CharlieN

Halloween is without a doubt, my least favourite time of year at theme parks. Nothing could interest me less then a bunch of dressed up students ignoring me too make some girls scream in a maze, or the park over run with people in the dark looking to make trouble.

Hansa Park are replacing their bell-themed pendulum ride with a family drop tower and kids log flume next year:

https://m.facebook.com/hapaforum/posts/3014862091889408
 
Hansa Park concept art is usually pretty damn close to the real thing, so looks like a cute little area.

Intamin call them swing launches, Mack call them halfpipe launches and Gerstlauer just call them triple launches. So take your pick!
 
I think swing launch is the most fun name so I stick with that haha

In an out-of-the-blue announcement, Six Flags have announced a park for Saudia Arabia, in Riyadh, more specifically, Qiddiyah, an entertainment project trying to revolutionise the country.
 

 
https://qiddiya.com/en/press-release/six-flags-qiddiya-unveils-park-design
 
The highlight of the announcement is the world's tallest, fastest and longest coaster, with the only seemingly-publicly confirmed stat bring a max speed of 156mph. Oh, and it's not a launch coaster.
The park will also include:
-A swing launch coaster
-A Vekoma Orkanen SFC
-A Mack Poseidon water coaster
-A new style GCI hybrid coaster
-Drop track coaster
-World's tallest drop tower
-And whatever else they're dreaming of.
 
The plan is for the park to open in 2023.
 
Somehow, I don't think so. But we'll see...

Dreamworld Australia, the park where there was the rapids incident in 2016 killing 4, is getting a new roller coaster. The park was (and still is) rumoured to be in quite an unstable position following the incident, not helped by some stiff competition theme park-wise on the Gold Coast. So some see this as perhaps a last roll of the dice in trying to stay afloat.
 
The coaster will be a near Blue-Fire clone from Mack, but starts of with a swing launch (launch forward, backward, forwards into circuit) with a curved spike, a slightly higher top speed, and the final car will be one of Mack's Xtreme Spinning Cars (in a similar to fashion to how it was tested on the original Blue Fire a few years back):
 

 
This is part of a wider AUS$70m (~£38m) expansion for the park as well, which will see a couple of smaller rides introduced, and some freshen ups of existing rides. The coaster will open in late 2020.

For a recent example, Untamed cost €12m. Assuming a ground-up RMC would cost more, and then take into account Merlin inflating prices, a brand new RMC would probably be slated to cost between the £18-20m mark. Hardly cheaper than a 'big' manufacturer.
 
Sure, Freespins would be a nice idea, but they'd be pretty low down on my list of rides I'd like to see go to Thorpe (or Towers really). It wasn't too long ago the idea of one them (or a similar-ish Intamin Zac Spin) would have been shot down for being ridiculous, due to their average throughput. Now it feels like that option would be brilliant because it's something.
It definitely is. Alton did that with B&M in the 90s to be fair. Six Flags seem to have done it with RMC.
 
But for every successful partnership, they'll be unsuccessful ones. Sure it's not coaster-related, but Merlin/Simworx is a prime example. Parque Reunidos work closely with Gerstlauer, but they've gotten very little out of it. It's a gamble, especially with smaller manufacturers, so it doesn't always pay off. 

Yes, this is true. The reasons include:
-A decrease in visitors compared to 2011. Despite the fact that 2011 was one of Thorpe's busiest and most profitable (and so, in that sense, 'best') years ever, Swarm still had to deliver an increase. It didn't, so Merlin saw Swarm as a failure, and immediately lost faith in whatever their thought process was behind that direction.
-Weak brand. Swarm didn't capture people's imagination. It was very generic and not very recognisable. The end of the world vibe was overdone and it merged in with so many other things that went for that.
-Experience didn't match marketing. For one reason or another, people expected an intense thrill ride, similar to Saw. Instead, Swarm offered a much more graceful experience, leading people to be disappointed. 
 
So basically, people had minor niggles about the ride, and less people visited Thorpe (which would have happened regardless). So, Merlin see it as a failure. Despite that, in the long term it's done a good job, is less generic these days and scores very highly in KPI scores, which Merlin love. So it's been a slow burner. But Merlin's model doesn't allow for slow burners.
 
