packed and the whole thing just seemed inept. And no, Merlin, after driving down there staying in a premier inn the night before to make sure I wasn't shattered so I could actually have a good day there, a crummy money off voucher with a time limit on it was not an acceptable mea culpa.Both have their draw backs, for me, AT's biggest problem is the huge spaces filled with nothing. TP's is the reliability of the rides. I'm glad we have these two parks engaged in this fight because otherwise they would rest on their laurels and former glory.Right at this moment I'm in Thorpe's corner. visit for visit on the last 5 occasions TP has won hands down and even better - I've actually been able to feel my legs and feet at the end of the day!

Well Evey,thank god I'm not alone in my views I was starting to think I was surrounded by AT employees. Yes the AP day at Thorpe was a farce, unscrupulous AP holders were equally as culpable as Merlin though; there were many making a few quid outside and no security preventing them selling their quota to a sea of morons.I have to say I think you are right about the amity theming, I'm not really overly concerned with theming I just like thrill rides but I imagine if I took the kids they would notice such things. And whilst I get your point about the volcano, AT has its theming faux pas moments...However, bang for buck thrill rides and quickest queues goes to TP. Oh and unlike being stuck in the middle of nowhere waiting for Air and not knowing it has broken down at least at TP you are close enough to hear the announcements if that should happen. No doubt I'll be dragged back to AT soon by my beloved and who knows maybe it will be ok, but I won't hold my breath

[pluk]

Comparing such different offerings is going to be really hard, it's like me choosing between a week on my skis and a week on the beach - they are both holidays but but so different it's pretty much impossible to decide what I enjoy more.The overcrowding problem has very rarely affected me - I do not go when I expect it to be busy. Simple. I guess I'm lucky not to be tied to weekends and school holidays like a lot of people; I will now not be going anywhere near a themepark until September. But going on a summer Saturday and your asking for problems tbh.Overall I probably favour Alton, I find it more of an experience and a lot more of a relaxing place to be with a greater variety of ride styles. In general I find I get loads done at Alton, usually start at Oblivion and by lunch (13.30ish) I'll have done everything on that side of the park and forbidden valley too. Lunch at Katanga, the more relaxing rides in that area down to mutiny after lunch then back to whichever side of the park I feel like doing again. I'm not rushing about either. At Thorpe I'm usually a lot more aimless because everything is so close so I will flit about avoiding any waits and probably end up covering more ground than a day at Alton.Where I do occasionally have to queue I find them less arduous at Alton than Thorpe, just because it's a nicer place to be with generally nicer people and also because on quite days Thorpes attractions seem to be having a 'how low can we get the throughput down to?' competition between themselves whereas Alton make an effort no matter how busy it is.

[AstroDan]

I fail to see how THORPE PARK can even threaten Alton Towers in any way other than the fact it has a higher proportion of thrill rides. The park is tiny compared to Alton, lacks any sort of beautiful landscape and doesn't have clearly defined areas. Alton Towers also offers a wider range of food, more entertainment and the resort hotels, golf and water park. The clientele target at THORPE PARK is also very limited to teens/young adults. Family parks breath a nicer atmosphere (CWOA, AT). Alton has a national target - it seeks to draw guests in from across the UK. THORPE PARK remains a fairly regional park, primarily for London and the South of England.THORPE PARK also has longer queues on average than Alton, due to the lesser throughputs and apparantly higher sales of fastrack. That said, THORPE PARK is much better this season, and I quite enjoyed myself when I visited in May.I think if you are only into theme parks for the thrill rides, then yes - THORPE PARK wins for you - but if you like theme parks for being theme parks, then Alton Towers is by quite a margin, the biggest force in the UK and it is for this reason that it attracts over 1million more guests a year than THORPE.

[Marc]

I think if you are only into theme parks for the thrill rides, then yes - THORPE PARK wins for you - but if you like theme parks for being theme parks, then Alton Towers is by quite a margin, the biggest force in the UK and it is for this reason that it attracts over 1million more guests a year than THORPE.

When you consider how quickly THORPE PARK has caught up in such a short space of time, along with the actual physical size and capacity's of the parks, its not really that impressive is it surely? But then its not all about gate figures..I'm on the fence with this one, for me, over the past couple of years altons lost its "magic" for me, the place has the same flaws which you see at any merlin theme park, and like the others look past them its possible to have a decent day out.

