New For 2015?

[OldFarmerDean]

Isn't it about time we could be discussing what potentially we could or would want to see at Thorpe next season, considering we're almost sure it's not going to be a coaster, and well they need some sort of investment as X and swarm backwards shouldn't have cost too much, and unless they got ripped off Angry Birds land looks like it shouldn't have cost them a fortune either.

I bring this topic up because Screamscape have put in their news...

2015 - New Themed Ride Concept - Rumor - (5/16/14) According to an early rumor sent my way, Thorpe Park may be looking into building a new highly themed ride concept for 2015. Anyone else know more? With Merlin trying their hand at building some unique new indoor themed ride concepts at other Merlin parks, Thorpe Park is due for something special as well.

Now I check Screamscape quite often and what little news they get on the UK always seems to be a few days old that we all know about... Just wondering where they could have got this rumour from.

[Mitchada04]

Screamscape usually do get these pieces of information from fairly reliable sources and I've seen the dark ride word thrown around a bit on Towersstreet. And Thorpe really need something relatively large that they can advertise. Let's not forget, just because their coaster may have been pushed back it doesn't mean they won't get a large investment in another form. Even a decent medium sized investment would be welcomed after 2 years of small investments (assuming Angry Birds is a small and not a medium one).

If they do get something, what will be interesting is if it is highly themed to an original idea or based on an IP.

Basically, if Thorpe are getting something relatively large for next year there will obviously be people who know. The fact Legoland put planning permission in at the end of April, if they are looking at building a large building I expect we'd see something by the summer as well as marketing on park to bring people back next year.

If not, Colossus repaint and Top Spin next to the ZacSpin (which is coming along nicely on the Fungle Safari site )

[Matt 236]

I think it would be great if Thorpe would get a dark ride type attraction for next year. Assuming we don't see that next big coaster until 2017, we do need something relatively large investment wise in between plus I think the park need at least 2 dark ride attractiones (on top of X) to complete the ride selection there.

[Coaster]

A dark ride at Thorpe would be fantastic, as that's something they need more of.

It would also fit with the new direction they are going in.

[Mitchada04]

Thought this might be more of an appropriate place to post this as it's more likely to be a 2015 thing than the large 2016 investment.

 

All the trees from Inferno's exit stairs down to the entrance of the old Fungle Safari site (so basically this whole site) have white tags on starting at F001. This might be just for some counting purposes or for their removal. No idea but it's interesting as there has been moments of slight activity on this dormant site. So hopefully we might actually see something there (probably a Volare now that the Zac-Spins are killing people).

 

Also worth noting and I'm not sure what this is, parts of some ride queue lines have yellow paint strips on. At first I thought it might be a way to judge queue times but then Rumba has one of its wooden beams around the turntable painted this yellow as well. It might just be that these need treating or something.

 

Speculate away

[Project LC]

2015 is set for a new flat ride. A dark ride would have had planning permission by now. 2015 I am lead to believe that a flat ride is due on the Fungle Safari site however this may change, the dark ride is expected to cost £20+ million in 2016 on the arena site. 

[Mitchada04]

Depends on the scale of the dark ride. Something like Sub-Terra may not need permission till September. Especially if they plan on opening it in the Merlin Magical Month of May. But yes, 2016 should see a big scale dark ride with one of if not Merlin's largest budget for a ride. 

 

It'll be interesting to see what they theme it too and if they change Ranger County around whatever goes there. I'd also like to think the Canada Creek might get some work this closed season, especially as it's the only area of the park to have all of the old branding splattered across it (fat heads on the noodle place etc.)

[Coaster]

2015 is set for a new flat ride. A dark ride would have had planning permission by now. 2015 I am lead to believe that a flat ride is due on the Fungle Safari site however this may change, the dark ride is expected to cost £20+ million in 2016 on the arena site. 

Where exactly have you heard this?

[Altitude]

Where did all this dark ride stuff come from? Has it been confirmed? 

[Marc]

Where did all this dark ride stuff come from? Has it been confirmed? 

Nothings been confirmed yet all just speculation at the moment!

[Altitude]

^ Oh ok, so people referring to it as "the" darkride have no evidence then?

[Project LC]

We have some evidence but not much. Also it would be logical for a dark ride. Thorpe are limited in space so wouldnt want a family coaster, so a better way to attract familys would be a dark ride in the only location it really could go of the arena. This was mentioned in a behind the scenes tour of saw from the engineering team which I know isnt the most realible source. Screamscape also seem to have the same kind of rumors and they are often a fairly realible.

[Sidders]

I fail to see why a family coaster couldn't work at Thorpe. Family ride doesn't always mean slow, boring, short, and low budget. If they go for something like Colorado Adventure at Phantasialand, they'll be on to a massive winner. They just need to learn how to theme on the scale of a German park.

[Mark9]

We have some evidence but not much. Also it would be logical for a dark ride. Thorpe are limited in space so wouldnt want a family coaster, so a better way to attract familys would be a dark ride in the only location it really could go of the arena. This was mentioned in a behind the scenes tour of saw from the engineering team which I know isnt the most realible source. Screamscape also seem to have the same kind of rumors and they are often a fairly realible.

