Vinlarr89

Just got back from first trip to Europa. 
 
Wow. Where to start. 
Stayed in hotel Colleseio which was impressive, and to be honest a strange experience in itself that such a lavish hotel was linked to a theme park. 
 
3 days on park and 1 day Rulantica. &nbsp
 
The aesthetics of the park are incredible, it’s impossible not to feel the passion and pride that the Mack family have for their park. Everywhere you look it’s packed with hidden gems and is fresh, vibrant and visually stunning. More so, even after 3 days I know there’s so much more to discover, and the rich theming throughout really does elevate this park. 
 
The ride selection is second to none. I went for the coasters, but fell in love with the dark rides! Pirates detail was impressive, but live all the little hidden gems throughout the park. In terms of the biggies. Voltron was my no1 followed by Wodan and Silver Star, but also really enjoyed blue fire, the last inversion really something. 
 
Heard people talking up the ops for years, and was always questioning why people went on about them so much. Well not any more! Absolute perfection and efficiency. So obvious that the park is all about guest experience, the no nonsense approach in the stations is so refreshing to see, and keeps the queues down to sub 20 even on popular rides on a fairly busy day! 
 
Overall can’t wait to get back, going to be hard to find a park to top the all round package that Europa provides, yes there’s parks with better coasters etc, but it’s the combo of the selection of rides, theming, cleanliness, food and beverage offerings and most of all OPERATIONS! 
 
If you havent been. Get out there!! 

Just got back from first trip to Europa. 
 
Wow. Where to start. 
Stayed in hotel Colleseio which was impressive, and to be honest a strange experience in itself that such a lavish hotel was linked to a theme park. 
 
3 days on park and 1 day Rulantica. &nbsp
 
The aesthetics of the park are incredible, it’s impossible not to feel the passion and pride that the Mack family have for their park. Everywhere you look it’s packed with hidden gems and is fresh, vibrant and visually stunning. More so, even after 3 days I know there’s so much more to discover, and the rich theming throughout really does elevate this park. 
 
The ride selection is second to none. I went for the coasters, but fell in love with the dark rides! Pirates detail was impressive, but live all the little hidden gems throughout the park. In terms of the biggies. Voltron was my no1 followed by Wodan and Silver Star, but also really enjoyed blue fire, the last inversion really something. 
 
Heard people talking up the ops for years, and was always questioning why people went on about them so much. Well not any more! Absolute perfection and efficiency. So obvious that the park is all about guest experience, the no nonsense approach in the stations is so refreshing to see, and keeps the queues down to sub 20 even on popular rides on a fairly busy day! 
 
Overall can’t wait to get back, going to be hard to find a park to top the all round package that Europa provides, yes there’s parks with better coasters etc, but it’s the combo of the selection of rides, theming, cleanliness, food and beverage offerings and most of all OPERATIONS! 
 
If you havent been. Get out there!! 

Just got back from first trip to Europa. 
 
Wow. Where to start. 
Stayed in hotel Colleseio which was impressive, and to be honest a strange experience in itself that such a lavish hotel was linked to a theme park. 
 
3 days on park and 1 day Rulantica. &nbsp
 
The aesthetics of the park are incredible, it’s impossible not to feel the passion and pride that the Mack family have for their park. Everywhere you look it’s packed with hidden gems and is fresh, vibrant and visually stunning. More so, even after 3 days I know there’s so much more to discover, and the rich theming throughout really does elevate this park. 
 
The ride selection is second to none. I went for the coasters, but fell in love with the dark rides! Pirates detail was impressive, but live all the little hidden gems throughout the park. In terms of the biggies. Voltron was my no1 followed by Wodan and Silver Star, but also really enjoyed blue fire, the last inversion really something. 
 
Heard people talking up the ops for years, and was always questioning why people went on about them so much. Well not any more! Absolute perfection and efficiency. So obvious that the park is all about guest experience, the no nonsense approach in the stations is so refreshing to see, and keeps the queues down to sub 20 even on popular rides on a fairly busy day! 
 
