MikeC Posted April 4, 2013 Report Share Posted April 4, 2013 I think we've already established that there isn't a secret element /roll eyes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark9 Posted April 4, 2013 Report Share Posted April 4, 2013 People aren't excited for an inversion record.. you have seen how mental this ride looks right? Surely thats enough if a record doesn't whet your appetite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pluk Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 That's not really a significant world's first is it, nor a 'secret element' It is a massive worlds first and word record, being a true genuine first and record (none of this 'steepest drop', 'first horror coaster' or 'ultimate / first psyco coaster' nonsense). It is secret too really - the record and inversion count have not been confirmed yet, it is only geek world sitting here comparing supports to plans who have worked it out, which we wouldn't have been able to do if it had been built over closed season as planned making it a secret until opening. And more importantly it is something which is clearly, concisely and easily marketable which people will understand and buy into needing to be a part of. The same can't be said of coaster that duels with itself or whatever, which wouldn't even be a worlds first anyway as it is just a sort of mobius loop without one of the stations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ste193 Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 It is a massive worlds first and word record, being a true genuine first and record (none of this 'steepest drop', 'first horror coaster' or 'ultimate / first psyco coaster' nonsense). It is secret too really - the record and inversion count have not been confirmed yet, it is only geek world sitting here comparing supports to plans who have worked it out, which we wouldn't have been able to do if it had been built over closed season as planned making it a secret until opening. And more importantly it is something which is clearly, concisely and easily marketable which people will understand and buy into needing to be a part of. The same can't be said of coaster that duels with itself or whatever, which wouldn't even be a worlds first anyway as it is just a sort of mobius loop without one of the stations. I don't really see it as a massive first and world record, it's a record that it constantly growing and constantly being beaten year after year, decade after decade, .it's not something that has a lasting legacy because it can so easilly be beaten and will be beaten in the future, it's like anything else, technology constantly adds more, anything can always be increased, so I'm hoping there is an "element" that gives its worlds first title and not just, look at us we've got more inversions than you.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJ Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 What I find surprising is not once have they even mentioned the record for most inversions. If you think back to Colossus, its marketing was based solely on the number of inversions, that was made clear right from the start. In fact the only purpose of Colossus was to go upside-down loads of times, resorting to endless heartline rolls achieve that fame. The Smiler, however, is so far being marketed by its theme, and already it has already generated significant interest without revealing its inversion record. Of they will announce the inversion record sooner or later, but I don't think it will be marketed as the ride's unique selling point. Also the way the 'world's first' element is being described as something you 'have to visit the park to find out' makes me believe it is something different than an inversion record... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 I don't really see it as a massive first and world record, it's a record that it constantly growing and constantly being beaten year after year, decade after decade, .it's not something that has a lasting legacy because it can so easilly be beaten and will be beaten in the future, it's like anything else, technology constantly adds more, anything can always be increased, so I'm hoping there is an "element" that gives its worlds first title and not just, look at us we've got more inversions than you.... http://rcdb.com/rhr.htm?m=4 11 years Colossus held the highest inversion record (and as the first one, Chimelong's can be ignored as it didn't beat or grow on Colossus)... Indeed, Colossus was built at the peak of the record breaking era in the industry, where everyone was trying to better each other with heigh, speed or inversions... Nowadays, it's just not deemed as big a deal to break a record like that (we went onto steepest drop and other assorted crap)... The numerous inversions will probably make some form of appearance in marketing, as it's simple to market to the masses... It'll be used in support to the rest of the ride though, and probably won't be the major calling to it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pluk Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 I can't quite get my head around people not thinking the world inversion record is a very big thing. It simply is, and it pushes the ride and part back onto the world stage in a huge way with something which will get noticed everywhere. That's not to say there's not surprises to come from it and I'm glad they are promoting it based on theme primarily, but going along the lines of 'worlds first self dueling coaster' is the sort of tortuous nonsense they come out with when the ride doesn't have anything real going for it. In this case it does. SteveJ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark9 Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 http://rcdb.com/rhr.htm?m=4 11 years Colossus held the highest inversion record (and as the first one, Chimelong's can be ignored as it didn't beat or grow on Colossus)... Indeed, Colossus was built at the peak of the record breaking era in the industry, where everyone was trying to better each other with heigh, speed or inversions... Nowadays, it's just not deemed as big a deal to break a record like that (we went onto steepest drop and other assorted crap)... The numerous inversions will probably make some form of appearance in marketing, as it's simple to market to the masses... It'll be used in support to the rest of the ride though, and probably won't be the major calling to it... We could go back to Dragon Khan as well which held the 8 inversion record for 7 years, or Goudurix which kept the 7 inversion record for 6 years.As you said the record market is pretty dead now, a lot of these world first things are play on words or trivial things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EC! Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 MORE PICTURES!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RideAddict Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 It simply is, and it pushes the ride and part back onto the world stage in a huge way with something which will get noticed everywhere. Yes, but the inversion record, as you wrote in another post up the page, hasn't been officially confirmed yet. Let's be honest, the marketing has been fantastic, and it's been made clear about how this ride will play mind games and mess with your head. That's all very well and good one thing, but inversions are another. I think people are forgetting Colossus was the world's first 10 looping rollercoaster, so even if The Smiler has, let's say 14 inversions, it's not to say you will go upside down 14 times. I can see it being the case that people will go, "Wow, this ride has the most inversions of any other ride!" and Alton Towers' response to that will be a sarcastic "Whatever, nothing special." so I'm hoping there is an "element" that gives its worlds first title and not just, look at us we've got more inversions than you.... Sadly, I don't think there will be - I'd like to be wrong, but at this stage, and with all the speculation flying about, I can't see another one on it's way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke_A Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 even if The Smiler has, let's say 14 inversions, it's not to say you will go upside down 14 times. Ehh? Surely an inversion is an inversion? How would it have 14 inversions but not invert you 14 times? Liam T and Sidders 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mer Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Isn't the definition of an inversion an element which turns riders upside down? How can you invert 14 times but not go upside down 14 times? (Or are we on about elements which some people count and some don't?) Also, nice photos EC! I particularly like the first one due to the angle and the blue sky Don't forget to credit which site you got them from though (unless of course they're yours!