Benin Posted August 13, 2015 Report Share Posted August 13, 2015 You'd think after nearly 10 years of Imperial Leather Bubbleworks people would've stopped blaming Merlin for sommat they didn't do... All for the Merlin bashing, but at least blame them for things they actually DID... HermanTheGerman and Merry-go-girl 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJ Posted August 13, 2015 Report Share Posted August 13, 2015 Some division of Tussauds Studios did IL BubbleWorks, Tusaauds Studios became Merlin Studios so it is the same company today. But still, some things have changed since then so can it be considered Merlin's job? Yes and no Because by that logic you could then also say Merlin were responsible for The 5th Dimension and Spirit of London, so obviously management has changed enormously over time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merry-go-girl Posted August 13, 2015 Report Share Posted August 13, 2015 Maybe he is lying. Still this does not change the fact that this is Merlin and they suck balls at creating dark rides. LOOK WHAT THEY DID TO BUBBLEWORKS!!!!!!! Merlin saved Bubbleworks by arranging a sponsor to pour money into the ride and bring it back from the brink. Yeah, what Imperial Leather did sucks, but without them and their money there'd probably be no Bubbleworks at all today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJ Posted August 13, 2015 Report Share Posted August 13, 2015 What? The BubbleWorks was fine, it had been technically refurbished only 5 years prior and still uses the same systems now. It had got a bit dirty but hardly what I'd call "at the brink", and hardly any money was involved in the redesign, it was cheap and quick all the way. All that was done in 2005 was tear out animatronics that could have still worked greatly had any attention bee given to them at all, thoughtlessly paint over everything and botch up the audio and lighting systems. The ride was worn in 2005 but all it needed was tuning and replenishing to get it back. The original 1990 ride was designed to last. And it was certainly still more popular in 2005 than it is now. I could go on !! Don'tcha touch me Bubbles! pluk and HermanTheGerman 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshC. Posted August 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 13, 2015 Still this does not change the fact that this is Merlin and they suck balls at creating dark rides. Merlin have built a grand total of 2 dark rides in their 8 or so years of being in charge - Sub Terra and Ghost at Legoland Billund. Whilst Sub Terra isn't exactly popular any more, it's still a nice little dark ride. I've heard some positive things about Ghost too. So where on earth you've got the idea that they "suck balls" from is a mystery to me. slendercat, Altitude and holtjammy16 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJ Posted August 13, 2015 Report Share Posted August 13, 2015 Whilst I wouldn't say they "suck balls", from talking to contractors who regularly worked with Merlin/Tussauds on such attractions and now refuse to work for them ever again since Sub Terra.. No, to defend Merlin's dark ride efforts in the UK is just plain naive. And several of the top people behind recent attractions had been there since the earlier (good) Tussauds days so there's no good excuse for poor efforts now that they are/were in control. Let's really hope they learn to be showmen and turn things around, because if this Thorpe Park one flops, they'd probably never attempt a big dark ride again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Mitchada04 Posted August 13, 2015 Popular Post Report Share Posted August 13, 2015 Big news. The offensive ride has a roof. 4 Such anti climatic construction. I mean we all knew they'd put a roof there :/ Very offensive here. That hose pipe could be supplying clean water to African children. Note the scaffolding access tower being built. We knew that'd happen. Yawn And they have started cementing around the pit and ready to cement the rebar for the other part of building part 2. I'm offended. Whiteknuckle, Olistjj, Matt 236 and 7 others 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshC. Posted August 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 13, 2015 ^They blatantly just put that roof on to protect them from the rain... Whilst I wouldn't say they "suck balls", from talking to contractors who regularly worked with Merlin/Tussauds on such attractions and now refuse to work for them ever again since Sub Terra.. No, to defend Merlin's dark ride efforts in the UK is just plain naive. And several of the top people behind recent attractions had been there since the earlier (good) Tussauds days so there's no good excuse for poor efforts now that they are/were in control.Let's really hope they learn to be showmen and turn things around, because if this Thorpe Park one flops, they'd probably never attempt a big dark ride again. They've made one dark ride in the UK. It seems unfair for us to judge them on one ride. Okay, you can flip the coin and say it's hard to judge either way, but the point still stands - we can't generalise how Merlin dark rides actually ride on one ride! Altitude 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJ Posted August 13, 2015 Report Share Posted August 13, 2015 No they have years of dark ride history in their company, Merlin Studios are a restructured version of the