Overall can’t wait to get back, going to be hard to find a park to top the all round package that Europa provides, yes there’s parks with better coasters etc, but it’s the combo of the selection of rides, theming, cleanliness, food and beverage offerings and most of all OPERATIONS! 
 
If you havent been. Get out there!! 

Just got back from first trip to Europa. 
 
Wow. Where to start. 
Stayed in hotel Colleseio which was impressive, and to be honest a strange experience in itself that such a lavish hotel was linked to a theme park. 
 
3 days on park and 1 day Rulantica. &nbsp
 
The aesthetics of the park are incredible, it’s impossible not to feel the passion and pride that the Mack family have for their park. Everywhere you look it’s packed with hidden gems and is fresh, vibrant and visually stunning. More so, even after 3 days I know there’s so much more to discover, and the rich theming throughout really does elevate this park. 
 
The ride selection is second to none. I went for the coasters, but fell in love with the dark rides! Pirates detail was impressive, but live all the little hidden gems throughout the park. In terms of the biggies. Voltron was my no1 followed by Wodan and Silver Star, but also really enjoyed blue fire, the last inversion really something. 
 
Heard people talking up the ops for years, and was always questioning why people went on about them so much. Well not any more! Absolute perfection and efficiency. So obvious that the park is all about guest experience, the no nonsense approach in the stations is so refreshing to see, and keeps the queues down to sub 20 even on popular rides on a fairly busy day! 
 
Overall can’t wait to get back, going to be hard to find a park to top the all round package that Europa provides, yes there’s parks with better coasters etc, but it’s the combo of the selection of rides, theming, cleanliness, food and beverage offerings and most of all OPERATIONS! 
 
If you havent been. Get out there!! 

Why not go the whole hog, take the lift hill down increase the angle by a couple of degrees and add 5-8 ft to the top of it. 
Should do the trick 😉
 
All seriousness though, a zero car with a ballast tank built in? Fill it during downtime then empty it before sending first riders around. Seems the cheapest solution. 

I very much would have thought the demolition of two big structures for a rollercoaster would only be done when all other available land has been utilised for ride construction.
To recap there is the land behind swarm which is large, and if the hotel ever gets built where the planning permission was applied for there is another prime real estate plot at the front of the park which was identified for a coaster.
One day I’d like to see the pyramid come down and a brand new show building constructed there to house a new modern dark coaster.
However there are many many other issues to resolve first at the park  

-Multi launch coaster.
Yes we've got Stealth, but modern day launch coasters are so different to Stealth. Have it as a lower-to-ground, not-as-fast ride with a long layout, and it'll be a winner. Something like Manta at Sea World Abu Dhabi would be incredible at Thorpe. But also the likes of Taron, Taiga, Helix, etc etc. Any smaller version of those would be *chef kiss*
 
-RMC. A balls to the wall RMC hybrid or single rail would be amazing to have in the country. Would it be the right fit for the park? I'm not necessarily convinced. But from an enthusiast wet dream perspective, absolutely. 
 
-Vekoma tilt. The gimmick sells itself, and is different enough to anything else on park. But the real kicker is getting a modern Vekoma on park, which are wicked fun. A bog standard Vekoma sit down coaster feels unlikely at Thorpe, simply due to it not having the USP. Chuck on the tilt gimmick and a fab layout though, and they're golden.

Ding dong no
 
The sky is dark, the coast is rocky, the island mountainous. Construction is far away.
 
Wait bugger wrong account

How was your 2024?
 
