Reserve n Ride

[JoshC.]

It was clear that the opinion of reserve n ride got much worse after the fright nights trials where the system was in full swing. It was clear on the Saturday that the system was a nightmare to operate and it received awful reviews from the general public when everyone was using it. Even the staff on park were not only confused by the system, but shocked that it was having such nightmare effects on the park. The system not only induced nightmare queues upon the mazes, with standby reaching 4 hours, RNR reaching 5 hours virtually followed by 2 hours standby and 1 hour in the fastrack line however also introduced nightmare queues on supporting rollercoasters with all rollercoasters at 140mins+. The system was a burden for staff to operate and put an awfully negative light on the park, and I wouldn't be surprised if that showed in fright nights gate figures this year.

I can see why the Fright Nights trial has everyone so concerned about the system. The worst possible scenario occurred then, with the park being busier than expected, the system have technical faults, estimations about the queues and throughputs going all wrong and goodness know what else. But I still think a bit of perspective should be taken - it was one bad trial out of many trials. The whole point of trials is to see what works and what doesn't. Let's hope that Thorpe have learnt from their mistakes and the next set of trials are well received once again.

(Of course, the fact that these are trials doesn't excuse the fact that for 3 days of Fright Nights, people were left with a terrible experience. I still think it was a brave decision to trial it at such a popular point during Fright Nights, but hopefully it doesn't affect the park in the long run).

Back on the subject of RNR, I've already voiced my opinion on it several times so won't bore you with it again, but one thing I think needs mentioning is that it's unfair to only run the system on mobile devices. Believe it or not, some people still don't use smartphones (I do but that's not the point) so the card should still be an option.

I know I'm probably going to sound like a broken record, but I still don't think the "Not everyone owns smartphones, so Thorpe are being silly" argument is a good one. A quick Google search suggests that in 2013, 80% of 18-34 year olds had a smartphone, and about 70% of 13-17 year olds. No doubt that figure has increased slightly the past couple of years. Given you only need one person in your group to have a smartphone, the chances of no one in your average group not having a smartphone is so slim, I don't see why Thorpe should have to worry about it.

To be honest, I think that it's still good to have the card system, but I can see why Thorpe might not want to use it, since it requires more staff for it to work and probably had few people using it.

I only became a smartphone user earlier this year, my dad last month (he's 74 so struggles to turn it on let alone send a text), I'm sure we're not the only ones late to the party, lots of people I know still have non-smartphone phones too.

I think it's worth taking into account Thorpe's target market. The park still targets teenagers and young adults primarily, as well as 'older families' (families with children aged 8+). Whilst there will of course be people with that market who don't have smartphones, I still think the large majority will have one between a group of them.

[Ian-S]

Yes that's true, it seems everyone under 15 that I know (that's not meant to sound creepy lol, my son is 11) have them.

However the rnr site doesn't work on my phone (it hangs on the home page), but works fin on the Mrs one fine.

[Project LC]

Its not a case of you need a phone its a case of you need a fairly new smart phone. The website has a load of scripting errors (presumably they will fix that) but it results in anyone with an old phone cant use the system either.

The fright night trial should have been perfect for the system. It had effectively 5 extra flat rides and the system was being used where it was designed to be used. It was perfect conditions for RnR and it failed spectacularly. There was not one aspect of the system you could have called successful on those days. It did get good reviews because when using RnR it seemed amazing they only had to wait 1 hour physically and 5 hours virtually compared to the alternative of the 4 hour physical queue. I am sure there would have been many people on park who were unaware that the reason it was a 4 hour physical queue was because of RnR. 

 

According to twitter the fastrack queue will be a different queue to the RnR and the Main Queue. 

[Coaster]

I know I'm probably going to sound like a broken record, but I still don't think the "Not everyone owns smartphones, so Thorpe are being silly" argument is a good one. A quick Google search suggests that in 2013, 80% of 18-34 year olds had a smartphone, and about 70% of 13-17 year olds. No doubt that figure has increased slightly the past couple of years. Given you only need one person in your group to have a smartphone, the chances of no one in your average group not having a smartphone is so slim, I don't see why Thorpe should have to worry about it.

Believe it or not, people who are over 34 years old do still visit theme parks!

 

I heard various people at Fright Nights asking for cards only to be told that they had to use their smartphone.  Not everyone has one, and if they are going to bring in this system then they need to make it fair to everyone.  Showing statistics that 80% of people have a smartphone is all good and well, but what about the other 20%?

[Mark9]

Isn't the likelihood in a group of four people, for one to not have a smartphone, very low. 

[Project LC]

It works out that if everyone is a group of 4 and it assumes 80% of people have a phone are equally distributed then on a day of 15,000 6 groups would have no phone. In reality there would be more than 6 groups as the people with a phone that works with RnR is much lower than 80% but yes it is a very small number.

[pluk]

According to twitter the fastrack queue will be a different queue to the RnR and the Main Queue. 

 

Really?! For the love of god, why? Why over complicate things? It could be so simple.

