SAW: The Ride

[RideAddict]

Alex, are you saying that Saw was not done properly? Because I think it has been superbly done, so please give us an example of one not done properly.

[Pickles]

Alex, are you saying that Saw was not done properly? Because I think it has been superbly done, so please give us an example of one not done properly.

Saw.

[RideAddict]

Highly disagree.

[TPJames]

I think saw is unique and most importantly a great coaster- if we were back in 2009 we would be saying that it was the best themed ride in the park. I now think it is second bestly themed after the swarm but is my second favourite ride in the park(stealth 1st!)

I think the THEMEING is superb to be honest but that is just my opinion, I think saw is a great attraction and no one is going to stop me saying that

[SteveJ]

Saw is one of the least imaginative roller coasters I have ever been on in the UK. It has barely any substance to it and just relies on the Saw IP to be popular. At first, the novelty of Thorpe Park having a 'dark ride hybrid' coaster was exciting, but even back in 2009 it confused me as to how anybody could think Saw was the "best ride in the world".

You queue through an endless maze of tall metal fences. It's in a very secluded area of the park so you feel appropriately abandoned when walking around, and this feeling is aided by the tense ambience loop. Annoying American police voice overs and rusty traps to illustrate the theme. Ok. By this point, you would have noticed that the warehouse is just a big box decorated with rusty metal and broken wood. Architecturally it is incredibly boring, offering no interaction with the surrounding paths and it sticks out like they simply plonked it on the flat ground..

Then your entrance to this 'warehouse' consists of a rectangular hole cut in the side of the building, with a CCTV camera above it. The opportunity for suspense is completely missed. The interior corridor seems promising with the gun effect, which often provokes reactions from guests, but the atmosphere is ruined once you get to the stairs and the Fastrack entrance floods the room with light. Meanwhile noisy TV screens play an inevitable queueline video which adds nothing to the overall experience. There is no sense of approaching danger as you climb the bare stairs, and a plastic dummy in fake barbed wire does nothing to rectify the lack of atmosphere.

Things get better once we enter the station, since it actually gets quite dark in there and there are many details to look at, such as the trap drawings and flickering windows. You board your car and for a moment there is a genuine sense of impending terror, as you see the track curve off into darkness and the set of cogs/wheels suggesting some kind of nasty machine. The car sets off, but immediately you are disappointed. The Billy doll is a laughable animatronic whose primitive mouth movement is more amusing than frightening. It's a gamble whether you will even be able to see Billy work, since only 1 of the 2 cars stop and he's positioned so badly that the huge restraints block most of your view. Who care's what he is saying anyway, he's obviously just there to pass the time while the car in front reaches the next block.

So we continue on our terrifying ride on the "scariest roller coaster in the world". Swinging blades - a credible effect. Suddenly there is a surprise drop - wow some creativity! It packs a punch, but the weird air guns that follow fail to maintain that excitement. There is then an unforeseen (but half expected) barrel roll, over a dead body lying in the middle of nowhere. So, this is supposed to be the bathroom scene from the film, not that you would notice it because the set decor is rendered invisible by the restraints. The body proceeds to spray water in your face - a pointless effect, but fun anyway... And before you know it, the dark ride section is over. There was no real reason to be scared after all - it was just a secret drop and a hidden inversion. I can think of far scarier rides already.

Now the roller coaster really begins, could this make up for the underwhelming start? Well, no, it's a pretty cheap Gerstlaurer euro fighter, designed to be compact and unintimidating by its very nature. Nevertheless, the towering vertical lift is a threatening image, purposefully placed at the front of the building to grab attention, one of the ride's only examples of interaction with its surroundings. But to actually ride the lift, it's not that memorable. The spinning blades barely even register when you are actually on the ride, which is a shame because they look exciting from the path. The rest of the ride is just a concrete car park area over which you perform a few uncomfortably tight inversions, in a coldly calculated manner. Hill, turn, break run, drop, loop... It's just a bunch of elements put in sequence and isn't interesting. This is all made worse by the ever-tightening restraints, which often seriously affect my enjoyment of the ride.

The end. That is the entire ride. It was fun, but not in a memorable way. I have nothing against Saw as such, but when people somehow conclude that it was "superbly done" I just don't get it. What did I miss? The theming is not amazing - it's just the bare minimum: illustrative props scattered around and decoration. The ride bares little resemblance to the Saw franchise (maybe that is a good thing), and you could imagine how much better an American attempt the Saw theme would be. There are missed opportunities everywhere, and they fail to exploit the potential of the abandoned building to create any kind of tense environment. Sure, I like the effects they do have, but it's all done in such a bland, humourless way that it's difficult to enjoy. Rides are supposed to be enjoyable right? Even frightening ones.