Park count
Alton Towers X6
Chessington X1
Thorpe Park X4
Animal Kingdom X1
Hollywood Studios X1
Magic Kingdom X2
Disneyland Parc X3
Studio Parc X1
Linanmaki X1
Europa Park X3
Efteling X3
Emerald Park X1
Six Flags over Georgia X1
Carowinds X2
Fun Spot Atlanta X1
Dollywood X2
Holiday World X1
Kentucky Kingdom X1
Kings Island X2
Cedar Point X3
Kennywood X1
 
New rollercoasters of the year
 
Year highlights
- First day visits for Nemesis Reborn and Hyperia
- Finally visiting Dollywood and trying the cinnamon bread
- Hitting 500 and 550 credits
- Riding some absolute beasts this year (Voltron, Taiga, Afterburn, The Voyage, Steel Vengeance) 
 
 
2025 is more of a rest year but with big hitters like Tokyo Disneyland, Fuji Q and Nagashima Spa land, I'm hyped. 😃

Biggest problem for towers is what’s next… I see this becoming a problem too for Thorpe in the not too distant future. 
 
Oblivion- actually think this ride can have some significant maintenance and continue without too much issue. 
 
Galactica- needs significant investment and a new theme. Several million 
 
Rita - will require replacement within next 10 years. Tens of millions. 
 
On top of this
 
X sector- new flat ride required
Dark Forest - new flat ride required
Forbidden Valley - replacement for blade now required
 
My Biggest issue with the recent strategy is this. 
 
Millions and millions have been spent to end up with the same ride line up that previously existed. And because of the state of above millions more will have to be spent to tread water so to speak. 
 
Thorpe will have to start planning for replacing the likes of stealth and even Colossus at some point which will put them in a similar predicament. 

Got to say I also think the next big investment will align with Thorpes 50th. 
 
Coasterwise RMC is the no brainer, we all want it, and I’m sure JB would love to be involved in one, with Thorpe the only obvious choice. Also to top Hyperia will be difficult for the park, but an RMC has the ability to do so. 
 
However. I actually think the park is CRYING OUT for a multi launch coaster. Quite flexible with the type tbh. Intamin make great ones, Mack extreme spinner or even a Mack Stryker. As it wouldn’t need a massive height to achieve a great ride experience it could be situated towards the front of the park aka outside the dome leaving the island behind swarm and potentially rumba area all free for a future expansion. Just my 2p worth 

Firstly you make some really good points, and a well thought out discussion starter. 
 
I was surprised to find out quite how many operations Merlin had. 
 
As Josh has said there are so many layers and moving parts to an organisation the scale of Merlin, that we must be very careful to understand that at times decisions can be made to move in another direction which can be seen as negative, when in reality it’s simply a reaction to the market or an adjustment. 
 
I will try to summarise all my thoughts in a more detailed response but for now I broadly agree with what Josh has said. 
 
Aramark joint venture will have been set up with Merlin taking a percentage and an annual fee, and the arrangement is probably very risk free from Merlin’s perspective, although I agree the standard of service is poor and should be carefully monitored by Merlin. 
 
MMM is an interesting one. As Josh points out it is studios north that is closing. Now my suspicions are that Merlin are starting to show their hand on the moves they will make to react to Universal. And for me that is a focus shifting to the south parks that stand to benefit from universal. 
 
What does that mean? Time will of course tell, but the recent applications for Chessington suggest a shift towards harnessing the family market that Universal will pull to the UK shores, and the hints of the Thorpe hotel and project pivot suggests the park moving to start harnessing the enthusiasts and teen market that universal will create. 
 
All of that coupled with project horizon seemingly slipping further to the right suggests a smaller budget being spent in the north, and when you think of universal as a threat or opportunity, geographically it’s probably more of a threat to towers than it is an opportunity. 
 
As I’ve said, probably more to add to this tomorrow, but that’s what’s top of my head RN

This is a very interesting topic, which has many layers and many moving parts.
 
In short though, I don't think Merlin is a company in trouble. I do think it's a company which is going through many changes, though.
 
Merlin Magic Making
There's been a lot of misunderstanding going on about the MMM redundancies going around. 
 