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeC Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 ^ Careful, you don't want to start that first drop debate again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Ehh? Surely an inversion is an inversion? How would it have 14 inversions but not invert you 14 times? Washing Machine of course... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke_A Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Washing Machine of course... Ah right, a bit like the dispute of whether or not S&S 4D coasters should have their rotating seat inversions counted with the actual track inversions. Now I understand... Although we all sort of know the washing machine is not happening now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saz Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 I remember reading or hearing somewhere that there would be a secret element as well as the 14 inversions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benin Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Ah right, a bit like the dispute of whether or not S&S 4D coasters should have their rotating seat inversions counted with the actual track inversions. Now I understand... Although we all sort of know the washing machine is not happening now. I know, as just being sarcastic about the whole thing... Probably not releasing any info on such a record until they feel like they want to push marketing to the next level... Let's be honest there's been bugger all since the ride was initially delayed, so they are blatently waiting till a confirmed date before pushing such stuff... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.S217 Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Going onto the secret Elements from the game do you reckon there will be sections to unlock the twist before the final twist and the two dive loops they seem to be the only things missing from the track structure on the Game:D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
- Michael - Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 Sometimes they have marketed it as world beating rollercoaster, which I would assume is the inversion record, but they also use the worlds first tag line, and the way it's presented in the game still makes me think it will have something else. But anyway, all speculation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coaster Posted April 5, 2013 Report Share Posted April 5, 2013 The game poorly makes it look like there are 7 secret elements! Also, to the people saying there won't be one, why would the game say there was? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ste193 Posted April 6, 2013 Report Share Posted April 6, 2013 I can't quite get my head around people not thinking the world inversion record is a very big thing. It simply is, and it pushes the ride and part back onto the world stage in a huge way with something which will get noticed everywhere. That's not to say there's not surprises to come from it and I'm glad they are promoting it based on theme primarily, but going along the lines of 'worlds first self dueling coaster' is the sort of tortuous nonsense they come out with when the ride doesn't have anything real going for it. In this case it does. It really isn't a very big thing in my opinion I don't see why such a fuss is made about it because it's something that's so easilly beatable and it's nothing special/unique in my eyes like say Th13teens vertical drop or being different type/make of roller coaster or a new inversion (correct me if I'm wrong), but it's something that's so easily beatable, it may be a title held for a few more years but there were will soon be other coasters come and go in the future with 15,16,17 inversions I'm sure because it's a title that isn't challenging to snatch... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pluk Posted April 6, 2013 Report Share Posted April 6, 2013 It really isn't a very big thing in my opinion I don't see why such a fuss is made about it because it's something that's so easilly beatable and it's nothing special/unique in my eyes like say Th13teens vertical drop or being different type/make of roller coaster or a new inversion (correct me if I'm wrong), but it's something that's so easily beatable, it may be a title held for a few more years but there were will soon be other coasters come and go in the future with 15,16,17 inversions I'm sure because it's a title that isn't challenging to snatch... And with thirteen having been copied a couple of times already (including by another manufacturer) what is so special about that now? I'm usually all against enthusiasts being being seen as different to the GP, but in this case I'd say there is a difference. The GP would not give the slightest toss about a new type of inversion - upside down is upside down. Even a whole new ride type in The Swarm didn't exactly grab them, did it? They might enjoy something new like that once they're on it, but marketing something like that to them just wouldn't work. And that will be the measure of success from the parks point of view - how many bums does it get on seats. We'd all turn up obviously, but would anyone else? Whether or not you think it is a good thing to be chasing, a world record will always be very marketable for the time it is held (likely to be multiple years like previously), gain a lot interest and appear on lists all around the world. That's what I mean by a big deal. It also seems that with this there is a lot more to it than that record alone - a good solid ride and theme underneath. So something for everyone then! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RideAddict Posted April 6, 2013 Report Share Posted April 6, 2013 And with thirteen having been copied a couple of times already (including by another manufacturer) what is so special about that now? Which rides are they then, and where? The GP would not give the slightest toss about a new type of inversion - upside down is upside down. Yes, you're right to an extent, but there are rides which have got the public talking. Stealth, with it's height and speed. Th13teen, with it's in-the-dark drop. Saw, with it's theme and drop. I've seen it all before, kids and adults acting like 16 year-olds discovering Facebook. Think of it this way, if they don't get them talking, then why does this topic go through umpteen pages of speculation a month? We're all at it, guilty, and in the minority. Today I recieved a reminder in the post, reminding me to renew my pass. It mentions about The Smiler opening in summer 2013. Now May is still spring, as summer starts on 21st June. This may give reason as to why they have yet so far to go until completion! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeC Posted April 6, 2013 Report Share Posted April 6, 2013 (edited) Which rides are they then, and where? Polar X-plorer at Legoland Billund (*EDIT* Zierer) and Verbolten at Busch Gardens Williamsburg (Zierer). This is common enthusiast knowledge TBH. Edited April 6, 2013 by James2 Sidders 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RideAddict Posted April 6, 2013 Report Share Posted April 6, 2013 Well excuse me for not having common enthusiast knowledge! When it comes to foreign parks, I'm a little rusty, and I've not really had a chance to try other theme parks in the world! ste193, AJ and aTOMic 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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