Saw is just average.

[Inferno]

I do see what you are getting at. Saw could have been mind-blowing. Imagine what Universal could have done with it? The potential is amazing.

I still think it's a good ride though. The theming is pretty good really.

I just wish they would allow the queue to fill the entrance corridor like it used to, so everyone gets to experience the shotgun trap and the videos. As it is at the moment, these effects are wasted, because the queue is held outside.

[Mark9]

I think saw is unique and most importantly a great coaster- if we were back in 2009 we would be saying that it was the best themed ride in the park. I now think it is second bestly themed after the swarm but is my second favourite ride in the park(stealth 1st!)

I think the THEMEING is superb to be honest but that is just my opinion, I think saw is a great attraction and no one is going to stop me saying that

If we were back in 2009, we'd still be declaring Amity Cove and Tidal Wave as the greatest themed ride/area at Thorpe. IMO, that still stands to this day.

[TPJames]

I do see what you are getting at. Saw could have been mind-blowing. Imagine what Universal could have done with it? The potential is amazing.

I still think it's a good ride though. The theming is pretty good really.

I just wish they would allow the queue to fill the entrance corridor like it used to, so everyone gets to experience the shotgun trap and the videos. As it is at the moment, these effects are wasted, because the queue is held outside.

I can honestly say that saw has the potential to be much much better, in terms of the themeing etc. however, the ride itself just is one of my favourites ever! I don't know why but it is and the only ride in thorpe park which beats it is stealth. If the themeing was better, it would probably be my favourite in the park: I love saw and I love the layout, the axes, the spikes, the body on the floor which squirts water at you. I could probably go on for ever with a list of things I love about it.

I have to admit, the queue line isn't as good as it should be, the barbed wire fences are amazing but the wooden ones just completely ruin the experience. And the voice overs add to the atmosphere but they get extremely annoying after a while when you hear "don't touch the fences,they may be a trap" over and over again.

But saw is just an amazing ride overall in my opinion, and if I had the choice between saw and the swarm, it would be saw any day, because saw feels much faster and is generally a better ride(swarm feels slow etc.)

When people say saw is a bad ride and say "how can you say it's great" I completely disagree and think the opposite...

[SteveJ]

the barbed wire fences are amazing

You must be really easy to please if you find barbed wire fences amazing. I'm not saying you shouldn't enjoy Saw, in fact good for you for enjoying it.

But in context of the possibilities of what the ride could have been, Saw takes every opportunity to disappoint the rider. Personally, the ability to queue in fake barbed wire fences is not the reason I like theme parks. I think a lot of the reason that people claim that rides like Saw and The Swarm are "the best themed rides in the UK" are just because they have theming. Not necessarily immersive theming, well-integrated theming or exciting theming, just theming for the sake of theming. That does not make a ride well-themed at all, there is much more to theme design than just quantity. For example, even if Saw was coated from start to finish with barbed wire, swinging blades and squirting bodies, it would not be any better themed.

My problem is Saw has no proper theme park spirit about it, and the resulting ride feels bland as an experience and is therefore unenjoyable. At least The Swarm is actually a good rollercoaster and has some humour in it.

[TPJames]

At least The Swarm is actually a good rollercoaster and has some humour in it.

Firstly, saw is a good rollercoaster.

Secondly, swarm is pathetic and is slow and tackles its "5" inversions slowly. Which is actually 4 inversions but the park just wanted to make it sound better. I think the swarm is one of the worst rides in the park, but everyone has their own opinion....

Actually, my opinion could change when I ride it backwards, the back row was OK last time I rode it, so it has the potential to become the best. But the only thing I like about the swarm is the THEMEING and the swarms is better than saws but saw is a better rollercoaster. And that's that

[pluk]

The car sets off, but immediately you are disappointed. The Billy doll is a laughable animatronic whose primitive mouth movement is more amusing than frightening.

.

Never a truer word spoken. That half arsed attempt at an animatronic is an embarrassment, would genuinely be better to spend that time in complete darkness with just the voice. I don't understand how something so poor can get signed off as acceptable in the first place.