What is happening is that Merlin Magic Making Studio North is closing down. Studios North is a studio which produces / builds things for Merlin, located by Alton Towers. It was effectively Merlin's own theming production company. But...Merlin don't use them much. For whatever reasons, it would regularly be cheaper to hire and work with external companies for those things. I don't really understand why. But it's been that way for years.
 
But from small scale things (Alton Towers using Leek Signs to print larger signs) to medium things (Thorpe work with UVE to build Fright Nights mazes) to larger things (the Wicker Man statue for example), Merlin were using their own design studio less and less. There had to come a point where it became questionable for it to exist.
 
It's of course incredibly sad for the staff involved. 
 
However, it should be stressed that Merlin Magic Making continues to exist, being the team that is involved in designing new rides for the parks, new experiences for the smaller attractions, etc. Those redundancies aren't making "creatives" (people who design rides) redundant. 
 
Another thing: very few theme parks have large dedicated teams to producing theming internally. It's almost always done externally for larger things, or done only for smaller things. Merlin was pretty unique in that. So it's not like they are falling behind or becoming worse compared to other parks / companies.
 
Bear Grylls Adventure
 
Bear Grylls Adventure is an interesting one.
 
It had a good hook and idea, and when I went shortly after it opened, I was impressed with the experience. I do think it struggled to be marketed correctly though.
 
Another thing, which most are likely unaware: Bear Grylls is incredibly popular in China. His 'brand', for lack of a better word, is huge. And, as we know, 10 years ago, Merlin was significantly interested in the Chinese market.
In short, Bear Grylls Adventure opened in Birmingham as a tester attraction, so Merlin could learn how to operate it and maximise money in the Chinese market. The UK is a safer bet for the company to test things out, and easy for them to get people through the door (thanks to the Merlin Annual Pass). They did similar with Shrek's Adventure in London, and the Peter Rabbit Play experience in Blackpool.
 
That does mean, however, the Merlin experiments with their "Gateway" (new name for "Midway") Attractions are clear to see for the UK market, including the associated failures.
 
Gateway Closures
In terms of closures of other Gateway Attractions, I'm aware of the following:
-Little Big City Berlin and SeaLife Berlin
-Madame Tussauds San Francisco
 
I can offer a little bit of insight here.
Little Big City is in a prime real estate position, located at the Berlin TV Tower. The rent is astronomical. It has done well for a number of years. However, it will struggle in Berlin in the current economic climate (where people are spending less). Berlin has lots of free sight-seeing things you can do, and many people will visit for the historical value of the city, or for the nightlife. With people spending less, LBC is a lot lower down on people's lists. 
 
Sea Life is located just round the corner, so again, hugely expensive, and again, will suffer the same issues as Little Big City.
 
Berlin Dungeons will be attractive to people who visit Berlin, though, so that should be safe.
 
San Francisco is a difficult market, and was interested at a time when Merlin were really pushing their expansion plans. It was seen as a risk, in the sense of "let's try, and if we fail, oh well, at least we've tried". That's the level of power and money Merlin have to play with.
 
It should be said as well that there have been new Gateway Attractions that have opened in recent years too. Peppa Pig Theme Parks (which are more like big theme park areas) are doing well. Legoland Discovery Centre Brussels opened in 2022 and has been one of the most successful LDCs to date (possibly the most successful, I'm a little out of the loop there).
 
Of course, the closures of attractions are awful for the staff that work there, but on the topic of Merlin as a company, I don't think it's as bad as it sounds when you just list out all the closures.
 
Sea Lifes
There are rumours - and I stress, just rumours - that the new CEO of Merlin is not a fan of zoos and aquaria. Those rumours don't make it clear whether that's from a business standpoint or a personal/moral standpoint. Regardless of the reason why, if that rumour is true, we could well see more Sea Life Centres close / be sold out of the Merlin estate.
 