 
Just a couple more to add:
 
Derren Brown's Ghost Train
Going for a dark ride over a coaster was always a risk, but it was one which needed to be done in my opinion. Sadly, DBGT missed every single possible mark, which really damaged the park. It did attract attention, and it did cause attendances to rise. But it damaged the park's reputation by so much more than the worth of a few thousand visitors. Two big investments in a row that failed is a big recipe for disaster. You need a sure-fire win after that; something with minimal risk. But when everything is spiralling downwards, the pressure is even great, and the amount of risk you take has to decrease. Ultimately it leaves us in the situation we're in now: the best way to minimise risk is to not take a risk at all. Can't lose money if you don't spend money, right?
 
Terrible Non-Big Investments
You have to go all the way back to 2007 when the park added a solid non-big investment, in Flying Fish. Arguments can be made for Storm Surge (diversifies the line up and added a much needed family ride) and Walking Dead (a solid scary-themed indoor attraction at the end of the day). I guess you could say 2013 with turning X forwards but that slipped under the radar with the focus on Swarm backwards. But I think Flying Fish is the last one where someone would struggle to come up with a reasonable negative for it. Since then, we've had short term investments, based off fads or needless IPs, which have led to a mish-mash of identities and ideas, and nothing which has really improved the line up.
 
This is coupled with a lack of general upkeep in the existing parts of the park. The bare minimum was done to rides, theming, presentation, etc., which eventually led to rides closing, theming being taken away, etc. 
 
Focusing too much on Scares
Fright Nights works for the park. Regardless of its quality, it's still the busiest, best received, and most profitable time of year for the park, year in year out. The park tried to capitalise on that and make it work all year round (which, in fairness, isn't too unreasonable). It worked with Saw - The Ride, because that was handled properly. Saw Alive was a nice idea and helped absorb the busyness whilst it was full time. After that, Thorpe should have quit whilst they were ahead.
 
Scare attractions don't work outside of Halloween in a theme park setting. Scary stuff doesn't work outside of Halloween in a theme park setting. One thing to compliment a line up, yes. But an overarching focus on it? No. Yet Thorpe didn't realise this. They didn't learn that in 2005 when Freakshow 3D was dead during summer because no one cared. They didn't learn that after Saw Alive's popularity dwindled in 2012. They didn't learn after Swarm. They didn't learn after Ghost Train. They probably haven't learnt after The Year of The Walking Dead. 
 
Keep scares for Fright Nights, and focus on a diverse line up.
 
Not Learning Lessons
Related to above, Thorpe make the same mistakes again and again. This likely comes down to management seemingly being a revolving door, especially in more recent years. A new person comes in, tries something, it doesn't work, leave. A new person comes in, tries that same thing in a different disguise, it doesn't work, leave. Repeat. They need to take a step back, look at what they've done for the past 15 years and realise what hasn't worked, and what has worked, and start building from that.

Most of what the posts above me say are completely correct, but here's my two cents.
 
Lack of image: Thorpe Park don't really have a clear audience now. At least back in 2012 they had a image and demographic, in 2019 the park have huge indentity problems and the new adverts and tagline just scream soul-less. Chessington and Alton are not perfect but any means but they have a clear brand and a clear target market which they both do well, Thorpe is the vanilla ice cream of branding at Merlin. IP's that make no sense: Gruffalo and Room On The Broom make somewhat sense. IAC, Angry Birds, and TWD literally felt just Thorpe picked their IP from a hat. Do we need a half arsed area themed to Angry Birds? HELL NO. IAC was another example of Thorpe slapping on a short IP for a short lived attraction that shouldn't exist in the first place. Poor small, medium, and large investments: For small investments we got IAC and a bunch of reused unthemed little flat rides which were placed pretty blindly.. For medium investments we got Angry Birds and the best family ride re-themed to something scary, for large we got DBGT- one of the biggest fails in Merlin history. 13 million spent on something that probably won't make it past ten years of operation. Neglected parts of the park: Colossus's new concrete look, Swarm's wood in the station, Inferno's queueline, Old Town in general, Slammer.. The park feels so neglected, Thorpe right now feels like the unwanted redhead child of Merlin.. I think what Mark said was very true in that Chessington was in a similar position for a while, things can change. Though I feel like Thorpe really has a dug itself a hole and its going to take some hefty investments and clean up to recover what is the current mess of the park. I think replacing Loggers and Slammer with new attractions would be a good first step, that area is crying for a refurb, its needed a refurb for like 4 years now..

I have a few theories. None of its concrete evidence and is pure conjecture on my part.
 
- The failure of the Swarm. We all know that Merlin were initially disappointed by the Swarms first season. Many reasons were cited (which I'm sure those in the know can find) but essentially, I think this lack of interest in the new coaster dented confidence in what the park could do. Baring in mind, 2011 saw one of the biggest years the park had and that was on the back of Storm Surge. Cheaper investment bought massive returns.
 