I enjoy the ride itself and think it probably gets a bit too much stick from enthusiasts, but a lot of the theming from concept to execution is simply not good enough.

[TPJames]

Never a truer word spoken. That half arsed attempt at an animatronic is an embarrassment, would genuinely be better to spend that time in complete darkness with just the voice. I don't understand how something so poor can get signed off as acceptable in the first place.

I enjoy the ride itself and think it probably gets a bit too much stick from enthusiasts, but a lot of the theming from concept to execution is simply not good enough.

Yes, I have to agree on that aswell, the fact that his mouth is not moving at the same time is an utter disappointment!

[JoshC.]

This seems like a nice time to bring up my blog entry on Saw - http://forum.maniahub.com/blog/10/entry-309-why-saw-is-actually-a-really-good-coaster/

Specifically, these couple of paragraphs about the theming (though I think styling is a more appropriate word) and effects:

Then you've also got the theming and effects. The station building is meant to be a derelict warehouse, and that's exactly what it looks like. Sure, it's the typical 'We're going to build a derelict, ruining theme so we don't have to maintain it', but it does work in this case. The outdoor queue section is okay, though the traps themselves are pretty uninspiring if I'm honest. The overgrown plants, however, are a touch which works well with the theme. The indoor queue wreaks of missed opportunities in my opinion; there's chance for much more than a couple of messages from Jigsaw. The station building is nicely styled I would say; but the major trouble with it is there's too much natural light. From where the cars come in after the ride to the slits between the panelling; too much natural daylight comes through. It ruins the effect and theme, which I think is a shame.

The effects during the ride are good as well, when working. An effect which is probably not intentional, and possibly the same on many Euro Fighters is the 'safety lights' going out when the cars leave the station. If you're in the second row, for front row of the second car, you see the 3 green lights, which show that the restraints have locked, go off. If I'm honest, it worried me a bit - I was not expecting it to happen and thought there was a fault for a split second... The Billy puppet is good and scares people who recognise him, and the swinging axes and needle pit are brilliant. The shooting arrows feel like a bit of a wasted opportunity in my opinion; they're boring, and distract people who could be listening to Billy's pre-talk. I do love Jigsaw's dead body squirting warm water; first time riders are always shocked by that! One thing which I think lets the ride down is the audio, or lack of. Thorpe normally get audio for rides right, but I think they did fail a bit on both this and Saw Alive.

I quite like Saw. I've never really found it rough, it has nice touches to it and it just works well. I would say that it is my second favourite Thorpe coaster too, though completely smashed by Swarm. As I also say in my blog: "It's by no means perfect, and it's not going to win any awards for the best roller coaster in the world - heck, it wouldn't win best coaster in the country." The theming is not to the standard of Swarm or Tidal Wave either and doesn't have a certain charm to it. However, it's still got 'something' which makes work, in my opinion.

[jammydodger]

Personally, I think saw is a great ride, especially when it is your first time. When I first went on saw I read nothing about what the inside section was like before going on it, because I wanted to keep it as a surprise. I went on it first thing in the morning so there was only a small queue, which kept the pace going, the tension building. And I must admit, when I first walked into the station, I was quite scared. It was mostly scary because all you could see was the track turn into the darkness, into the unknown. I had no idea what was going to happen as I pulled the restraints down, all I could hear was the screaming of the people on the ride. I was sitting on the far left, so I couldn't see the puppet (which was good because if I did I think It would have taken away the scariness). I could hear jigsaws voice, which was scary because I'd seen one of the SAW films, and wasn't to keen on it. The inside drop took me completely by surprise and was the scariest part of the whole ride. The dummy was good because it shouted so loud and I didn't expect it. This was my first time going on a vertical chain lift, and it felt like we got to the top in half a second! The rotating blades did nothing to scare me, and the rest of the ride was good, but left me with quite some headache.

So overall I think the themeing is good, but could be better and the ride itself can be a bit scary when its your first time, and you don't know what to expect. When you have been on the ride several times it isn't scary , but still very fun!

[RideAddict]

Archive,

In light of your "essay", you have prroduced a pretty-much accurate description of the ride, however, let me just mention this lot;

The queueline is basically one of the most boring ones ever put in at Thorpe. Yep, it goes round the back of the building and you can see the ride a little bit, plus the odd Genie cherry-picker in storage, a whole load of concrete with bricks dropped into it (wow, what an effect), and about £2.50 worth of 1p and 2p coins in a feature in the middle of the queue that is nothing more than a piece of rust.