Two Big Issues
This ramble about closing attractions has highlighted two major points which are very relevant to why Merlin are in the position they are currently in:
1. The economic landscape / the cost of living crisis, giving people much less disposable income 
2. Merlin's shift in strategy and having to make large changes
 
To address the second point first: as said, Merlin wanted to become the most visited theme park company in the world. To do that, they were expanding and expanding, and trying new markets, seeing what was happening and what would work. Inevitably, some would work, some wouldn't. And the ones that wouldn't, would have to close. San Francisco is a key example. Some of their Chinese ventures is another.
 
But of course, dealing with those closures has financial implications which will be felt.
 
On top of that, Merlin spent a long time looking into expanding in China. The Covid pandemic put a huge dent into those plans actually. On top of that, some of their early ventures out there stumbled through, meaning they had to spend longer sorting that out. However, they still have Legoland parks opening out there, with Legoland Shanghai opening next year
 
Legolands
The Legolands around the world have had mixed success.
-Legoland Malaysia (opened in 2012) has done pretty well
-Legoland Dubai (2016) does well in context of the UAE (and is technically owned by another company)
-Legoland Japan (2017) opened in a poor location and has struggled.
-Legoland New York (2021) was another poor location, and opening post-Covid and in a cost of living crisis has meant it's done poorly.
-Legoland South Korea (2022) I know the least about, but again I imagine struggles right now because of the worldwide landscape.
 
The Chinese Legolands (Shanghai and Sichuan) have been under development for a long time, and are in good locations. There's been a thirst and demand for Legolands in the country for a long time, and I believe Merlin learnt many lessons from Japan and New York, along with their previous ventures in China. From my understanding of those projects, I genuinely believe they have a huge chance of being very successful.
 
But, there is a chance that the theme park boat has sailed in China now...certainly the expansion of parks, and attractions within parks, has slowed post-Covid. We will see.
 
Cost of Living
This is the big kicker. The entertainment and visitor attraction industry is being hit hard right now. Some parks are doing better than others, of course. But everywhere is feeling the squeeze. That should be acknowledged.
 
 
Aramark
 
I obviously can't provide any evidence, but I am under the impression that despite Aramark being a thing, Merlin are still very happy with the amount of money they get via Aramark. And it comes at the added convenience of not having to deal with that industry directly, so I think it is a win-win in their eyes.
 
I completely agree that the price of food has spiralled and is too much in many - but not all - instances. At the same time, many theme parks have very expensive food options (Plopsaland and the Plopsa parks have more expensive and worse quality food than anything I've had at Merlin parks, for example). Compaigne des Alpes parks (Walibi and Parc Asterix) are quite expensive too, but broadly has the quality to much. 
 
The quality is a mixed bag. Thorpe's food offering is, in my opinion, better and more diverse now than it was in the years preceding Aramark coming in. Towers has gotten noticeably worse. Chessington and Legoland roughly the same. I'd say they're mostly all worse than, say, 15 years, but I wonder if that's a general industry trend.
 
I do hope that Merlin/Aramark can address the cost of food. I appreciate it is hard to do so when prices are going up everywhere, but it is too much now, and I know plenty of people who bring their own food to parks these days.
 
Universal
 
I think I'm in a minority with this opinion, but I think that Universal coming to the UK will do nothing but good things for Merlin. I think that Legoland Windsor and Thorpe in particular will reap the most benefits.
 
Universal, in all of its locations, is a premium product. As such, it comes at a premium price. Day tickets in the triple digits. I wouldn't be surprised if Universal GB has an Annual Pass costing £700. Compare that to Merlin's Annual Pass costing £200ish for multiple parks and loads of other attractions, and people will go "well, that's not bad". People will still visit Universal, of course, but they will see the value in Merlin when they can get an Annual Pass for the same price as a 2-3 day ticket.
 
Yes, Universal's premium product will outshine Merlin's products. But people maybe won't mind that if the price is noticeably cheaper?
 
