Hyperia Speculation and Construction Thread

[Project LC]

Now we have a POV in no limits I'm now also concerned with the rides pacing. The third element seems too large and ends up having some slow hang time at the top and then the "splash down" has to take out huge amounts of speed so it can go round the outer banked turn. 

 

In my opinion the ride is wrong in pretty much every aspect. It will still be decent but I am in the belief a vastly better layout was possible on the site. Thorpe will be able to sell it but it sure isn't what the park needed. 

[Matt N]

WARNING: This post ended up being longer than I expected, so I apologise in advance for its length. I also apologise if I repeat myself a bit in places; concise writing isn't my strong point...

I apologise in advance for the long ramble, but I have a potentially controversial opinion; the proposal is really growing on me quite strongly, and I have to say that after a bit of thought, a bit of hindsight and perspective, and a more detailed look at the layout, I'm now really quite impressed with it and in genuine awe of what Merlin and Mack have pulled off here! I think this ride, although not what I was expecting, is actually a true stroke of genius on Merlin and Thorpe's part when viewed in context, and is something to really be proud of and get excited about!

 

I won't lie, my original hope was for something with a greater focus on airtime. Prior to Thursday's consultation, my fantasy for Thorpe's next coaster was a sprawling out and back B&M Hyper, or given the site, perhaps a B&M hyper twister. (A typical out and back would be easier said than done from Old Town for sure, and would certainly have required Thorpe to think outside the box). Upon the Mack hyper rumour beginning to circulate after Thursday's consultation, I then began to have visions of a Mack hyper twister with loads of twisty airtime hills and fun turns; something akin to an upscaled Alpina Blitz, or perhaps a twistier DC Rivals. So in that regard, I'll confess that I was certainly torn when I initially saw the layout, and not instantly enamoured like I'd perhaps hoped. The layout isn't what I was expecting, nor what I was personally hoping for or what I would have chosen; it doesn't look to have much of an airtime focus on the face of it, and while I'm sure it will have airtime (and quite strong airtime at that) in places, I maintain that it doesn't look like an airtime machine per se in the same way that many other hyper coasters are.

 

However, when I took off my B&M Hyper airtime goggles and saw this ride for what it is, I grew more and more impressed by it, and more and more excited to ride it. Yes, I do feel that like many of you, I would probably have vastly preferred British Shambhala or British DC Rivals to this coaster if based purely on personal preference, but looking at things with a little hindsight; within the space, and within the tight budget that Merlin/Thorpe had to work with, I'm convinced that this is just about the best outcome we could have hoped for. I actually feel it's a genuine stroke of brilliance from Mack and Merlin, because it looks like they've managed to fulfill the basic criteria that I felt Thorpe's next coaster required (a ride that makes a statement, is fun and rerideable, and is easily marketable) with not a ton in the way of resources with which to pull off such a beast of a ride.

 

When you're sat at home on Google Earth looking at Thorpe Park and scoping out coaster options, it's very easy to say "I think it'll be a 250ft B&M Hyper like Shambhala, that will have a big row of airtime hills going either over the lake or around the back of the park. Or it might be twisty with a load of twisted airtime hills, like the Hot Go hyper". Believe me, I know that... because that's exactly what I spent the bulk of the rumour phase doing! However in hindsight, I think things like this should be viewed in context. In terms of the site; they simply wouldn't have fitted a big old out and back coaster in there without some serious outside the box thinking. Sure, it could have been done, but it would have been tough. If I'm being honest, I don't think Old Town was the ideal site for a Thorpe hyper, and I think putting the station on the island next to Swarm and having it run round the back of Swarm towards the front of the park would have been a far more ideal fit for a hyper, but that's for another time. In terms of budget; as much as I was one of the keenest advocates for British Shambhala, I simply don't think Merlin has the cash to build such a ride, in hindsight.

 

With that context in mind, my point is; if you look at the space, cost and length Exodus had to work with, as well as the height they had to build to, I'm really, really impressed with what Merlin and Mack have pulled off here, personally. While it doesn't look to be overtly packed with airtime as such, the airtime potential is still there in places, and the ride looks to have some elements that could ride very well; for instance, I can't wait to experience that first drop, or that overbank that rolls into an inversion! To put it simply; while Exodus doesn't have a huge amount of elements, the elements it does have look like they could be pretty incredible, in my opinion! Not to mention that I also think it looks about as dominant as a hyper this compact could have done, which will really help with marketing and making it look impressive; great move, Thorpe!