 

Surely they wouldn't have come up with one virtual queuing system that wasn't compatible with another queuing system, which both require very tightly controlled numbers to not descend into chaos, and then try to use them at the same time...

[Matt 236]

It might work, it might not work,

I'll reserve my judgement until I ride the system

Interesting to see the park trailing it out again, but fastrack usage too is a little concerning

[Coaster]

Isn't the likelihood in a group of four people, for one to not have a smartphone, very low. 

But again, not everyone visits in fours, some visit in two's, and some families who visit won't have smartphones (my parents didn't until a few years ago!)

Then there's other issues surrounding smartphones such as charge level, internet connection etc.

[Cal]

But again, not everyone visits in fours, some visit in two's etc.

Then there's other issues surrounding smartphones such as charge level, internet connection etc.

 

This is true. Not everyone has 3G on their smartphones, and from my own experience, some places around the park you don't get wifi connection. With everyone around the park using the wifi, I can see it getting slow etc but I have no idea what it'll be like obviously. 

 

I don't really see the charge to be a problem, people are on there phones a lot anyway so will run out of charge without using reserve and ride. Reserve and ride won't make much of a difference to peoples battery. Maybe the park could get more charging stations like they have in the dome though. 

 

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I haven't really given my opinion on reserve and ride before, I've never experience it myself. Over Facebook and speaking to my friend who visited, the feedback did seem very positive. 

 

I just can't really see it working at Fright Nights. If the 5 main coasters all have reserve and ride, I can't imagine what the queues for the mazes will be like. 

 

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It's great to see that you now have to scan your ticket + annual pass to use it, it will reduce the amount of people misusing the system. I can still think of flaws though. 

[Coaster]

I don't really see the charge to be a problem, people are on there phones a lot anyway so will run out of charge without using reserve and ride. Reserve and ride won't make much of a difference to peoples battery. Maybe the park could get more charging stations like they have in the dome though. 

I sort of meant it the other way round - if people's phones run out of charge then they can't use the system, I wasn't blaming the system for causing the phones to loose charge.

[Mark9]

But again, not everyone visits in fours, some visit in two's, and some families who visit won't have smartphones (my parents didn't until a few years ago!)

Then there's other issues surrounding smartphones such as charge level, internet connection etc.

 

I was generalising with four. But the point of your parents didn't own one until a few years ago, I'm presuming they do now. Which goes in line that smartphone technology and reach would have expanded since Josh's research quotes from 2013. 

 

I sort of meant it the other way round - if people's phones run out of charge then they can't use the system, I wasn't blaming the system for causing the phones to loose charge.

 

Thats a taboo point. I don't know how people get through their whole batteries in less then eight hours. They must run every app on their phone and refreshing Facebook and whatsapp every few seconds..

[Coaster]

I was generalising with four. But the point of your parents didn't own one until a few years ago, I'm presuming they do now. Which goes in line that smartphone technology and reach would have expanded since Josh's research quotes from 2013. 

True, but the fact still remains that some people don't own one/don't take one to a theme park.

 

Thats a taboo point. I don't know how people get through their whole batteries in less then eight hours. They must run every app on their phone and refreshing Facebook and whatsapp every few seconds..

8 hours?  Depends on the brand of phone, my phone barely lasts 4 and I'm running it on battery saver mode most of the time.

[TPJames]

I can see why the Fright Nights trial has everyone so concerned about the system. The worst possible scenario occurred then, with the park being busier than expected, the system have technical faults, estimations about the queues and throughputs going all wrong and goodness know what else. But I still think a bit of perspective should be taken - it was one bad trial out of many trials. The whole point of trials is to see what works and what doesn't. Let's hope that Thorpe have learnt from their mistakes and the next set of trials are well received once again.(Of course, the fact that these are trials doesn't excuse the fact that for 3 days of Fright Nights, people were left with a terrible experience. I still think it was a brave decision to trial it at such a popular point during Fright Nights, but hopefully it doesn't affect the park in the long run).

If it was a "brave decision" to trial the system during fright nights, how is it ever possibly going to be implemented to run all year round? The system is one which will have to work both during peak and off peak times in order to be implemented fully and at the moment it only appears to work during off peak.

What's the point of introducing a system which only works on off peak and not during the busy periods if queue times are low during off peak days anyway...?

[JoshC.]

True, but the fact still remains that some people don't own one/don't take one to a theme park.

 

Argh!

 

Yes, there will be a minority of people who do not have a smartphone whilst they visit Thorpe Park.  However, it's a very small minority.  It's a slight flaw in the system, yes, but it will only affect a very small number of people.  And it's quite possible the solution (a paper system) is just not worthwhile.  

 

Your argument is basically the equivalent of saying 'I won't swim in the sea because it contains sharks'.

 

If it was a "brave decision" to trial the system during fright nights, how is it ever possibly going to be implemented to run all year round? The system is one which will have to work both during peak and off peak times in order to be implemented fully and at the moment it only appears to work during off peak.

What's the point of introducing a system which only works on off peak and not during the busy periods if queue times are low during off peak days anyway...?