And, plenty of people will come from abroad for Universal. Europeans will rather go to the UK than Orlando I'm sure. Plenty will fly into Heathrow and travel from there. I can certainly see people be happy to "add on" a day or two into London/Windsor, and potentially Legoland as a result. Those interested in theme parks more particularly will see Thorpe and consider that too. Obviously, that depends on how Thorpe play their cards with marketing, but they can definitely try and capitalise.
 
I think the biggest issue will be in the short term when Universal look to hire staff. Not necessarily Creatives / Directors, as they'll come from people within the company already, but your Upper Managers, Engineers, Department Managers Team Leaders, etc. Heck, even your hosts. I'm sure there's plenty of staff within Merlin who are looking at Universal and going "I'd be happy to move towards Bedford and work for Universal. Even if I get paid the same, I'll get free tickets to Universal". And Universal will be happy to have people from within the UK with that experience come work for them.
 
It will balance out, but could hit hard as it opens up.
 
I'm making an assumption here that Universal will be a premium park with a premium price tag. Maybe they'll change for the UK market and offer something more in line with Merlin parks in terms of price. But when they've got a huge name to uphold, maybe not.
 
But yeah, I genuinely think that Universal opening in the UK will offer nothing but good things for the UK theme park industry and for Merlin.
 
Are Merlin in trouble?
I think Merlin are going through many changes and have issues. That comes from the economic climate, the recent changes at the top and more. And there are a lot of changes behind the scenes (I'm aware of some redundancies that happened at a corporate level over the summer). I don't think it spells bad news for the wider company right now though. 

Regardless of thoughts, we can't deny Thorpe has by far been the best run Merlin park this year. It has been a disaster at Towers and CWoA most the year!

Hoping that this stage and the planning application with 18 late nights means late weekend opening hours for the park in the summer and more night rides!! 

Pacing will alter significantly as testing continues. Firstly the train literally crawled over the crest of the lift hill, in a couple of weeks it will be going significantly quicker over the top as Mack lifts are normally fast. This won’t dramatically alter the speed at the bottom (probably only a couple of mph) but that will mean a significant amount of additional kinetic energy is being carried by the train. Secondly the friction will reduce as the ride beds in and warms up so the speed will be maintained throughout the layout. This will probably mean more airtime but less hang time 

Pacing will alter significantly as testing continues. Firstly the train literally crawled over the crest of the lift hill, in a couple of weeks it will be going significantly quicker over the top as Mack lifts are normally fast. This won’t dramatically alter the speed at the bottom (probably only a couple of mph) but that will mean a significant amount of additional kinetic energy is being carried by the train. Secondly the friction will reduce as the ride beds in and warms up so the speed will be maintained throughout the layout. This will probably mean more airtime but less hang time 

Really don’t see the point in heavily theming a ride that you’re either 200ft in the air or flying by at 80mph. Save the pennies for the next one instead 😏

Am I the only one that actually likes the fact it turns white at different points? Think it breaks it up from looking too basic personally. Guess a fade would have looked better though. 

😂 when will it end 🤞

Great choice in my opinion. Nice and vibrant, and will tie it in well with amity next door. Looks fantastic 

I have to be honest. I thought it would look horrendous. But I actually really like it now it’s going in. 

I’m 100% all in for feel good thrills. One thing I love about hyperia is that the theme isn’t dark. Really think Thorpe moving in a more uplifting direction is a massive positive

God he's good. Must be why he's a mod.
 
Waff zooooooom splosh splish splash I was takin a bath rub a dub dub things are lookng UP.
I'm desperate, so where can I.P.
We need more time, lord.

There’s some aerial shots that have been posted on Instagram of the site. Looks to be all but complete footer wise, maybe 20 left in some various stages of completion. 
 
Also looks like there’s an access route prepared to reach the back of the site, so I would say not far off going vertical at all now.