Chessington General Discussion

[yeah]

23 minutes ago, Wumbamillio said:

No, the proper 1990 version cannot 'easily be found on YouTube', also I can guarantee the music did not sound as "loud and clear" as it should do - had you known the ride in its better years the difference would be great. It is like a cinema screening a pixelated download copy of a movie to guests paying full price, just because they 'lost the original' - pathetic and totally misunderstanding.

 

The music currently does not loop (there is a gap of silence and it loops in the wrong place) and it lacks the bass & clarity it should have. Because it is literally the version in the  video below, downloaded and played on a file. This is so unprofessional and makes the music sound pathetic in comparison.

 

Audio is a much misunderstood thing. People get away with real shoddiness sometimes, but when done properly, everybody will enjoy it so much more. There is no reason why a track from 1990 can't sound as good today if it were played properly.  There are currently so many broken speakers in the station too.

 

Also, the music in the mix below (other than being sourced from a hissy old cassette tape), is not the true version of the music that used to play in the station for years. It misses sound effects and is a different track mix. The track was designed to synchronise to the animatronic organist's movements, again this has also been broken for a long time - and the animatronic seriously needs servicing.

 

The guests pay enough to visit the park that the audio should be of best effect, not this shoddy and laim. It would take very little effort to restore for someone who knew what they were doing and had the right skill. But quite simply, the park don't care and say "most people wouldn't notice". Wrong attitude completely.

 

 

 

This one? I cant tell much of a difference just from skimming through but this I'm sure is the one that I heard was used before that one, with less/more bells and a few more sound effects 

EDIT: And the 1990 queueline ambience, I have no idea if this is the same as the station or not but it's very quiet. This guy has 3 other Vampire themes on his channel too. 

 

[SteveJ]

Well none of those are the correct original mix, although the second one you post there would still be a marked improvement (which is taken from Graham Smart's online posted version).  Those mixes listed as '1990' or 'real' on YouTube are incorrect, but what do you expect, YouTube is a free-for-all for amateurs anyway and none of those people will be aware of how the ride opened or proper AV design. 

 

But this is not about some elite technical detail or fan thing, if it were done properly then it would be much to the benefit of everyone's guest experience. Rather than a shoddy broken state of affairs. I remember being amazed at the music and the atmosphere of the station as a very young child, compared to now as the whole room is boring and flat for everybody.

 

Audio should be handled professonally and simply putting some YouTube videos next to each other is only an arbitrary comparison. The speaker system in the station needs a complete redesign by a professional.

Ideally a good remaster of the 1990 original should be restored to the station and resynchronised to the animatronic, and the animatronic fully serviced. A different, simple outdoor ambient track should be commissioned to use in the queue, not the station theme.

[Coaster]

On Sunday, March 12, 2017 at 6:14 PM, ChessingtonSam said:

The ride is massive, can easily be seen from Land of the Dragons and Transylvania.

The theming element is tall, but the carousel itself is small is what I meant.

[HermanTheGerman]

Ugh, why do they have to go and slap the station music on everything? That piece is meant for a big sound hall, not tinny queue line speakers. 

 

Audio creativity has slipped quite a bit at Chessington recently...

[Benin]

That 3 minute track is REALLY going to grate in those 2 hour queues...

[OlivusPrime]

20 hours ago, Wumbamillio said:

I remember being amazed at the music and the atmosphere of the station as a very young child, compared to now as the whole room is boring and flat for everybody.

 

Not sure if that's especially true, and I think that's the problem behind many of these recent changes. I never went on the original Vampire but even the watered post-refurbishment station was enough to capture my imagination at a young age and influence me to follow theme parks much more closely, and that's likely because 1. I didn't know any better, and 2. the original elements that remain still shine through in how high-quality they are.

 

Keep just enough of the original, inspiring features for the attraction to still feel above-ordinary, and cost-cut the rest. As long as there's an organist still sitting in the Vampire station and the music plays, nobody will care that the brilliant extras are being trashed or thrown out.

[Coaster]

50 minutes ago, OlivusPrime said:

Keep just enough of the original, inspiring features for the attraction to still feel above-ordinary, and cost-cut the rest. As long as there's an organist still sitting in the Vampire station and the music plays, nobody will care that the brilliant extras are being trashed or thrown out.