- The next Big thing. I think Thorpe has fallen into the trap that Six Flags did. By appealing solely to the thrill sector you severely limit interest. Teenagers want the next big thing and in the 00s, Thorpe easily provided that thrill. Hit after hit, success after success. Coasters galore, several years where we got two flat rides. That investment was unsustainable. Now though, rides like Colossus, Inferno, Tidal Wave, Detonator & Vortex are old hat. They are unmaintained and look their age. Thorpe were unable to drum up interest with The Swarm, Derren Brown opened late and was pretty weak and the less said about the reliance on IP to drive interest the better. The park has a real image problem which leads me to..
 
- Branding. Thorpe has a huge perception problem. Is it a thrill park, is it a park for up for it families, do we make X a family coaster then two years later refurbish it for adults. Do we change our market to families and then close the biggest family ride we've got (Loggers Leap). Do we advertise our park in our 2019 advert or have an image of goats, donuts and a hotel room. None of this evokes excitement. It smacks of a park throwing anything, everything at the wall to see what sticks and new general managers are not given enough time to evolve/change the place before they are fired and a new one bought in.
 
- The Smiler crash. Ironically, four years later, I feel like the crash has had this weird echoing effect at Thorpe compared to the other two main Merlin parks. It's almost like it never recovered from the initial drop in attendance whilst Alton has recovered well thanks to Wicker Man and Chessington never saw the drop because of its family audience. You could say the lack of investment is really hurting Thorpe right now but then there seems to be no steps to change this.
 
- The park itself. It's fallen a long way since the hefty days of 2006. If they are to recover the place they need to sort out their offering. Having abandoned flat rides and log flumes standing doesn't help, neither does the game stalls or the lack of maintenance and paint jobs on their rollercoasters. The basics need to be sorted for Thorpe to recover. Chessington was exactly the same way in the 00's but that now feels like the strongest Merlin park IMO. If Thorpe can sort this then they might be able to get back to the top.

Wish I could go, unfortunately as Polish politicians have declared LGBT enemies of the state, I couldn't possibly visit with that kind of hatred running through the country. Some things come above rollercoasters and this is one of them.

I am fully aware of that. I work with children with all sorts of physical and mental disabilities.
 
Unfortunately a lot of people using the RAP system in the UK are people with 'disabilities' that do not require them to be unable to stand in a normal queue. 
 
The pass is supposed to allow you to skip the queue, but still have to wait the equivalent of the queue time, however many staff don't bother with that aspect of it meaning they can just go and queue for another ride. 
 
We actually witnessed a situation on the AT meet where a parent got angry as the staff member wrote the time 60 mins later on his sons RAP sheet and he started going off on one about how his son won't be able to cope, clearly not understanding it wasn't a fast track ticket but merely a means of his son not having to stand in a physical queue. 

Didn’t realise there was a topic on this so I may as well attempt to sort of revive it.
 
After having done 1st year Civil and Structural Engineering at Leeds, I decided it wasn’t the right course for me. This is because I wasn’t particularly enjoying it, I was really struggling to take in information during lectures (whilst did attend every lecture, it wouldn’t have made a difference if decided to bunk off most of them instead) and I didn’t take to it naturally unlike many other students who naturally enjoyed it and could take to it very well. I did manage to get 65% which was a huge shock (in a good way) that was mainly due to some insane cramming and was also dragged up by getting 85% in the maths module.
 
So instead I will be switching to Mathematics and repeating first year whilst still staying at Leeds because it’s an amazing city (and the music society is brilliant). Maths has always been my strongest subject, a subject I personally found easy (whilst still enjoyable at A Level) and have always been intrigued with as it gets more advanced. The maths lectures during first year engineering were also the only lectures I genuinely enjoyed so I’m pretty confident I will enjoy studying it a lot more than engineering.
 
So yeah... time to do first year for the second time!

I like the bit where he says "My Ghost Train" and hope Thorpe release merch with this on next year.

Is it that grand though from the tight angle you see it from?


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Another thing, I find it really naff that you see guests getting off the train carriage before/whilst you board, ideally the offload should have been on the other side surely?
 
It'd be really nice if Thorpe arranged a behind the scenes tour for TPM, the same way that PBE members (myself included) have had tours round the interior of Valhalla.

Great conversation about Chessington guys.
 
