Marc Posted August 9, 2013 Report Share Posted August 9, 2013 Just something what I've noticed more and more recently on not just these forums but various forums about the UK's parks is the slating of Merlin and it got me thinking are they really that bad? I know people don't like things such as paid fastrack but these are things which have been around way before Merlin got involved with Thorpe / Alton / Cwoa, and what business sense would it be for them to come in and but that what must be fairly high revenue stream? I think Merlin have actually done a pretty good job with "The big 3" of our parks since they took over.. At Towers we've had: Mutiny Bay - Much better than what was previously there, well themed and good area IMO Thirteen - Whilst possibly marketed wrongly, its a pretty fun ride which id say generally is well received Nemesis Sub-Terra - It wasnt great at opening, but they listened to feedback and its a decent little attraction now The Smiler - Its problems are well documented but its what the park needed and the public seem pretty happy with it - Along with that X Sector had its re-ferb too. Thorpe: Saw - The Ride - Possibly the parks most successful attraction, it has its critics (including me) but again its a ride the public seem to love Saw - Alive - Was more of a bolt on but it continued the Saw theme going into another year, it offered a different experience to what the park had on offer for a couple of years, its themeing is actually pretty good too. Storm Surge - Ok... its far from great, it looks bad, but is it an improvement on the rides you would see in Staines town centre? Probably.. The Swarm - Pretty much what all enthusiasts wanted from Theming to Marketing the entire thing is pretty well executed X - Since ive followed the parks I think X:\ No way out was always getting a retheme in that closed season, it finally did, Loud music, Lights and a lower hight restriction to start appealing to a wider family market, its not amazing but its a a vast improvement. Along with that thorpe have seen investments in areas which matter with the park looking and running much better than it did pre Merlin. Chessington: ( I dont really know a great deal here!) The Hotel - Pretty decent investment, its a nice hotel inside and out and is pretty popular Wild Asia - Replacing the tired beno land area, a vast improvement Africa Retheme - Area looks so much better now than it did previously Zufari - Its opened up a previously unused area, fits quite well into the target of the park Whilst this year hasn't been CWOA's finest Merlin do seem to be spending money in the right areas in replacing theming across the park which needed doing (not by fault of their own) Along with this, the annual pass is pretty good value for money when you compare it to other annual schemes, whilst its alot more expensive than back when I started visiting (I think a Tussauds annual pass was £70 then!) you do get an awful lot for your money now. The parks all also seem to have a pretty good future planned for them too, with continued investment in them all, I do genuinely feel Merlin get the blame for a lot more than is really down to them, IMO the parks are in a MUCH better position than they were pre merlin. Liam T, Luke_A and Inferno 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted August 9, 2013 Report Share Posted August 9, 2013 Comparing Storm Surge to rides in Staines Town Centre is a werid comparison... They are of equal quality mind (I.e. awful)... The issue with Merlin comes down to whether enthusiasts look at things with an enthusiast or business outlook on things... For example, the parks see the late hour openings are dead, so cut the hours to save money, however this prevents people getting more out of day and whoring empty rides so it's bad... It's very much one step forward, two steps back, with a lot of cut backs over the past 2 years reducing guest experiences at the parks be it hours, ride times or entertainment whilst promoting higher prices with quite feral amounts of upselling from staff (to a degree where it's mentioned on their tills as a reminder)... It's also weird though, because with Swarm, they did everything right from an enthusiast standpoint, but it (and the park) bombed last year... But perhaps that was the catalyst to hiring the new marketing person and pushing through into the lucrative family market... They have improved food quality (but in turn, raised prices) and the merch as well, because people do buy quality stuff rather than bland generic crap... Two really good positives... On the other hand, you have that whole "good enough" belief towards additions... And in some cases badly thought out aspects of an addition (Zufari being a prime example of this) whilst others like Ice Age and Storm Surge were literally done on the cheap... Do agree with the Sub Terra changes as it was a quality attraction (pre-corridor as well) in the end, though people prefer it with the corridor... In the end, yes, the parks are in a better situation now than they were under DIC, but they still have issues across the board... Namely surrounding guest experiences and the use of social media (something Thorpe have really taken on board in comparison to years before) and providing THE best experiences possible... This might be a challenge as the recession and 'stay'cations dry up in the future... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted August 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2013 Comparing Storm Surge to rides in Staines Town Centre is a werid comparison... They are of equal quality mind (I.e. awful)... Sorry I meant the Octopus Gardens rides it replaced are ones you would expect to see in a town centre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornflakes Posted August 9, 2013 Report Share Posted August 9, 2013 I'm a massive fan of the work done by Merlin Studios, its clear that their are some very intelligent and creative people that have come up with some very interesting ideas and concepts, the consisntent quality output from Merlin Studios has proven this to me, and as they do more attractions, they just get better and better. Merlin let themselves down on the business side of things. They value profit over guest experience, they also make some incredibly short sited desicions, they seem to prefer having an instant profit rather than letting things develop to give them more money in the long run, which means they end up doing things on the cheap to make money faster, rather than splashing out on larger investments which would probably return more in the long run. Some aspects of the Theme Parks have certainly improved under Merlin though, food quality and merch has gone up massively, while still being relatively affordable (its not cheap by any means, but most of the stuff they produce in the fields of dining and merchandise offers a suprising value for money, especially with an Annual Pass) but as Benin said it really is one step forward and two steps back with Merlin. In short, Merlin really needs to up there game and try and provide the best experience they can, rather than cutting corners and relying on instant profit . Inferno and JoshC. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted August 9, 2013 Report Share Posted August 9, 2013 Sorry I meant the Octopus Gardens rides it replaced are ones you would expect to see in a town centre Oh, in that case they had tonnes more theming and atmosphere so were better... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Posted August 9, 2013 Report Share Posted August 9, 2013 It's very much one step forward, two steps back, with a lot of cut backs over the past 2 years reducing guest experiences at the parks be it hours, ride times or entertainment Have we had any cuts to entertainment? All parks seemingly have way way more than they used to - towers had nothing in 07, same with Chessington outside halloween. We now have daily shows and usually roaming actors. The only place which have been cutting Ents was thorpe, to which I think that's pretty much being reversed - would be good to see a show back in showcase. That'll probably come next year I imagine. For merlin, everything bar operations are way better. Food better quality, parks better maintained, better themed rides with which are usually well thought out in terms of layout and ease of use. Sort out their short sightedness and operations, and we'd be all very happy I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshC. Posted August 9, 2013 Report Share Posted August 9, 2013 Investment-wise, Merlin are great. All the parks are getting investments - and good ones at that - and we're seeing attention to older rides too. The only park, in my eyes, that isn't as good is Chessie, for whatever reasons, but I think we're seeing improvements there all the time. Operations haven't been great, we all know that. However, I'd argue Thorpe have been improving a lot this year, with their extended opening hours, consistent ride reliability and such. The only thing which hasn't improved there, arguably, is Fastrack. The other parks haven't been doing as well, with reductions to opening hours, silly decisions (Alton specifically) and other troubles. But I genuinely do think that as time goes on, Merlin's operations will improve. Many things have improved under Merlin as well - merchandise, food outlets (bar the utter miserable failure of Burger Kitchen), attractions, themeing, entertainments (bar Thorpe in the sense that they're not constantly there, but instead just for big events. Though, the events they do pull off are good) and more. I think it goes back to what Cornflakes said - it seems Merlin sometimes value profit too much, and guest satisfaction not enough. Again though, I think that will change in time. I'd happily say Thorpe have recently prioritized guest satisfaction more than before (maybe all this is coincidental with the change in market, but who knows?), and I wouldn't be surprised if we slowly, but surely, see that happen across all parks. So, short answer, Merlin aren't that bad at all. In fact, they're rather good. But the 'wrong' decisions they have made have been big and noticeable ones, which is why they seemingly get so much criticism. Cornflakes and Inferno 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inferno Posted August 9, 2013 Report Share Posted August 9, 2013 I actually think Merlin are pretty damn good tbh. We all love to hate them but you would struggle to find another theme park operator which invests so much in to new attractions so regularly - look at how Thorpe has been transformed over the past 10 years - imagine what it would be like today if RMC still owned it - small investments, low profit margins... I'd assume it wouldn't be at the standard it's at today. You could argue that there is too much focus on new attractions and not enough on the existing ones, but it is very easy for us to sit around and whine about things like that. They are still better than any of their UK competitors by a mile, and if we didn't like what Merlin were doing then we wouldn't be members of the official