 

A family roller coaster takes up much less room then a dark ride. 

[JoshC.]

We have some evidence but not much. Also it would be logical for a dark ride. Thorpe are limited in space so wouldnt want a family coaster, so a better way to attract familys would be a dark ride in the only location it really could go of the arena. This was mentioned in a behind the scenes tour of saw from the engineering team which I know isnt the most realible source. Screamscape also seem to have the same kind of rumors and they are often a fairly realible.

 

-Great big whopping island behind Swarm and Stealth currently unused,

-Miss Hippo's Fungle Safari spot currently unused,

-Arena, only used in summer and at Fright Nights,

-CCR station and nearby area, only used at Fright Nights,

-Some attractions are surely ending their life in the next few year, so potential redevelopment spots around the park.

 

Thorpe have many restrictions, but space is not one of them at the time.  Also, it would be highly unlikely that a dark ride would be built on the island due to potential flood risks.  Either way, they're going to have a flood risk issue, but to build a dark ride (if one ever comes about), it would be most sensible to do it on the core of the park.  So, that leaves a huge empty island to build a (family) coaster..

[OldFarmerDean]

This is more for 2016/2017 large investment, but would much rather see a family coaster - and if they do, the likes of juvelen is perfect for up for it families, or even something like piraten or alpina blitz as they both have a lower height restriction (1.2)... Although they may not be the most thrilling roller coasters they look great fun. And j feel that is what thorpe is missing from their coaster lineup, whereas Alton has 13 and sonic spinball!

For 2015 I mean the word of a Zac spin was new to me... They look/are amazing after riding the one in Terra mitica, but shame about the accident, and I wonder where the ride stands in terms of safety to be building any more. I mean a top spin would go nicely in that area next to nemesis inferno!

[Benin]

Thought this might be more of an appropriate place to post this as it's more likely to be a 2015 thing than the large 2016 investment.

 

All the trees from Inferno's exit stairs down to the entrance of the old Fungle Safari site (so basically this whole site) have white tags on starting at F001. This might be just for some counting purposes or for their removal. No idea but it's interesting as there has been moments of slight activity on this dormant site. So hopefully we might actually see something there (probably a Volare now that the Zac-Spins are killing people).

 

A Volare would be tonnes worse than a Zac-Spin *dread*

 

Does Thorpe need another family coaster is a better question, what with Fish and X fulfilling the roles reasonably well so far... Of course they would have Saw as well as a suitable family thrill coaster like every other Eurofighter but they had to get the adult IP in...

 

A dark ride is certainly a bigger priority, it's just a case of are Merlin capable of producing one of sufficient overall quality on a large scale basis (Sub-Terra is done reasonably well for what is essentially a filler dark ride)...

[Project LC]

Thorpe are definitly limited in space for a family coaster. The island behind swarm has very relaxed restrictions so to have a family ride there would be a waste. The fungle site is also rather small so no place for a family coaster there. Thorpe are limited on space knowing that they can no longer make new islands so a dark ride on the arena site would be the best option for their new market. The new market may be a bad move becuase of paramount park so we may see them switch back soon.

2015 will be a flat ride as its a medium investment year. Where it will go is a mystery as is what it will be.

[Mitchada04]

A family coaster can be the scale of Expedition Everest though which is a brilliant coaster! And for the parks new target audience a large family/thrill coaster would be a sensible choice. Don't forget that the Shark Hotel island is still for a coaster, just maybe not for a long time. 

 

They won't switch back to the thrill only market because there is little money in that, teenagers don't have money to spend on merch and stuff, this is what makes the money. X and Fish are good for the younger end of the family, the big 5 good for the higher end, but what about those kids who want a thrill, are 1.2 metres. Something like Everest (we'll think more sensible) Juvelen is the way forward for their next coaster. They have 5 large scale coasters, a family coaster doesn't have to be small, do no inversions and be boring. It can be a highly immersive themed adventure. Whilst a dark ride would be a good move, it's still not known if the public in England really want one. Just look at the queues Duel, Hex and Sub Terra get. A family thrill coaster would be easy to market, pull in a crowd if done well and not cost a bomb. You can probably make a decent one for £10 million as the hardware won't be as expensive.

[OldFarmerDean]

that is a good point... although family rides are good... I'd hate to see relaxed restrictions area be wasted on a family coaster, leaving no room or suitable restrictions for a big thrilling coaster which is mainly the whole reason for going theme parks and what gets the majority of guests to visit (seeing how busy the smiler constantly is).

[Mitchada04]

The islands restrictions aren't actually that relaxed. The height they proposed to the council for that island was the 127foot which was instead used for Swarm meaning the images they mocked up of views would be different if they wanted taller. That island is a larger flood risk I believe. The 850 metre thing is just a number, if they wanted to they could apply for a 1200 metre coaster for 2016 in that island, the council would just have to agree to it. The centre of the park doesn't have huge restrictions, just little space. And at any moment, the council could refuse any application. After the current MTDP is done and the new one submitted, doesn't mean they'll be allowed to build coasters over 850 metres, they'll have to apply etc. The council might turn round and say no, 850 is fine. 