 

Also, as much as I was initially hoping for a B&M Hyper Coaster; when putting aside all fantasies of British Mako or Shambhala and looking at things through the same brief that Exodus had to work within (in terms of the restrictions in space, cost and length, as well as the minimum height to build to), I'm not necessarily sure that B&M would have come up with anything more highly received. Don't get me wrong, I love the B&M Hyper I've done to bits, and I think under ideal circumstances, they could have done a terrific B&M Hyper at Thorpe that I and many others would have adored, but based on what I know about B&M as a company, I think they would have really struggled with the Exodus brief, particularly in the context of the B&M Hyper Coaster, a ride type that traditionally thrives when working with a large amount of space, a long track length and a large amount of money if wanting to build a ride of any significant height; although it's a tall ride that on paper would have worked perfectly at Thorpe, the ideal brief for a B&M Hyper Coaster is almost the polar opposite to the brief Exodus had to work with (minimum height aside, of course). And if you look at the site they're using, the length they were constrained to and the type of layout Exodus has, favouring big, dominant elements built for sheer visual impact... speaking realistically, I'm honestly unsure if a B&M Hyper would have lived up to expectations.

 

Imagine for a second that this had been a B&M Hyper. Assuming a ride of the same height and length and utilising the exact same footprint, I imagine that it would have struggled in a number of regards. For instance, I don't see B&M doing some daringly twisted drop like has been done here, so a decent bit of your track length would need to go towards some giant 180 degree turnaround directly after the drop, probably going about where the huge overbank is on Exodus; if the ride is dropping from a height of 236ft, it would probably need to be close to 200ft tall to be vaguely rideable in terms of forces, so a lot of track would be needed for this. After your turnaround, you could maybe fit one parabolic hill in at a push, but looking at Exodus, I'm honestly unsure if the site length would be long enough without extending the footprint... so you'd have to do another giant u-turn. Maybe repeat this pattern once more, do the splashdown to shave off speed, and then you're hitting the brake run, which would probably have necessitated a fair bit of track to get it high enough off the ground based on recent B&M creations and how I know B&M doesn't like to brake too forcefully at the end of a ride. No space at all for any of those brilliant parabolic floater hills within that footprint and length constraint. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure this ride would have been excellent, even if only for the raw speed of it, and B&M would have done something crafty with the turnarounds to make them really fun, but rightly or wrongly, I feel like that would have had enthusiasts gazing longingly at B&M Hypers abroad and tutting about what a rubbish example of the ride type it was, which Thorpe certainly wouldn't have wanted.

 

With Exodus on the other hand; the ride looks so unique, and so creative and daring in terms of its elements, that it looks like something really special that can't be compared with anything else. They've utilised the space and length phenomenally and pulled off a genuinely excellent-looking coaster, in my opinion; while not the longest of rides, some of the elements look like they could be absolutely sensational, and it's actually turning heads around the world and making people abroad jealous, which I think is a surefire sign that they've done an excellent job, personally.

 

I know I've rambled on a bit here (sorry to waste your time...), so I'll wrap this up. In conclusion; my stance on this coaster has changed considerably since yesterday, and after a bit of thought and reflection, I can't wait to see this take shape, I'm absolutely pumped to ride it, and while I know it sounds overly sentimental, the creativity and innovation shown in this ride makes me really quite proud to be British.

 

I understand why people might be disappointed, but viewing this ride in context, I'm absolutely chuffed with what I'm seeing! Bring on opening day; I can't wait to try Exodus out, and I'm confident it'll be a huge, huge hit!

[ML27]

That post was a great read! You’ve made some great points.  I think every enthusiast should try to take that view point and see how they feel. It’s a clever coaster for the space. I wonder once the surprise has settled, everyone will grow to like it… I mean everyone will on opening day.
 

I think the fact of the matter is that the U.K. does not have the space to have an out and back coaster.

 

If they were to build an out and back coaster from old town to swarm island. It would be logistically challenging and also take up a lot of space for one coaster. 
 

Leaving the island and area next to swarm island free is a great idea. It means potentially we get two different coaster types than one big hyper. Within the next decade, will we get two major coasters…..

[Matt N]

5 minutes ago, ML27 said:

That post was a great read! You’ve made some great points. 