 

It's a trial system.  They of course need to trial it during busy periods, but they ended it trialling it during the 3rd(?) weekend of Fright Nights - notoriously known to be one of the busiest weekends of their busiest time of season.  It would have been a much more sensible idea is trial the system during the first or last weekend, which is usually quieter, so that if the system messed up (during a trial), it would cause less havoc.

 

I guess they needed to trial it when the park was at its busiest (as they had trialled it during some busy summer days), but I still think it was brave decision to put the system through its paces in such a way.  One would hope that as the trials develop, the system will be able to work on the busiest of days (otherwise they simply won't implement it).

[Project LC]

I wouldn't call it brave I would call it stupidity. What moron trials a system which is notorious for going wrong and not have a back up plan when it does go spectacularly wrong. You would have been very hard pressed to find a person on that day which had an all round positive experience. What's worse is the system was designed for exactly that day. To deal with large numbers and solve the queues and it did the exact opposite. You can blame it on technical faults and poor judgement all you like but at the end of the day it went wrong because the idea is just flawed. They should have let RnR die there before it causes any more damage. 

[Deleted Users]

Not everyone uses Fastpass, not everyone uses Fastpass+, not everyone will use this. I'm amazed that the same forum that was sharing how to exploit the old system is now going on a crusade for the poor people that can't access the system.

I agree that it is screwed if the Thorpe servers crash

[Dodge2002]

I'm just gonna go ahead and repeat what I've said before.

 

They want to fix their long queues.

They're trialing a system to fix that. 

Said system doesn't work. We know that. They know that, contrary to popular belief, they aren't idiots. 

 

But that's why they are TRIALING it. They are trying to come up with the perfect system. They're not saying "Yup this is the system we're using now. It's crap but we don't care". Implementing the system in its current form wouldn't benefit them in any way, both financially nor with their guest metrics. 

 

However, unless they test it in real life scenerio's they're never gonna get the data they need to create a system that DOES work, and one that arguably needs to exist if they want to push gate figures in the future. You can argue that yes, its unfair for the people who hit a RnR day vs. the others but to be honest, its a price that will probably pay off one day. 

[Project LC]

There is no solution to long queues. The way to solve it is to make queues fun and entertaining so people feel like they are not in a queue. All the money they continue to spend on RnR is a waste. The idea should never have left the room it was created in. Regardless of if it is a trial or not the idea is flawed and the idea should have been killed right after someone worked out the maths of the people behind it. 

[Mark9]

I think its pretty safe to say a majority of you know my opinion on the shambles that is RnR, ill try not to bore you with all the details again.

 

Shame you could't quite keep to this really LC12. Reserve and Ride really riles you doesn't it. Life's too short to be posting the same comments time and time again. It's not that I want you to stop posting about this but, lets face it, your opinion on RNR is a well travelled road now. Could you not just let it go because clearly Thorpe have no intention of dropping it.

[Coaster]

I'm just gonna go ahead and repeat what I've said before.

They want to fix their long queues.

They're trialing a system to fix that.

Said system doesn't work. We know that. They know that, contrary to popular belief, they aren't idiots.

But that's why they are TRIALING it. They are trying to come up with the perfect system. They're not saying "Yup this is the system we're using now. It's crap but we don't care". Implementing the system in its current form wouldn't benefit them in any way, both financially nor with their guest metrics.

However, unless they test it in real life scenerio's they're never gonna get the data they need to create a system that DOES work, and one that arguably needs to exist if they want to push gate figures in the future. You can argue that yes, its unfair for the people who hit a RnR day vs. the others but to be honest, its a price that will probably pay off one day.

The thing is, Reserve and Ride has caused nothing but chaos around the park. 4 hour waits for mazes followed by another hour when you turn up, similar issues on the coasters, as well as reducing the capacity from the main queue.

You make the point about RNR reducing queue times. This is fair enough, but actually running rides on capacity and opening them would be a good start with this, and I don't think they the park is in a stable enough position with regards to this to start implementing such a system. They should be looking at the fundamental basics to reduce queues, yet they seem to completely overlook the fact that only running one train on coasters is going to lead to long, slow moving queues, and instead focus on this system which is doomed to failure with the park's ride capacity in the state that it's in at the moment.

Another problem is the lack of other things to do at the park. At Chessington you have the zoo, at BPB you have the FY4 fountain area which takes people out of queues on busy days, what is there at Thorpe?

The operations and infrastructure of the park are not ready for this yet.

[RubyRed95]

Honestly, what I don't like about RnR is the fact that I really don't mind queueing! If you're with good people it's all part of the experience. Also, it doesn't allow you to be sporadic and just jump on whatever when it's quiet, you have to go on your phone and reserve. My battery won't last a whole day

[Jordanluke2009]

^ I'm usually antisocial anyway.

[RubyRed95]

^ I'm usually antisocial anyway.

Haha it's that iPad Jordan :') #getoffit

[Ian-S]

Don't know not on park, but the standby queue times were short, off memory the longest I've seen is 40 mins for X, and the reserve'n'ride times are mostly 0, so either the system is having a his sy fit and not working, not working full stop, or working as desired.