old Tussauds Studios. In the past they have done The 5th Dimension, The Spirit of London, Toyland Tours and Hex all completely in-house. Of course the lead designers and project managers from those older rides have left to work for other companies, but many of those in charge today (or in charge until recently) were junior designers back in the day. The company have the experience and lessons from recent history to create a great dark ride, just when management changed things lost all direction, proper expertise and effort to create the best dark ride. For certain reasons (that's a different topic) anyone with attraction design experience could have predicted Sub Terra as the flop it sadly turned out to be, they just pressed ahead anyway rather misguidedly. I hope they're not doing the same with WC16 and are outsourcing more of the project to passionate teams that will do a great job. I'm not judging them by one finished ride, I have more insight than that to judge them the way I am. I'm not trying to sound pessimistic, I just want things to change for the better and the more people 'gloss over' poor industry standards - things ain't going to change. I'm glad some people NOW enjoy Sub Terra as a ride experience, but all that really happened to save it post-opening were a lot of Grandma remedies that are wearing off only 3 years on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxbennxx Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Let me explain myself more clearly. Merlin suck balls at THEMING any of their uk rides. This is not due to Merlin Studios who come up with beautiful concepts and visions for what they want their project to be. Head Office will not approve the necessary budget to bring that concept from page to reality, so they end up going with some diluted partial theming with only the slightest hint at what the original theme should have been. Didn't mean to incite a debate. Merlin studios are stuck between a rock and a hard place, as Head office need to put stock in their ability to deliver a world class ride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 I would say the interior of Sub Terra is actually really well themed and high quality... Not sure how they could've themed the exterior mind to make it fit into the theme... Thirteen has some decent theming as well, aside from the SHED poking out... In fairness, the theming that does come into play is actually good... The Marmaliser is a fantastic set-piece in amongst the tangled track of Smiler is one of my favourite examples of their attempts at themeing... It's just a shame that the budget gets shredded and we end up with Smiler's station building, or daft decisions like no roof on Swarm's station... Altitude, HermanTheGerman and Cal 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HermanTheGerman Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 My feelings towards this project are rather mixed. I don't want it to flop because, as others have said, it would probably result in Merlin ruling out any form of dark ride development ever again. But on the otherhand, from what I know about the attraction, it does sound rather dull. Hopefully they've outsourced most of it though, then we might actually stand a chance... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshC. Posted August 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Let me explain myself more clearly. Merlin suck balls at THEMING any of their uk rides. This is not due to Merlin Studios who come up with beautiful concepts and visions for what they want their project to be. Head Office will not approve the necessary budget to bring that concept from page to reality, so they end up going with some diluted partial theming with only the slightest hint at what the original theme should have been. Didn't mean to incite a debate. Merlin studios are stuck between a rock and a hard place, as Head office need to put stock in their ability to deliver a world class ride. I see what you're saying now, though I still disagree slightly. The UK parks can do some great theming - Swarm being the best example in a major project in my opinion. But then the likes of Smiler, Saw and Th13teen even have their good bits, and some smaller attractions like I'm a Celeb and even Scorpion Express have some good bits. But they do fail with the finer details and general effects, I agree. Can certainly see why this would give cause for concern with a dark ride! (No worries about inciting a debate though - that's what a forum is all about after all ) It's just a shame that the budget gets shredded and we end up with Smiler's station building, or daft decisions like no roof on Swarm's station... The plans for Swarm never showed the station to have a roof, which I think was down to making it easier to get planning approval, since Thorpe are restricted on the amount of indoor space they can have (for flood risks, etc.). So I don't think that was ever down to budget cuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 I wasn't saying that the lack of roof was cut, I just think it's a daft idea, given the design reasons behind it (a roofless building wouldn't require a fire exit, to which Ms Holland wasn't a fan of for some reason, imagine how atmospheric Swarm's station could've been if it had been enclosed)... It's that balance of design ideas and eventual cutting up of budgets which is always the worry... Cal 