fansite of a Merlin attraction! The rate that Merlin are expanding across the world shows how brilliant they are. Thorpe Park and Alton Towers are just a tiny part of Merlin's empire. Yeah they make some stupid decisions, but every company does! They still manage to land on their feet most of the time, plus it gives us something to b*tch about! coastercameron98 and AJ 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted August 10, 2013 Report Share Posted August 10, 2013 Think its unfair to give Merlin credit for transforming Thorpe completely since that was a Tussauds thing... As for the global 'empire', a bunch of identikit Midway attractions isnt what I would consider top value... If they want to best Disney, they need to focus on the guest experience, fix up the parks from repainting rides and buildings to producing shows and rides that will bring people back to the park as well as new people... This is why I think the Thorpe change of market will take time to have a real effect because of the reputation of the park... Change that (and the rep of the others) and they can take it in... Indeed, they don't need high levels of Fastrack sales if they can get a family to spend on quality food and merch... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inferno Posted August 10, 2013 Report Share Posted August 10, 2013 If they want to best Disney, they need to focus on the guest experience, fix up the parks from repainting rides and buildings to producing shows and rides that will bring people back to the park as well as new people.... To be fair, they never really say they aim to be better than Disney... Just bigger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt 236 Posted August 10, 2013 Report Share Posted August 10, 2013 In my opinion, Merlin are good but not great. They do very well in advertising and PR stunts as well as general investment. They have installed some rather good rides such as Smiler, Swarm and Zufari but also some bad ones too such as Storm Surge and the now closed Time Voyagers. There up keep on rides is not the best as there are several attractionss that do need some TLC including Colossus, the flume and in theory, half of Chessington's primary and secondary rides. Coaster and coastergod 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastergod Posted August 11, 2013 Report Share Posted August 11, 2013 I quite like their parks and rides, and they have changed the parks that they currently own. Great example is Thorpe. However I think the majority of people who hate Merlin is due to their Overselling of Fastrack, which do slow down queues. I agree with Matt Creek with their advertising, as it is amazing, however They have made some stupid decisions, but all in all, if they want the Family market, they are probably going to need some shows in the showcase, and probably a better 4D film. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastergod Posted August 11, 2013 Report Share Posted August 11, 2013 and here is my point proven. Saw this on their own facebook page. That's the answer for everything. Fastrack. X ride has a terrible queing system on hot days. Nearly pass out before you get on the ride. Like · Reply · 51 minutes ago THORPE PARK Official Did you try our Fastrack? Coaster 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted August 11, 2013 Report Share Posted August 11, 2013 Well how else are they going to afford some shade? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted August 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2013 Dont think you can read to much into that, a marketing department are there to try and make more money for the place! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky Posted August 12, 2013 Report Share Posted August 12, 2013 ^ Which after all is Marketing's main objective... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coaster_monkey Posted August 12, 2013 Report Share Posted August 12, 2013 Merlin let themselves down on the business side of things. They value profit over guest experience, they also make some incredibly short sited desicions, they seem to prefer having an instant profit rather than letting things develop to give them more money in the long run, which means they end up doing things on the cheap to make money faster, rather than splashing out on larger investments which would probably return more in the long run. In short, Merlin really needs to up there game and try and provide the best experience they can, rather than cutting corners and relying on instant profit . If they want to best Disney, they need to focus on the guest experience, fix up the parks from repainting rides and buildings to producing shows and rides that will bring people back to the park as well as new people... This is why I think the Thorpe change of market will take time to have a real effect because of the reputation of the park... Change that (and the rep of the others) and they can take it in... ^ Basically. For me, right from the very beginning Merlin have not and will never care for customer satisfaction. The amount of 'investment' being pumped into the three 'big' parks isn't exactly that great either. Cheap rides advertised as the next best thing since pre-sliced malt loaf. They targeted the complete wrong audience for Thorpe Park and stuck with it, only to now completely do a U-turn. Thats.... not good business. I honestly think Merlin are run by a load of middle aged men/women who are the aunts and uncles you hate because they try too hard to be 'cool' and as if they 'get you'. They