People will care, it's the difference between "wow that's incredible" an "meh, that was okay."

 

Every tiny detail goes so far in terms of the overall experience.

[SteveJ]

I really think it's a slippery slope to closure, excuses and very poor value for money the moment the park starts to fiddle with a design they didn't create, without professional input and without a professional budget. In the state it is, the ride may still have 'some' appeal and influence but it's pretty naff entertainment in the bigger picture, and will certainly appeal to a diminishing fractional audience the more these attractions are botched up and ruined. Their replacements, like Zufari and Madagascar, are usually flash-in-the-pan gimmicks that get reduced and cut within 5 years, so we end up with losing all quality attractions this way.

I never rode the original Vampire either, but I remember vividly when the station was dark, loud, the original raw music and the way it sounded in the room, the sheltered walk through the crypt and dark flickering corridor, the imposing Gothic chandeliers and wall artwork (when it was actually lit properly, the scenic lights for the artwork all disappeared along with the chandeliers, so now they look flat and bland under those standard B&Q LEDs). Even all those creepy details have mostly gone in the last 5 years. I can only imagine it when it was brand new and there was even more substance to it.

You can also look at it from the point of view that its simply what the guests deserve from the amount theyre spending. In 1990 guests would have got an infinitely greater experience for a fraction of the typical prices now, even with discounts. 

Merlin don't stipulate proper design or restoration though, instead they award their misled in-house teams who "have a go" at improving rides unprofessionally (sometimes without even paying them) - which give amateaur results that only look embarrassing, like the smashed up Abdabs plonked outdoors or the wooden sticks in the ground this year. Just be grateful these lame fiddles weren't promoted as "TLC".

Merlin also bar any real capital being spent on scenic maintenance and refurbishment where it's desperately needed, unless there is a new marketing proposal and "compelling proposition" to accompany it. No Dragon Falls or BubbleWorks restoration then, despite millions of people going through these attractions in a terrible half-demolished limbo. Terrible practices for such a large, powerful company, and it all relies on the fact that guests don't know what they're missing, the difference between an excellent attraction and a broken down attraction.

[Merry-go-girl]

On 2/3/2017 at 0:43 AM, Zappomatic said:

Chessington in 1997/1998 (an early Matt Lucas and Mark Williams show!) 

 

Blimey who knew Burnt Stub Manor used to look like the Playboy Mansion inside, good thing they made it a ride so now it's less scary. 

[OlivusPrime]

^ Apologies if my above post made it sound like I'm okay with the cost-cutting - I was merely channelling Merlin's perception of the general public!

[Coaster]

It has become impossible to get on even half the rides you want to in a day, we managed six rides all day on Sunday!

 

Dragon's Fury, Tomb Blaster and Zufari were running in such a way that they probably weren't even getting a third of their maximum throughput, and from watching Rattlesnake I'd guess the same for that - I've never known queues move so slow, it made Flamingo Land's operations look positively fast in comparision!

 

Vampire and Gruffalo were the only saving graces, the queues were moving fairly quickly on these which was good.

 

I think Chessington need to consider the quality of day they're offering, there's no point opening a new/refurbished ride if the operations across the park are as slack as they were on Sunday.  It's just no fun standing in queues that move slower than watching paint dry, especially when all you have to look at is peeling paint and tired surroundings; and we missed out on several rides purely due to the terrible capacity on those we went on.

 

Weighing up the cost of admission compared with number of rides ridden, and the standard (all except for Gruffalo were in poor condition), it represents awful value for money.

[JoshC.]

In my experience, Chessington has been awful to visit on busy days for the past 4-5 years.  Even if operations go well, their attractions can't cope with the demand they receive. 

 

Though to be fair, given it was the opening weekend of their new ride (and a pretty big new ride all things considered), I guess I've should expect things to be busy and get a lower ride count than normal.  Though 6 rides in a potential 7 hour day is a bit of a joke. 

[alexander]

7 minutes ago, BaronC. said:

In my experience, Chessington has been awful to visit on busy days for the past 4-5 years.  Even if operations go well, their attractions can't cope with the demand they receive. 

