Next Big Thing - 2016 Development ?

[TPJames]

I like it, otherwise the ride is crap

The back rows of the swarm were the best rows before they got turned round.

The whole point of the swarm is completely taken away with BIB as there are no near misses for you to go through. It simply ruins the ride and makes the forwards rows have a lower throughput, also the only good parts of BIB were the first drop and the inline twist.

[OldFarmerDean]

it's unfair to judge how effective the swarm was, as the visitor numbers dropped, but as mentioned there were so many different factors last year that pretty much led to the decline in visitor numbers for that year. I think the swarm is a great ride and always has the busiest queues in the park even considering it has a decent throughput so goes to show it is popular even on it's second year, it's just obvious that the nicer weather this year and other reasons is that the park is busier - although with the amount of offers thorpe have been putting on in comparison to last year, unsure if that's partly the reason. I just hope merlin aren't stuck in tunnel vision and only see that the launch of the swarm a big investment seen a poor year in terms of visitor number, will put them off taking risks with a hybrid woodie, or even not adding big investments for a while!

[JoshC.]

As others have said, there are so many factors to consider when you look at 2012's attendances. To solely say Swarm didn't bring in the crowds is unfair really. I personally think that Swarm will have a different type of pulling factor - other coasters (Stealth, Saw and Colossus) have had a key marketing gimmick which draws people in, and people decide to return of their own accord. Obviously, a UK first ride is not gimmicky enough for the general public, but as the general consensus of guests is that Swarm is a very good ride, then word of mouth will eventually spread.

I like it, otherwise the ride is crap

Why do you think this, just outta interest?

[FrightNights04]

I just think they could of done better with the amount of money they had. The swarm cost £20m and the smiler only cost £18m!

[J.S217]

The Swarm is B&M The Smiler Is Gerstlaure

[FrightNights04]

I know but I think they could of done more, but that's just my opinion

[Mark9]

The majority of The Swarm and The Smilers costs comes to the construction process. The Swarm costs more in that figure because of the infilling of the lake. Arguably, The Swarm is much more of a quality product then The Smiler so whilst Smiler is already starting to age (not to mention its frequent bouts of closures), The Swarm feels as smooth as it did on open day and has never had a full day closed.

[Dan9]

I just think they could of done better with the amount of money they had. The swarm cost £20m and the smiler only cost £18m!

Can you please explain your point further, I'm really not sure what you're trying to get at? Both involved extensive land work, both had buildings constructed, theming props made/bought... all of those costs varied with the two rides and evidently The Swarm ended up being £2 million (if those figures are correct) more expensive, not too much when you think about the scale of the projects. B&M's cost more too...

[Benin]

It's daft to compare costs involved because of the countless variants between the two rides and their own individual remits behind their building (as in WHY were they built?)...

[FrightNights04]

Can you please explain your point further, I'm really not sure what you're trying to get at? Both involved extensive land work, both had buildings constructed, theming props made/bought... all of those costs varied with the two rides and evidently The Swarm ended up being £2 million (if those figures are correct) more expensive, not too much when you think about the scale of the projects. B&M's cost more too...

I just find the ride a bit boring but that is my opinion!

[Matt 236]

Even so, but another thing to consider with the Swarm is not just is it smooth (like almost every B&M) and in terms of breakdowns, they were quite a rare occurrence whilst the Smiler seems to break down so many times you have a higher chance of being evacuated off the Smiler than a stealth rollback almost.

In 10 years time, the Smiler could potentially be a rough ride whilst Swarm will likely still be beautifully smooth.

[FrightNights04]

Even so, but another thing to consider with the Swarm is not just is it smooth (like almost every B&M) and in terms of breakdowns, they were quite a rare occurrence whilst the Smiler seems to break down so many times you have a higher chance of being evacuated off the Smiler than a stealth rollback almost.

In 10 years time, the Smiler could potentially be a rough ride whilst Swarm will likely still be beautifully smooth.

I do agree, the swarm is so smooth

[alexander]

In 10 years time, I'm hoping Swarm will turn out how Inferno has. Inferno has gotten amazing the past 2 years

[Sidders]

In 10 years time, I'm hoping Swarm will turn out how Inferno has. Inferno has gotten amazing the past 2 years

Was literally just thinking this.

[FrightNights04]

Them 2 two are the smoothest in the park

[Altitude]

^ Because B&M are quality <3

I just don't see them going with B&M soon, after the 'failure' of Swarm. Mack? Perhaps. But I would be slightly put off buying an Intamin coaster considering all the accidents that have happened recently (Shoot the Rapids, Furios Baco etc.)

[Dan9]

^ Because B&M are quality <3

I just don't see them going with B&M soon, after the 'failure' of Swarm. Mack? Perhaps. But I would be slightly put off buying an Intamin coaster considering all the accidents that have happened recently (Shoot the Rapids, Furios Baco etc.)