After spotting how fake the CCTV cameras are, and having been "frightened" by the gunshot from above that sounds off, the queueline inside really doesn't get any better. Billy trying to frighten and disorientate anyone on them TV's is just...crap!

Things hardly pick up when you get to the loading bays - yes, we have some OK pieces of theming interestingly placed, and then one woyuld wonder why the hell we have digital clocks with the ability to count down from 24 hours only counting down your last few minutes (supposedly!).

Anyway, moving onto the ride itself. Comfortable ride cars with lovely restraints greet us, and once strapped in, the Billy animatronic is, as you say, more laughable than frightening. Swinging blades in front of you, thinking you're about to go towards and through them, before, for first-timers, unexpectedly dropping down a drop - *yawn*. Then air guns, that do nothing to excite, yet hold the cars up for a few seconds, and try to deafen people. Heck, at least my ears are cleaned out now.

After being spun around and trying to be soaked, we head outside to a tower, again with Billy on TWO TV's to try and stimulate the frightening exprerience. *yawn*. "Game over" he says, before disappearing, laughing, and then the ride winches up you a tower towards the sky which, put simply, is uncomfortable. Again, as you say, snap your neck or claim for whiplash as you're catapulted over the top, down under the spinning blades and off you go, through the various inversions. Soon, you hit the brakes with such a force it's a wonder you don't hit your head.

As you exit the station and think to yourself "That's not that much different from other rides", note the slow-spinning fans through the window, before heading down to the photo booth to view your ride photo and video.

As you say, Saw is just average. It's a worlds first, but look how long it took to hold that record. See Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_roller_coaster_rankings#Steepest_steel_roller_coasters. Even Colossus lasted 4 years until the record was broken!

That's another thing I hate about it - the Saw Island. They couldn't have added it to Canada Creek or called it another name, and the same for goes for the Swarm Island.

During it's construction, I thought it would be amazing it, and after 2 or 3 rides it did seem it. But then the novelty soon wore off, and now I class Saw as nothing, certainly not a special case! Infact, I class most rollercoasters in this country as nothing special, even if they hold a record for a while they're bound to be beaten by another in the world!

Saw is to the Saw Island to what Colossus is to the Lost City - a ride that held a record for a while before being beaten, only for Thorpe not to give a monkeys about it soon after it was built! It's a case of "Done the ride, beaten a record, let's move on and forget about it." Colossus is in a bad state these days and Saw is rapidly going to head the same way if Thorpe aren't careful, especially if the branding one day eventually gets ripped off. So Billy can do as many circles as he likes on his tricycle, one day he'll fall off it and realise that although Saw once had the world steepest drop, this baby was soon going to be king:

Secondly, swarm is pathetic and is slow and tackles its "5" inversions slowly.

Speed is not always everything IMO. The same goes for Air. Take it slow and enjoy those inversions!

[Mark9]

Just to be pedantic for a second, Colossus didn't lose its record in 2006, it was still the worlds first ten looping rollercoaster, it was just cloned in another country.

Everything else in your post, yep pretty much spot on.

[pluk]

As you say, Saw is just average. It's a worlds first, but look how long it took to hold that record. See Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_roller_coaster_rankings#Steepest_steel_roller_coasters. Even Colossus lasted 4 years until the record was broken!

I agree with pretty much all of your say here, but

Steepest steel roller coasters

1

Takabisha

Fuji-Q Highland, Fujiyoshida, Yamanashi, Japan

121°

Gerstlauer

July 16, 2011 – present

......

4

Mumbo Jumbo

Flamingoland, Malton, Yorkshire, England

112°

S&S Worldwide

July 4, 2009 – July 1, 2011

^[22]

.....

6

Saw – The Ride

Thorpe Park, Chertsey, Surrey, England

100°

Gerstlauer

N/A

That N/A there shows it never was a record breaker for that drop, even though I'm quite sure at the time Thorpe did try and make the claim. In fact I think that is how Mingo came up with 'Mumbo Jumbo', as a dig at others claiming world records when theirs actually was one.

[TPJames]

Saw actually looks nice unlike that horrible thing^^^^

Everyone has their own opinion but I think you are totally wrong in every way possible rideaddict

Just to be pedantic for a second, Colossus didn't lose its record in 2006, it was still the worlds first ten looping rollercoaster, it was just cloned in another country.