Thank you; I'm glad you liked it! And with regard to the comments I noticed you added about Exodus after I initially wrote this comment; I completely agree!

 

I do apologise for what a long, rambling mess it is, though; I'll admit that the length of my post is perhaps ironic given the length of the ride I'm talking about... I just timed myself reading my post, and I took approximately 6 minutes and 54 seconds to read it in full (I'm so sorry...).

 

For some perspective; assuming a full ride duration of around 1 minute and 30 seconds (based on what people have said and various NL2 creations I've seen), the ride would have done approximately 4.6 full cycles in the amount of time it took me to read my post... if we're going with the lift to brake run duration of approximately 40 seconds (at an optimistic guess), the ride could have negotiated the main thrilling body of its circuit approximately 10.4 times...

[Inferno]

4 hours ago, pluk said:

I hate it for that adverse camber nonsense straight out of the station. Pack it in.

 

Pack it in HAHA!

Tbh I thought the same, I don’t understand stuff like that - it’s just a bit awkward and uncomfortable for no reason isn’t it 😂

 

@Matt N That’s a good point about Goliath. That is quite a short layout isn’t it, but seems like a great ride.  Judging by the POVs though it still seems to be longer than Exodus.

I guess we need to take the recreations with a pinch of salt though. I still have a feeling the layout will change.

 

It’s dawning on me how absolutely enormous this ride actually is on the skyline.. 

I mean good lord look at it compared to Colossus.

 

 

I’m feeling positive about it and very much looking forward to seeing more!!

[Hethetheth]

To counter the longer posts:

 

I like the look of it!

[Matt 236]

For some reason I’m getting Hyperion vibes with this, which makes no sense given the lack of similarities.

 

I am excited regardless to see (what will hopefully) be such a substantial ride and investment arrive and hit Thorpe and the U.K. I never foresaw the day where we would see this park propose such attraction, especially on the prospect of stealing the U.K. height record.

 

Ok, I must confess there looks to be less ‘airtime’ than desired and I was more leaning on a B&M hyper, but the concept does look exciting. A splashdown sure looks interesting which is more common in American/European parks. It isn’t the longest coaster and it never was going to be. 
 

Seeing (most of) Old Town undergo the bulldozer in the near future may be emotional to some given it’s significance, but it’s time has come for newer and greater things.

 

This will be a long two plus years.

[ML27]

I can’t help but think how random the Burger King and Toilet Block will look with that semi western theme. 
 

That’s Thorpe tho, a mix of the old and new.

[Matt N]

26 minutes ago, ML27 said:

I can’t help but think how random the Burger King and Toilet Block will look with that semi western theme. 
 

That’s Thorpe tho, a mix of the old and new.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Burger King getting demolished in favour of the ride maintenance shed?

[ML27]

8 minutes ago, Matt N said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Burger King getting demolished in favour of the ride maintenance shed?

Unfortunately not, positioned perfectly behind Burger King tho!

 

 

[pluk]

On 12/9/2021 at 10:13 PM, JoshC. said:

-Existing rides: They said they're looking to retain "at least one of the existing rides".

 

It's loggers, isn't it? 😄

[Matt N]

Building upon what I said within my ridiculously long ramble (once again, I'm incredibly sorry about that...) about how I predicted that B&M wouldn't necessarily have pulled off anything any better than what we're getting had they been given the same site and brief to play with, I decided to have a go at building a similarly specced B&M Hyper within a site similar in size to what Mack had to play with for Exodus, to give you guys some idea of what I feel B&M might have come up with within the brief that Exodus seems to have followed. I apologise for the slightly shonky trackwork in places, but it was something I cobbled together quite quickly to show a basic idea of what I feel B&M may have done with the brief; I know the profiling isn't the funkiest or most adventurous, and B&M's actual work would have been far more fun and interesting, this is just to offer you all a basic idea:

To clarify a few things that I can sense may be asked:

• The bit I left blank was supposed to represent the bit they've left for the plaza within the real proposal; I tried to make this ride fill as much of a similar area to Exodus as possible.
• I built the ride to a height of 236ft, the exact same as the real proposal. Track length is 3,310ft, top speed is 82mph, and ride duration looks to be 30-40 seconds from lift to brakes, so broadly similar to what Thorpe are proposing.
• The bit with the water splash rings and trim brakes is supposed to represent a splashdown; sorry if it's a bit clumsy-looking, but PlanCo doesn't do real splashdowns with water brakes, so it's the closest thing I could pull off. In terms of the deceleration rate in this section; I went for 4m/s^2.
• The ride has 2 trains with 7 rows/28 riders each.