 

A large family thrill coaster that is highly themed and has a brilliant story can be better than a big bash roller coaster. 

 

And the problem is this country is the public are just used to big coasters. You go to Florida and often the coasters have shorter queues. Spiderman and Forbidden Journey had the longest queues while we were at Islands, Manta and Kraken walk on at SeaWorld while Empire of the Penguin 60 minutes. Soarin, It's A Small World, Tower of Terror, Toy Story Mania, all get huge queues! The whole of Universal Studios was dark rides with a family coaster until 2004 and even then Mummy is largely a dark ride. Only Rip Ride Rokit has been added as a coaster since and Transformers often gets longer queues than it.

[Benin]

CBeebies Land has done a fine job in getting guests to visit... Indeed, Disney don't seem to have a problem getting the guests, and they don't have much in the way of big thrilling coasters/rides...

 

With correct marketing and quality, you can get guests to come and ride anything you build...

 

Hex and Duel never really have queues because of their throughputs (Duel) and people not knowing what's inside (Hex)... Hex is a weird one because it seems to rather confuse guests as to what it is, especially with the two pre-shows, which is a shame because it's the best dark ride we have in the country (apart from when the curtain fails to work)... Sub Terra I can't help but feel has no re-rideability either, which doesn't help it's cause, as well as being pushed towards the high thrill level of dark ride...

 

A high quality dark ride could easily change perceptions of them... Indeed, an over-reliance on marketing surveys and the like is really what's making the Merlin parks rather dull and lifeless more so than anything... The parks need to be thinking ahead of themselves, and building something that guests didn't know they wanted until they had ridden it...

[OldFarmerDean]

The islands restrictions aren't actually that relaxed. The height they proposed to the council for that island was the 127foot which was instead used for Swarm meaning the images they mocked up of views would be different if they wanted taller. That island is a larger flood risk I believe. The 850 metre thing is just a number, if they wanted to they could apply for a 1200 metre coaster for 2016 in that island, the council would just have to agree to it. The centre of the park doesn't have huge restrictions, just little space. And at any moment, the council could refuse any application. After the current MTDP is done and the new one submitted, doesn't mean they'll be allowed to build coasters over 850 metres, they'll have to apply etc. The council might turn round and say no, 850 is fine. 

 

A large family thrill coaster that is highly themed and has a brilliant story can be better than a big bash roller coaster. 

 

And the problem is this country is the public are just used to big coasters. You go to Florida and often the coasters have shorter queues. Spiderman and Forbidden Journey had the longest queues while we were at Islands, Manta and Kraken walk on at SeaWorld while Empire of the Penguin 60 minutes. Soarin, It's A Small World, Tower of Terror, Toy Story Mania, all get huge queues! The whole of Universal Studios was dark rides with a family coaster until 2004 and even then Mummy is largely a dark ride. Only Rip Ride Rokit has been added as a coaster since and Transformers often gets longer queues than it.

 

I'm sure a lot of that is down to throughputs though, as well as the fact it appeals to everyone rather than just the thrill market... which is good, but I still need a good thrill every few years to keep me going back - in which case if they add a good flat then I'll be happy with a well themed and fun family coaster dark rides are usually a no for me, unless the likes which contain a somewhat thrilling 'ride'.

[JoshC.]

Thorpe are definitly limited in space for a family coaster. The island behind swarm has very relaxed restrictions so to have a family ride there would be a waste. The fungle site is also rather small so no place for a family coaster there. Thorpe are limited on space knowing that they can no longer make new islands so a dark ride on the arena site would be the best option for their new market. The new market may be a bad move becuase of paramount park so we may see them switch back soon.

2015 will be a flat ride as its a medium investment year. Where it will go is a mystery as is what it will be.

 

I see what you're saying about the island behind Swarm, as that would also be one of my concerns for a family coaster there (I just can't see a 50m tall family coaster coming to Thorpe!).  But there's other ways around it, like using the island for Shark Hotel once that's got for a 50m coaster.  A family coaster could also fit in the MHFS spot; it's quite a large space really, and could easily expand out a bit (construction of it may be difficult, but by no means impossible in my eyes).

 

I'm still very dubious about the whole 'Paramount Park are coming, so Merlin better buck their ideas up'.  PP may not work out in the UK, it may flop, it may not be as good a quality as what we think.  It could be a huge success and leave Merlin parks needing to dramatically up their game.  But I don't think the opening of PP in a few years should be ringing large alarm bells in Merlin's ears.

[Flipper]

If Merlin are clever, one of the cleverest things they could do would be to use Fungle Safari / Arena area and invest into a family inverted coaster by either Vekoma or B&M, and market it as a 'junior Nemesis Inferno' - it would not only put more spotlight onto one of the park's most underrated coasters, but also create a nice tie-in for families in the form of young ones riding the little one, while adults ride the bigger one.