Everything else in your post, yep pretty much spot on.

Go Colossus you will be the worlds most inversions till the smiler!

Also fluch von Novgorod has the steepest drop worldwide not Takeshiba pluk!!

[JoshC.]

Saw was the steepest freefall drop roller coaster.

The S&S El Loco coasters have a trim on their drop, which means they're technically not freefall at all. So, at the time of opening (and I think until Takabisha opened), it did hold the world's steepest freefall drop on a coaster. The Wikipedia bit measures steepest drops, hence why it comes up with N/A there. Mumbo Jumbo was a mick-take out of the fact 'other' parks cling onto silly records such as the 'freefall' thing, I think. Takabisha is now the holder of both of the records, so all is good.

Just had to be a bit pedantic there.

[SteveJ]

That's another thing I hate about it - the Saw Island. They couldn't have added it to Canada Creek or called it another name, and the same for goes for the Swarm Island.

Thorpe Park never used those names, they are just the commonly used terms on the internet to describe the areas those rides are in. As in, the island they built the Swarm on = the Swarm island. Thorpe Park stopped using area names years ago; this was a good move I think because the park got too small to properly define area borders. Also the themes were pretty weak - Calypso Quay had nothing to do with quays, for example, and any new ride installed on the left side of the park immediately became part of Lost City whether it was themed or not.

Now they focus on individual ride themes, which allows them to utilise their space more. I am glad they kept Amity Cove though.

[Deleted Users]

For those people saying "What would Universal do?" with this IP, look up their Saw 2010 horror maze.

I really don't like the ride at all. It was a really peculiar horror IP to pick as well because I struggle to imagine an immersive ride themed around torture which wouldn't be offensive. UV painted axes isnt the same as the movie material.

[RideAddict]

I agree with pretty much all of your say here, but

That N/A there shows it never was a record breaker for that drop, even though I'm quite sure at the time Thorpe did try and make the claim. In fact I think that is how Mingo came up with 'Mumbo Jumbo', as a dig at others claiming world records when theirs actually was one.

Why Wikipedia have listed it like this is beyond me. A record-breaker for the first, second and third holder is a list - simples! Yes, Thorpe did make that claim.

Just to be pedantic for a second, Colossus didn't lose its record in 2006, it was still the worlds first ten looping rollercoaster, it was just cloned in another country.

Everything else in your post, yep pretty much spot on.

OK, I guess I'm labelling as it Colossus losing its record, which it never did. So more accurately: Colossus was the world first 10 looping rollercoaster in 2002, with the second being the 10 Inversion Roller Coaster at Chimelong Paradise, China in 2006.

Thorpe Park never used those names, they are just the commonly used terms on the internet to describe the areas those rides are in. As in, the island they built the Swarm on = the Swarm island. Thorpe Park stopped using area names years ago; this was a good move I think because the park got too small to properly define area borders. Also the themes were pretty weak - Calypso Quay had nothing to do with quays, for example, and any new ride installed on the left side of the park immediately became part of Lost City whether it was themed or not.

Now they focus on individual ride themes, which allows them to utilise their space more. I am glad they kept Amity Cove though.

I hadn't actually realised Thorpe had taken away the area names, although looking at the map now for the first time in ages reveals they have, and a reminder that they haven't been there for a while.

[Benin]

I always found it funny how Fluch von Novgorod opened unfinished in 2009 and STILL looked 10x better than Saw...

Also rides better by that ratio...

Saw is a complete waste and shows the coin of poor IP design with a rather measley budget once you've paid out for rights...

Not even the best Eurofighter in the country...

[alexander]

Can you give an example of an IP done properly? Like Disney?

Alex, are you saying that Saw was not done properly? Because I think it has been superbly done, so please give us an example of one not done properly.

Anything at Universal or Disney, I know this is the UK and they have a much higher income and a bigger budget, but I'd rather an original, full experience ride which wouldn't suffer at the hands of acquiring a licence. Which is why I speak so highly of Swarm, despite being short, the experience is immersive and overall the best coaster in the park. Plus, they're constantly adding to it. Not that they should need to, they should just leave it alone.

Saw is one of the least imaginative roller coasters I have ever been on in the UK. It has barely any substance to it and just relies on the Saw IP to be popular. At first, the novelty of Thorpe Park having a 'dark ride hybrid' coaster was exciting, but even back in 2009 it confused me as to how anybody could think Saw was the "best ride in the world".