I don't know about you, but as much as I would have loved a B&M Hyper at Thorpe, and I think a big, sprawling out and back would appeal to me a fair bit more than Exodus looks to, this makes me pretty glad they went for the ride they did instead of trying to cram a B&M Hyper into a brief that's not overly suited to one. I could only fit one singular speed hill into this layout (no full-size parabolic hills), and the rest of it mainly consists of drawn-out, high curves (I can sense Thorpe would have wanted a visually impacting ride regardless of whether it had high inversions or not, so I purposely didn't go for low elements like B&M may have done if left to their own devices) in a similar vein to Thunder Dolphin if it didn't have the building. While I wouldn't say something like this would have been a poor ride by any means, I suspect that had Thorpe come out with something like this, people would have been somewhat disappointed, and it would have made people gaze longingly at foreign B&M Hypers thinking about what could have been; it looks to have less airtime than many UK coasters. In that regard, it makes me all the more chuffed that Merlin and Mack pulled off what they have within the plot, because as I said, I think we have the best possible outcome we could have gotten from a hyper built within the project's constraints, personally.

 

TL;DR: I had a go at building a B&M Hyper within the brief that Exodus had, and it had very little airtime, instead looking more like Thunder Dolphin sans the building. This makes me very happy that Thorpe went for the ride they did instead of trying to cram a B&M Hyper into a brief not overly suited to one.

[2542464]

5 hours ago, Inferno said:

It’s dawning on me how absolutely enormous this ride actually is on the skyline..

Saw and Colossus are absolutely dwarfed by this thing in all the renderings of Exodus. I wonder how many people are going to go on this thing first, and then be absolutely disappointed by the older coasters afterwards. Even just visually, Saw looks like a children's ride in front of this thing.

In all honesty, I hope this paves the way for bigger and faster coasters in the UK like the ones our cousins in America enjoy.

[FoolishSkeleton]

I think it looks like a great ride. Yeah it's a bit short and the 'splashdown' facing away is kind of odd, but there is nothing else in the UK on this scale, breaking the height record and introducing unusual elements like the large outerbank turn.

 

This may be a dumb question but is there any feasibility that the lift hill is actually not a lift hill but rather an upward launch? 

[Inferno]

I suppose it could be a launch 🤔 Although that could make the already fast layout even faster.

who knows at this stage I guess 

 

God I hope the first drop isn’t trimmed 😐

 

That’s a good point about the western style Burger King and toilets - I really hope those are either rethemed or replaced.

Old Town BK isn’t really a nice place is it. A new restaurant would be much better now, it’s very small and cramped and a bit 90s.

 

I was originally hoping this project was going to include the development of that entire corner of the park rather than just “a ride stuck on the side of it”.

I’d like to see Slammer removed, all the western buildings gone, and have the ride properly surrounded by a nice new area, with a decent shop and maybe a new restaurant.

Here’s hoping that still happens. It would be a shame to have such a big ride and not finish it off.

 

Come on Thorpe - please do it well and don’t half arse it like you have with basically everything else for the last 9 years.

[ML27]

I’m worried this coaster won’t be themed. I’m already sensing an amusement park styled area for this coaster.
 

Merlin are clever with theming but the plaza isn’t big enough to have Swarm styled theming. The coaster has a very messy layout to have a wickerman/ swarm styled interaction.

 

Again, I’m not too clued up if they can change exteriors of buildings to retheme them without planning permission. 

[2542464]

 

Best POVs from coasters in the planning stages always come from Amusement Insider (imo) and they tend to be fairly accurate to when they're finally built, so without further ado the best POV based on the current plans.

[Mark9]

I'm enjoying the B&M hyper discourse. As if an efficient, high capacity, (RELIABLE!) crowd pleasing rollercoaster wasn't exactly what Thorpe needed right now. I'm not saying that what they've gone for won't be popular, I just look at the way people come off Silver Star, Shambhala, Mako, Behemoth (to name a few) and know that for all the spectacle Exodus provides, its substance seems really questionable.

On 12/12/2021 at 2:10 AM, 2542464 said:

Saw and Colossus are absolutely dwarfed by this thing in all the renderings of Exodus. I wonder how many people are going to go on this thing first, and then be absolutely disappointed by the older coasters afterwards. Even just visually, Saw looks like a children's ride in front of this thing.