 

Though to be fair, given it was the opening weekend of their new ride (and a pretty big new ride all things considered), I guess I've should expect things to be busy and get a lower ride count than normal.  Though 6 rides in a potential 7 hour day is a bit of a joke. 

Did 3 rides at Thorpe one summer like 8 years ago lmfao

[Josh3103]

My lowest ever ride count was in summer 2012 at Thorpe when I only got on 4 rides. Terrible day

 

My ride count was

Tidal Wave x1

Loggers Leap x1

Swarm x1

Quantum x1

 

[Cal]

 

'As soon as we knew'

[Theme Park Joseph]

Hopefully it opens by easter as that's when I'm going and I really want to ride it 

[Josh3103]

More delays ?

[StevenVig]

Expected nothing less.

[CharlieN]

8 minutes ago, StevenVig said:

Expected nothing less.

 

I'd rather be optimistic thanks.

[yeah]

How have they finished a dark ride before a carousel?

[Matt 236]

In all fairness, they've had noticeably more time to finalise Gruffalo compared to the Adventure Tree, especially given the fact one of them utilised a pre-existing ride system and the other was built from the ground up.

 

Chessington as a whole needs a major renovation. Gruffalo & Tree are adequate investments, given the park's Wild Adventure image they are trying to go for, but the rest of the park needs lots more work. Vampire, Tomb, Ramesis and even Falls & Rattlesnake (to a lesser extent), could greatly see some much needed TLC and updates, as all these attractions currently feel tired and overlooked, which is a shame.

 

The new master development plan should hopefully help the park out alongside minor developments, but what the place needs is a consistent balance of new attractions and restored ones.

[SteveJ]

They almost certainly have plans to continue their rebranding of the rest the park. Expect Rameses to go as soon as next year, Tomb an IP /safari themed replacement, Vampire some IP and retheming, and Dragon Falls to do most likely go.

 

Merlin have zero interest in restoring classic attractions they didn't make, only keeping them in a terrible state long enough to be easily replaced by their own brand.

[TP-Fan]

2 hours ago, Wumbamillio said:

Merlin have zero interest in restoring classic attractions they didn't make

That's not 100% true, they have refurbished Nemesis and Hex at AT. They are just very lazy and like  to run old attractions to the point where TLC has to be done. For example, look at Bubbleworks, or Rumba they both needed it to keep guests coming on the attractions.

[SteveJ]

1 hour ago, TP-Fan said:

That's not 100% true, they have refurbished Nemesis and Hex at AT. They are just very lazy and like  to run old attractions to the point where TLC has to be done. For example, look at Bubbleworks, or Rumba they both needed it to keep guests coming on the attractions.

Merlin were nothing to do with Hex and Nemesis. This was done in house co-ordinated by Alton Towers' entertainments teams. In fact they denied the budget for restoring Nemesis for its 20th, even now the park are having to paint it over 4 winters just to get the money to complete it.

Rumba has also just been painted brown by the park with an old Rangers prop stood against a fence. If anything Rumba is a clear example of how money just isn't given to restore rides without them being marketed and rebranded. 

The only refurbishments to existing 'classic' rides I can think of recently were Fairytale Brook at legoland and Tomb at Chessington - both of which were made considerably worse; Tomb was only done to enable it to actually open, otherwise it would have had to remain shut.

Merlin have a policy that they will only grant capital expenditure on anything if there is a new "killer image" and "compelling proposition" and preferably utilises a popular IP or trend, and has to be to the liking of Nick Varney. It is a ridiculous system when rides are literally falling apart, or need proper care. It kills off any remaining classics too, because money is only spent on "new" Merlin friendly ideas. We are lucky that Alton Towers managed to restore Hex and knew mostly what they were doing with it. But really it should have had a professional commision and budget, and never got into that state in the first place.

[OlivusPrime]

It's really a shame, I'm reading "Theme Park Design and the Art of Themed Entertainment" at the moment for my dissertation (really fantastic book - would firmly recommend to any enthusiast), and every mention of Chessington's "theme" regards the "Wild Adventure" brand they've got going on, with no mention of the park's dramatic origins. Such horrendous management for the park to have nosedived in critical eyes like this.

 

Considering the worldwide respect for both, I'm relieved for the refurbishments to Hex and Nemesis, but equally bitter that such attention isn't being paid elsewhere.