[Benin]

When you consider how quickly THORPE PARK has caught up in such a short space of time, along with the actual physical size and capacity's of the parks, its not really that impressive is it surely? But then its not all about gate figures..I'm on the fence with this one, for me, over the past couple of years altons lost its "magic" for me, the place has the same flaws which you see at any merlin theme park, and like the others look past them its possible to have a decent day out.

Thing is, if we compare Thorpe's level of investment since Tussauds took over to Towers' level, they tell very very different tales... Thorpe have had 4 major coasters, about half a dozen flats and a high level of focus on getting a teen brand... Towers grew just as much initially when Tussauds brought in, and in recent years has seen a much lower investment since it didn't need it as much...Indeed, it wasn't hard to improve Thorpe by adding rides when the biggest one was Loggers...

[Marc]

Thing is, if we compare Thorpe's level of investment since Tussauds took over to Towers' level, they tell very very different tales... Thorpe have had 4 major coasters, about half a dozen flats and a high level of focus on getting a teen brand... Towers grew just as much initially when Tussauds brought in, and in recent years has seen a much lower investment since it didn't need it as much...Indeed, it wasn't hard to improve Thorpe by adding rides when the biggest one was Loggers...

True, but 10 years on that level of investment seems to continue at Thorpe with LC12 round the corner, a hotel and no doubt another coaster just after that.I'm sure the next few years will be interesting for both thats for sure..

[Mark9]

True, but 10 years on that level of investment seems to continue at Thorpe with LC12 round the corner, a hotel and no doubt another coaster just after that.I'm sure the next few years will be interesting for both thats for sure..

Surely both parks are going to be advancing at the same level now, both parks are on a major coaster every 3 years and Alton have been wanting a third hotel for quite some time now. One day our parks will learn rollercoasters aren't everything. *sighs*

[Deleted Users]

I don't see how Thorpe can be number 1 when it has a much narrower market. Also, you are doing something wrong when a lot of the people on here within in the target market for Thorpe prefer to go to Chessie or Alton.

[thorpeparkjack]

'On here' is a very niche group of people though, I expect the majority of Thorpe's audience enjoy it with a significant proportion of them prefering it to Alton, and almost all Chessington.

[pluk]

I don't see how Thorpe can be number 1 when it has a much narrower market.

Yes, I think this sums it up.-Thorpe is for thrillseekers with not enough for children/families-Chessington is for children/families with not enough for thrillseekers And with that strategy they are never going to appeal to a wide enough audience to beat-Alton Towers which is for families but has enough to keep both children and thrillseekers more than happy.Unless the others change their direction and actively try to appeal to a wider market Alton Towers will always be no.1 (within Merlin anyway).

[Evey]

Thorpe have had 4 major coasters, about half a dozen flats and a high level of focus on getting a teen brand... Towers grew just as much initially when Tussauds brought in, and in recent years has seen a much lower investment since it didn't need it as much...

One thing I really don't enjoy is the 'teen branding' - I'm not a teen and to be quite frank it just makes me feel old!

[Dan]

With the new coasters coming for Thorpe I think altons got a new rival !

[Benin]

With the new coasters coming for Thorpe I think altons got a new rival !

Yeah, cos Towers aren't getting a new thrill coaster in 2013 are they?Oh wait.............

[Will]

I think Thorpe should capitalise on the fact that they are a lakeside themepark. I would like them to do more landscaping and tidy the whole park up and make it look less of a concrete jungle.Thorpe is reclaimed land and is doing the best they can. Alton is much better but is quite far away.

[Mark9]

I think Thorpe should capitalise on the fact that they are a lakeside themepark. I would like them to do more landscaping and tidy the whole park up and make it look less of a concrete jungle.Thorpe is reclaimed land and is doing the best they can. Alton is much better but is quite far away.

Thorpe is quite far away when you live in Stoke on Trent... whats your point?

[Ellie]

Thorpe is quite far away when you live in Stoke on Trent... whats your point?

I think he means he'd prefer to go to Towers if he could but settles on Thorpe park instead...

[Fred]

That's one big compromise