You queue through an endless maze of tall metal fences. It's in a very secluded area of the park so you feel appropriately abandoned when walking around, and this feeling is aided by the tense ambience loop. Annoying American police voice overs and rusty traps to illustrate the theme. Ok. By this point, you would have noticed that the warehouse is just a big box decorated with rusty metal and broken wood. Architecturally it is incredibly boring, offering no interaction with the surrounding paths and it sticks out like they simply plonked it on the flat ground..

Then your entrance to this 'warehouse' consists of a rectangular hole cut in the side of the building, with a CCTV camera above it. The opportunity for suspense is completely missed. The interior corridor seems promising with the gun effect, which often provokes reactions from guests, but the atmosphere is ruined once you get to the stairs and the Fastrack entrance floods the room with light. Meanwhile noisy TV screens play an inevitable queueline video which adds nothing to the overall experience. There is no sense of approaching danger as you climb the bare stairs, and a plastic dummy in fake barbed wire does nothing to rectify the lack of atmosphere.

Things get better once we enter the station, since it actually gets quite dark in there and there are many details to look at, such as the trap drawings and flickering windows. You board your car and for a moment there is a genuine sense of impending terror, as you see the track curve off into darkness and the set of cogs/wheels suggesting some kind of nasty machine. The car sets off, but immediately you are disappointed. The Billy doll is a laughable animatronic whose primitive mouth movement is more amusing than frightening. It's a gamble whether you will even be able to see Billy work, since only 1 of the 2 cars stop and he's positioned so badly that the huge restraints block most of your view. Who care's what he is saying anyway, he's obviously just there to pass the time while the car in front reaches the next block.

So we continue on our terrifying ride on the "scariest roller coaster in the world". Swinging blades - a credible effect. Suddenly there is a surprise drop - wow some creativity! It packs a punch, but the weird air guns that follow fail to maintain that excitement. There is then an unforeseen (but half expected) barrel roll, over a dead body lying in the middle of nowhere. So, this is supposed to be the bathroom scene from the film, not that you would notice it because the set decor is rendered invisible by the restraints. The body proceeds to spray water in your face - a pointless effect, but fun anyway... And before you know it, the dark ride section is over. There was no real reason to be scared after all - it was just a secret drop and a hidden inversion. I can think of far scarier rides already.

Now the roller coaster really begins, could this make up for the underwhelming start? Well, no, it's a pretty cheap Gerstlaurer euro fighter, designed to be compact and unintimidating by its very nature. Nevertheless, the towering vertical lift is a threatening image, purposefully placed at the front of the building to grab attention, one of the ride's only examples of interaction with its surroundings. But to actually ride the lift, it's not that memorable. The spinning blades barely even register when you are actually on the ride, which is a shame because they look exciting from the path. The rest of the ride is just a concrete car park area over which you perform a few uncomfortably tight inversions, in a coldly calculated manner. Hill, turn, break run, drop, loop... It's just a bunch of elements put in sequence and isn't interesting. This is all made worse by the ever-tightening restraints, which often seriously affect my enjoyment of the ride.

The end. That is the entire ride. It was fun, but not in a memorable way. I have nothing against Saw as such, but when people somehow conclude that it was "superbly done" I just don't get it. What did I miss? The theming is not amazing - it's just the bare minimum: illustrative props scattered around and decoration. The ride bares little resemblance to the Saw franchise (maybe that is a good thing), and you could imagine how much better an American attempt the Saw theme would be. There are missed opportunities everywhere, and they fail to exploit the potential of the abandoned building to create any kind of tense environment. Sure, I like the effects they do have, but it's all done in such a bland, humourless way that it's difficult to enjoy. Rides are supposed to be enjoyable right? Even frightening ones.

Saw is just average.

[2]

[pluk]

Why Wikipedia have listed it like this is beyond me. A record-breaker for the first, second and third holder is a list - simples! Yes, Thorpe did make that claim.

Sorry, I'm not quite sure what you are saying here, maybe I'm being a bit thick? The list is a top 10 of currently operating rides listed by their drop in order of steepness, not a list of previous record holders. Those that did not hold the record at time of opening have an N/A, those that that did have dates it held the record for. If, for example,The Smiler had a drop of 120 degrees it would slip into the second spot with an N/A, having never held the record. Saw never held the record.

Not that it is a real record in my book anyway. The first coaster with a vertical loop took every angle record!!!