 
I went yesterday, it's nice to take a few years break from parks as Chessington is looking really good right now (to me at least). Of all three ex Tussauds parks, it looks in the best position for the 2020's. We pretty much looked around the entire Zoo and theme park and there's small bits of improvement all over the park. There's obviously some flaws such as Toadies which looks baaaad but on the flip side, Sir Squirtlot was on which I haven't seen for years. They need to make a statement on Bucaneer because saying its run aground is coy.
 
Park was relatively quiet with 10-20 minute queues across the board. Saw some shows, had a pint or two at the hotel which I think is Merlins best hotel as far as the theme and view stands.
Lord Lorikeet
 

I like these little tributes across the park to the past. Ashok here, the wood carvings near the penguin enclosure from a tree that was cut down to expand the area. They are charming and respectful.
 

Wanyama Village is the best part of Chessington. It's what separates theme parks from amusement parks. Chessington is easily our best answer to the European competitors IMO.
 

I liked how fresh a lot of the park actually looked. Rattlesnake had a slight refurb a few years back with all the snakes fixed and now looks much nicer then it did through the 00's. The animatronics still need work
 

Wasn't much of a fan of Bucaneer just being left around near Griffins.
 

This park needs a successor to Fury. It can't cope with the demand and has never been able to. As the ride offering decreases, they need to get some investment in. I like that they are refurbishing rides one by one through the place and I approve of the effort in the Zoo offering. The place still needs some ride investment. With so much on the market, when will Chessington actually build something fresh and new?

StevenVig being unnecessarily sarcastic about a justified comment? Shock horror

Lego family's Kirkbi and Blackstone to buy Madame Tussauds owner Merlin: FT
 
 
(Reuters) - Britain’s Merlin Entertainments Plc (MERL.L) is to be acquired for 6 billion pounds ($7.6 billion), including debt, by a group made up of Kirkbi, the investment vehicle of Lego’s founding family, private equity firm Blackstone Group LP (BX.N) and Canadian pension fund CPPIB, the Financial Times reported on Friday. 
The deal to buy Merlin, which owns and operates Madame Tussauds waxworks exhibits around the world, is expected to be announced as soon as Friday morning, but no deal was guaranteed until the announcement, the FT said on.ft.com/2X9zLxD, citing multiple people it said were close to the matter. 
The deal is likely to value Merlin’s shares at around 460 pence, one of the people told the FT, giving it an equity value of more than 4.73 billion pounds.
 
https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-merlin-ent-m-a-consortium/lego-familys-kirkbi-and-blackstone-to-buy-merlin-entertainments-ft-idUKKCN1TS3EI

Yep I think it'll be a Altair Clone so it will have the curved drop and lap bars.
I have to admit that this is pretty exciting for Flamingo Land!

Such a pretty park, I really do love this park, and can't help feeling in an alternative universe Thorpe could have ended up more like this (maritime exhibits, vintage attractions, gardens, architectural facades, family feel etc) They even have an onsite woodcarver and signwriter that you can look in on (last picture).

Im no expert on costs of things but I don’t think should look too much into the costs of bouncezilla to the park - it has a sponsorship to start with which probably covered most / all the cost to buy it - I doubt any money spent would much much dent in a cost of a ride.

I find watching TV and playing board games fun too. Doesn't mean that I want to travel to Surrey to do that!
 
I can just have 'fun' many places, there's only a few places I can gave fun riding rides and coasters!
 
I'm not saying they can't mix things us with different experiences, but if I go to a major theme park I expect rides and attractions, and would be disappointed if that focus went.

Coming soon to Alton Towers... and then Chessington...

The soundtrack was just a naff mix of old pop tracks (who still listens to Gangnam Style in 2019?) with an annoying 'BOUNCEZILLA' jingle mashed in.

The event is pretty typical for a low budget Merlin event, it's just a bit of trashy summer fun and that's fine.

But for some strange reason (going off his rush to post about it online) Thorpe brought back Nick Hutson to do the soundtrack and even got John Burton from MMM involved. Seriously, they paid an ego-stroking podcaster/YouTuber just to do what 'Now That's What I Call Music 20546' does every year and for some reason MMM needed to be involved in a bouncy castle??

Do they not have their own events team anymore?
Couldn't they hire a real DJ on location, ya know, like a real event would?

I did it today. It's fun. I mean it's a bloody bouncy castle course, of course it's going to be fun.
 
But it looks awful, the soundtrack is cringey (think cringey pop songs mashed together poorly and an annoying American-style voiceover), it isn't what Thorpe need right now (or ever tbh), feels out of place...
 
I guess it's a guilty pleasure type attraction. You'll come out smiling, but everything about it is so bad.