In all honesty, I hope this paves the way for bigger and faster coasters in the UK like the ones our cousins in America enjoy.

 

I think its okay, after all Stealth has been 100 foot higher than nearly everything around it for 15 years and it hasn't dented the other rides enthusiasm. Inferno and Swarm are still seen as Thorpe's best two rides (according to the park in 2019 anyway).

[1729]

On 12/9/2021 at 11:24 PM, Parm Pap said:

The first section has been realised.

 

But.

 

There is not full steam ahead.

 

Prepare for a rocky few years.

 

Ding dong, ding dong.

Working on the assumption this is not a troll and this is a Thorpe account (which has happened before with DBGT)

 

first section: obviously first part of a plan but section? my mind thinks rail block sections but coater sections?

 

Not full steam ahead: well that's in relation to probably the fact its got to get trough planning approval, also this means the trains are being removed and plat 15 with it.

 

Rocky years: again not set in stone and rocky express is going as suggesed

 

The sign off, tannoy? clock = time = time traveller = mack, mack spinner? 

 

if true its nicely cryptic

[Parm Pap]

We all must wait and see.

 

Time passes slowly... or is it quickly.

 

It can be either or in no time at all.

 

Be brilliantly covertly desist wait.

 

Ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong.

[JoshC.]

On 12/7/2021 at 10:43 AM, Parm Pap said:

This will be a big one.

 

But.

 

Will it go.  Ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong.

 

Time will tell.

 

Time.

 

On 12/8/2021 at 4:33 PM, Parm Pap said:

It would be too Early to say.

 

But.

 

There is sOmEthing I can say.  Ding dong ding dong.  Then.

 

It will all be xplained.

 

BOE - Face of Boe

Time

"xplained"...ex...Exterminate 

 

On 12/9/2021 at 11:24 PM, Parm Pap said:

The first section has been realised.

 

But.

 

There is not full steam ahead.

 

Prepare for a rocky few years.

 

Ding dong, ding dong.

Time.

 

14 minutes ago, Parm Pap said:

We all must wait and see.

 

Time passes slowly... or is it quickly.

 

It can be either or in no time at all.

 

Be brilliantly covertly desist wait.

 

Ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong.

 

Time.

 

BBC DW...BBC Doctor Who. 

 

Cool. We get it. You're trying to say this will be themed around Doctor Who. 

Maybe either come out and say it or try and actually add to the conversation next time ey?

 

I feel like I've gone in the Tardis because this feels like I've gone back 7 years when people were saying Ghost Train was going to be a Doctor Who IP...

[Parm Pap]

1 minute ago, JoshC. said:

 

Maybe either come out and say it or try and actually add to the conversation next time ey?

 

That would be nowhere near as much fun.

 

And.

 

I would not be allowed to say that.

[Project LC]

16 minutes ago, Parm Pap said:

We all must wait and see.

 

Time passes slowly... or Is it quickly.

 

It can be either or in no time at all.

 

Be brilliantly covertly desist wait.

 

Ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong.

 

Pretty sure I got it. Too short ride! 

 

In reality though Id prefer for it to not be doctor who related or any IP for that matter. An original idea about time would be interesting to see but I would hope the budget is there to retheme the buildings in old town. 

[ML27]

Ride Rater went to the online consultation and a few good points were made.

 

Full credit to them, article linked below.

“

Poulter added that the removal of existing rollercoasters was not part of planning for the new ride, but that details of the removal of the retired Slammer ride would likely be released prior to the start of the 2022 season.”

 

Good to see that slammer should be removed by the time this new area opens. Much needed and also opens up the possibility to more attractions in that area. 
 

This also hints at the possibility that the Old Town Burger King area could still be refreshed to fit in at a later date under a different planning application before the coaster opens.

 

“

Poulter said that Thorpe Park’s attendances had reduced in the past decade, an issue made worse when new investments were not made in the Surrey attraction.

He added that that the theme park was not looking to return to the 2-million-plus attendances seen previously.

“The objective is not to return to the high points of 2009-2011,” he said.“

Again, good to see them being honest with themselves about the situation. It’s sad to see they are not aiming high anymore.

 

 

link : Blog Post

 

 

[1729]

 

I mean pretty much confirmed Parm Pap isnt thorpe being thorpe.

too obvious too early

 

bring back Drew Bronner