Why would The Swarm be considered a failure after the park's success this season? And even if they did consider it to be a failure (it isn't), why would that be B&M's fault as opposed to their own marketing team?

[EC!]

B&M weren't the faliure, its not them who market it, its Merlin who do that so for marketing its Merlin's fault not that of B&M. Merlin would probably still get one for the future with the amount of B&M wingriders they are putting in their park at the mo Although I would love a Mack

[Marc]

To be fair, Swarms marketing was pretty much what enthusiasts called out for and I think the marketing was some of the best weve seen from the park.

The problem is the GP like gimmicks, Saw, Colossus, Stealth, Smiler, Thirteen all have their own little gimmicks and have all been massively successful.

Thats not a bad thing mind, most of them are very good rides

[JoshC.]

According to the park themselves, Swarm was very positively received by those who rode it. The trouble was, not enough people came to ride it.

Why that was could be put down to many things, but it certainly isn't down to it being a B&M.

[Benin]

Probably why all of a sudden Thorpe have completely changed tact with how they treat the park AND how they treat guests...

The park's own image is just as important as to how a new ride is promoted... And Thorpe's image until this year has been pretty crap...

[Dan9]

To be fair, Swarms marketing was pretty much what enthusiasts called out for and I think the marketing was some of the best weve seen from the park.

The problem is the GP like gimmicks, Saw, Colossus, Stealth, Smiler, Thirteen all have their own little gimmicks and have all been massively successful.

Thats not a bad thing mind, most of them are very good rides

Oh I agree, I've very much enjoyed what Merlin have done with both The Swarm and The Smiler from a marketing and creative point of view. I'm simply suggesting that you can't blame the manufacturer for a park underperforming in a coaster's first year when the public don't know anything about the ride beforehand, that's the job of marketing.

As it is, there are many other reasons why Thorpe (and many other Merlin parks) didn't have a great 2012. This year Thorpe have been on much better form and yes, I can confidenty say The Swarm is a very well received ride from the vast majority of the public.

[stretchy]

I personally thought swarms marketing was excellent. The problem I have with Swarm is that for me it is a forceless design and far far too short. I want a ride with a bit of substance to it. The problem with wing riders is that none of them are getting that good a review. They are OK but not ultimate thrill rides, no mater how they are marketed. I think that this is the reason The Smiler is getting such good reviews. It is a ride with substance. It isnt over in 30 seconds, you come of it knowing you have ridden a coaster, rather than sat in a park and watched the birdies (which is how I come off Swarm).

What I would like Thorpe to do is something huge. Not necesserily huge in height, but huge in length. I would like a ride with plenty of air time AND an invertion or two. I would like it to take more than 30 seconds to ride the ride.

regarding vendor: I think Smiler has proven that it isnt only B&M that can create good rides for Merlin so I don't think the vendor of the ride maters as long as it is huge and smooth and impacting and a good ride.

[Coaster]

I personally thought swarms marketing was excellent. The problem I have with Swarm is that for me it is a forceless design and far far too short. I want a ride with a bit of substance to it. The problem with wing riders is that none of them are getting that good a review. They are OK but not ultimate thrill rides, no mater how they are marketed.

I also find The Swarm a little too smooth, although it seems to be getting more forceful with age.

Just wish it was longer - a fast helix at the end (instead of a slow, strange corner) would have made all the difference.

I still rate it quite highly though.

[coaster dude!!!]

Personally I would like to see Thorpe go big. I want to see them break the 205ft mark with their next coaster, go taller than stealth.

I think a hyper coaster is something that will attract a lot of people, simply because of the staggering height. Something like Nitro at Six Flags Great Adventure, Goliath at Six Flags Over Georgia or even a modern hyper like Diamondback at Kings Island. Thorpe getting one of these rides is actually a lot more achievable than most would think, the only problem being space.

In terms of cost the previously mentioned hypers are all substantially cheaper than The Swarm (Goliath and Nitro $20m, Swarm $31m), even Diamondback is $8m cheaper ($22). Just to put it into perspective for the price of Swarm Thorpe could have theoretically built Leviathan or even Millennium Force (obviously in reality there isn't enough space).

Space is, as always, the main limitation for the park, therefore a hyper would have to be very well designed to suit the park. Goliath at Six flags Magic Mountain or Intimidator 305 are both extremely packed in coasters in terms of space, Intimidator is over 300ft and yet only takes up an area or about 800ft x 400ft, thats only ~100ft longer than Colossus and 4 times wider (really not that much for what they would be getting).

Sure a hyper would be a huge space investment but it would make Thorpe Park the best theme park in the UK and would warrant international attention. If there's one coaster design that is guaranteed to be a success and be worth the investment, it is surely a hyper coaster.

Just my opinion