only watch BBC Three for market research and hire Pinocchio for the publicity stunts. I have been told to mind what I say in regards that... I don't work behind the scenes. Perhaps I'm wrong, perhaps they are all competent. However, I'm a customer. I'm giving them MY money only to see it being used for advertisements for me to not visit next season because I'm not a tween. I don't like to scream if I want to go faster. I don't listen to ****ing pop. Considering I don't get a refund, I'm entitled to be slightly angry that they choose to ignore the large majority of educated, respectable people in this country. In JUST regards to Thorpe Park, they funked up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted August 12, 2013 Report Share Posted August 12, 2013 Dont think you can read to much into that, a marketing department are there to try and make more money for the place! Hopefully, once Thorpe make money through avenues such as food and merch (those things families LOVE to buy) they'll realise that the way they sell Fastrack is detrimental to guest experience and limit it a lot more... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastergod Posted August 13, 2013 Report Share Posted August 13, 2013 I love how some of us slag off Thorpe, yet we are the official blog/fan group etc. They must love it. Then again, I can see them loving it due to the fact that Any Publicity is good publicity... Not sure if I expressed myself well enough... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted August 14, 2013 Report Share Posted August 14, 2013 Just because this is an official fansite shouldn't mean we can't pick apart the failings of a park (this goes for ANY official fansite)... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EC! Posted August 14, 2013 Report Share Posted August 14, 2013 Well call it slagging off, its just the opinions we have as a thorpe park fanbase and I'm sure they just take it like constructive criticism, we aren't conformed to say good things all the time like "Storm Surge is one sexy beast" instead of what we really say which is "storm surge is a pile of s**t." Everyone has an opinion whether people disagree or not, and its not like thorpe are going to shut us down because of one bad thing said. Anyway I agree with most of you in the fact of them seeming to takes 1 step forward, 2 steps back, but then like marc said when it all comes down to it, merlin have to make money and if that is by annoying the hell out of us by selling loads and loads of fasttrack then unfortunately that is what they must do although I still think what happened with Swarm on saturday was ridiculous. Anyways I hope Merlin make some good decisions in the future so we can enjoy the parks even more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastergod Posted August 14, 2013 Report Share Posted August 14, 2013 fair enough. Although I would have hoped that if you are on this fan site, you would like Thorpe, and maybe their ways, although I agree you should have your say. Unfortunately I haven't really seen them take much criticism on until recently, e.g Summer nights. All in All, though they have one main job, which is to have good rides(which make them money, as more people would want to visit for the ride etc.) We all enjoy some of the rides, otherwise we wouldn't create an account(theres no point if you don't enjoy the rides, and just come on to slag them off/make your opinion), however Thorpe can improve our Experience in many ways. Few things off the top of my head: 1. limit Fastrack, or handle it better(not only place with bad fastrack in merlin's parks.) 2.Enforce the Smoking rule in queues (the amount of times I have had the smell of smoke, which is not pleasant, in the queue where it should not be). 3. Better Customer service (when I complained about one of the staff there, there was no reply for a few weeks, and when they replied it was the pre-written sh*t which had not even mentioned my problem, which I won't go into) 4. Better staff training- Now some staff are very good!, some are really kind and some even hate merlin themselves.. HOWEVER there is a minority which always ruin the experience. They don't want to be there, well give their jobs to the people who need them and want to be there. I know this may be exaggerated but this is my opinion, and I hope these problems get solved soon. There are still more but these are just the few off the top of my head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddieGreen Posted May 24, 2014 Report Share Posted May 24, 2014 Having been to Thorpe twice, Chessington and Alton Towers once this season I have been impressed with Merlin staff. However I only go midweek. I get the feeling that Merlin struggle with dealing with busier times. Sent from my TegraNote-P1640 using Tapatalk OldFarmerDean 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kerfuffle Posted May 25, 2014 Report Share Posted May 25, 2014 Still remember those days of what John Wardley calls "the dark patch". Didn't he say that when it was announced that Merlin took over, you could hear the CHEERS of everyone in the company! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexander Posted May 25, 2014 Report Share Posted May 25, 2014 When you have parks investing 500k in a play area when they're not a huge park or owned by a theme park giant, it makes you wonder... They deserve credit when it's due though definitely as they have done a lot of good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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