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshC. Posted August 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Ah sorry, did misunderstand you there! I agree Swarm's station would be much better if it was (partially) enclosed; I can just imagine an eerie atmosphere in there with the occasional train 'crashing' through the roof being a brilliant thing to watch. Liam T 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slendercat Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Ah sorry, did misunderstand you there! I agree Swarm's station would be much better if it was (partially) enclosed; I can just imagine an eerie atmosphere in there with the occasional train 'crashing' through the roof being a brilliant thing to watch. You saying that makes me hate Merlin for not putting a roof on. [emoji23] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxbennxx Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 All I want is a solid story and fun ride system, whilst not compromising on set design or effects due to budget constraints. If they provide this, icwill be a happy man. There has not been a decent dark ride since valhalla, I don't class 4, 5 metre ABC drop towers in a shed as a true dark ride, though sub-terra is an ok attempt. Fingers crossed. slendercat 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Allgood Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 How cool would this project be if john wardley was involved and no one knew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slendercat Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 How cool would this project be if john wardley was involved and no one knew Stop getting my hopes up [emoji23] Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxbennxx Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 If this is not Dr Who, it will likely be a Lionsgate IP. They won't let that deal lapse I would imagine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshC. Posted August 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 How cool would this project be if john wardley was involved and no one knew It'd be about as cool as Loggers' new tunnel, and Nemesis going backwards. ImLucifer 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Allgood Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 It'd be about as cool as Loggers' new tunnel, and Nemesis going backwards. I see what you did there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodge2002 Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 They may not be rides in their entirety, but lets not forget Merlin are also responsible for most of the current Dungeons, which are all themed to a fantastic standard. They just created Shrek's adventure, which is being very well received for its level of detail, and let's not forget, despite its lack of popularity, Saw Live is one of the most immersive and true to its source attractions in the UK. We have no idea what Merlin are going to come up with, because we really have no comparison. Comparing Sub-terra to what this ride might be like, is almost like comparing Octonauts to The Swarm. People often make comparisons to European parks, but it just doesn't work like that. There is a massive variance in how much bang you get for your buck. Of COURSE Europa and Phantasialand are going to be better. Germany is a VERY wealthy country, and can contain most of its manufacturing within its own walls. And when a theme park aspires beyond its economy? That's when you end up with Disneyland Paris and £1.5bn of debt. I'm not saying Merlin couldn't perhaps aspire to more at times, but unfortunately that is the byproduct of the fact the company is run by investors who like to play it safe, not a media giant, or a wealthy family. HermanTheGerman, Kerfuffle, JoshC. and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxbennxx Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 The Dungeons has been in existence long before Merlin came along, and all variants are just copies of a pre existing product but tweeked slightly for each city they pop up in. Shrek's Adventure was designed, animated, and signed ofd by Dreamworks, who would not allow a cheap representation of their work, Merlin simply constructed it and operated it. Furthermore, they are now going to copy the dungeons model and clone the attraction several times. Saw alive is essentially the same deal as Shrek, Lionsgate would have to have had say on the final product, as a poor representation of their brand is not acceptable. I would argue that having an IP attached will hold the park to some of agreement that they represent the brand to an exceptional standard, which may prove to be a better finished product than an original ride. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian-S Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Had a quick look tonight, couldn't take photo's sorry, but those inner arches/loops are now having something attached to them (looks like internal theming/supports), so I guess the theory of it being something ripper related could be right, at a guess I'd say maybe they could be forming some railway arches. I have a feeling this is going to turn out to be another one of these 'experience' type attractions that Merlin seem so obsessed with, rather than something actually thrilling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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