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An interesting question with a few answers. First off, to answer you concern: it was nothing to do with it being "too extreme". There wasn't enough serious complaints from guests who did it to warrant its removal. Frankly, I don't even know if there were any complaints - everyone knew what they were getting themselves in for. These sorts of experiences have a niche market (albeit, Thorpe and Towers' alone experiences expanded and simultaneously watered-down the niche). A short answer: There wasn't a strong enough drive internally to get it to come back. Devising the experience takes time (it wasn't simply "actors do whatever they want"), and there was no one who was in a position (in terms of the time-commitment required) to create it. There had been some backlash from actors about the experience who didn't feel comfortable doing it (something I'll go into later), plus it could add another hour onto an already very long day, where they have to work 10x harder. Those two together meant it just wouldn't get off the ground. A long answer: Less of an answer, and more of a story.. Face it Alone came about in 2013, with the park trying to diversify their line up and really focus on becoming a bigger, better and more unique Halloween event. The Lionsgate IP bought in the brands and the interest, completely refreshing the concept of Fright Nights. They tried new maze concepts: choices (Cabin in the Woods) and outdoors (Blair Witch Project). They introduced a (sadly poorly received) overnight experience, which was trendy at the time, and pushed forward with the Face it Alone: an extreme and an alone experience in one; again something which was trending and on the up in the scare industry at the time. For anyone that did it in 2013, you'll no doubt know that every experience was different. The actors were given a scope of things they could do, boundaries they could push and ideas they could toy with. It was free-reign, but it gave the actors a much freer realm to work in. Another important thing to note is that Face it Alone wasn't particularly popular in 2013. People were unsure what exactly it was, whether it was worth the £15, etc. You could also choose which maze to experience. Which all in all meant it was easier to organise, give a personal touch, etc. When 2014 came along, the experience changed somewhat. Whilst it was still 'extreme', the actors stuck to much stricter roles. Basically, actor 1 did x to you, actor 2 did y to you, etc. By no means a bad thing (if planned correctly, this can be a very good thing), just different. Again, this year you could choose your own maze and, whilst it had gained popularity, it was still pretty calm. 2015 is when everything changed, and was arguably the beginning of the end. Face it Alone became a much bigger spectacle. Gone were the days of choosing your own maze, and it was instead replaced with the Roulette Ceremony by Big Top. A great idea in fairness, and one that many enjoyed. This meant it garnered more attention and became much more popular, and went outside of the niche. Already teetering on the edge here. 2015 did go back to 2013's free realm style too. There were clearly things that certain actors had to do at certain points to progress you through the experience, but in between actors had a very large scope of what they could do. The next thing with 2015 was the overt sexualisation of the experiences. It's probably not suitable to discuss the details on a public forum, but many things done within the experiences weren't scare tactics, they were simply there sexualised things made to make people feel uncomfortable, humiliated and uncertain. This was the first year that a safe word was introduced too. Safe words do appear in many extreme attractions, but I don't think it's a coincidence that a safe word appeared at the same time the sexualised content of Face it Alone occurred. This was a completely different direction to what had happened before. Whilst Face it Alone may have featured things like nudity/being tied up/etc - ie things that COULD be sexualised - they never WERE. By doing so, it adds a very different tone. And this tone meant that people were enjoying these experiences in a very different way. There were plenty of times that people within Face it Alone experiences were asking for certain things to be done to them so that they could 'get their money's worth' and be satisfied with the experience. These sorts of things had happened in previous years, but not to the degree they had happened in 2015. This, unsurprisingly, led to some actors being rather uncomfortable with the experience. Come 2016, things had been toned down again. It went back more to 2014's "carbon copy" style experience. Originally it led to some complaints that it wasn't as extreme. I think one issue was that the 2015 version of Face it Alone had created a following of people who hadn't experienced extreme attractions outside of Face it Alone, so they had a very set idea of what should happen. When this didn't happen, it lead to that sort of backlash. Getting the balancing act right likely proved hard. And yet there were still people asking for certain things to be done to them, etc. Then 2017 came along, there had been a feeling of discomfort for a while from some actors. The experience had expanded too far out and wasn't something that could be controlled and marketed as it should. People changed roles. The amount of work required to hit that sweet spot was ever-growing, for perhaps diminishing returns. Fright Nights also focused on The Walking Dead, and AMC are known for very strict guidelines about their attractions. Working out a Face it Alone experience for those mazes would have been near-on impossible. So everything together just meant it didn't happen, and it hasn't returned since. And that's that. New external IP, internal concerns and arguably a bit of apathy/running out of steam all really finished it off. Maybe in the future it can return. With the AMC contract disappearing soon that would help. Seeing the extreme version of Creepy Caves at Chessington being a success probably helps. But it requires a lot of work, a lot more than many perhaps realise and appreciate. And I'm not sure I could see it happening soon.

I hate this guy

I'll be making my television debut and appearing on classic quiz show Countdown! My debut is this Friday (Oct 28th), airing at 2.10pm on Channel 4, and of course available on catch up after. There'll also be a bit of geeky chatter and roller coaster puns, because of course they run with me being a roller coaster enthusiast and turned it into my entire personality (not far wrong tbf). Would be lovely if anyone gave my episodes a watch!

Have removed a couple of posts from here - Regardless on your opinions on Nick’s music - fair play to him for organising this - just looked and I saw he’s raised almost £600 to donate to a mental health charity and no one deserves to be berated for that - that’s significant amount especially during these times from such a niche market. Whilst I get it may not be everyone’s cup of tea I think it’s great people when people l come together and do things like this which will ultimately benefit others more in need, especially in times like this!

For £10 I will expect to have a ball gag in my mouth, made to squeal like a pig and crawl around on all fours whilst being pushed about and then have a big fat man dressed as a baby put a custard pie in my face and throw straw at me #BigTopBraveItAlone #TheGoodOldDays #SharedBallGagNotCovidSecure

I am really getting quite sick and tired of seeing enthusiasts moaning and crying about POSTPONED trips to theme parks this year thanks to the pandemic. Look, I know this page is ofcourse a forum dedicated to a theme park and I myself am very proud of being an enthusiast. However, I do feel some enthusiasts on social media really need to look at what's going on in the world before they go on an Ian Beale style "IVE GOT NOTHING LEFT" sulk about postponed park visits. People are losing their jobs and with that, the abillity to make a living to pay the bills. More importantly, many people are losing loved ones to this virus. So with all that happening, I personally find it hard to feel sympathy to a bunch of people who are crying over not being able to visit parks that will STILL BE AROUND when all this is said and done. Those who are losing loved ones do not have that luxury. I have a friend who lost her nan recently and was not even allowed to attend her own nans funeral. So yes, forgive me if I find it hard to feel sorry for having to wait a little longer to ride the likes of Shambhala,Taron, Zadra,Taiga and Iron Gwazi or going to flaming Disneyland Paris. Rant over. Again I know this doesn't apply to all enthusiasts but I am seeing enough of it to really get on my wick. It's not just postponed park trips. It's also the sulking over canceled festivals and concerts. People should check their priorities as far as I'm concerned.

God he's good. Must be why he's a mod. Waff zooooooom splosh splish splash I was takin a bath rub a dub dub things are lookng UP. I'm desperate, so where can I.P. We need more time, lord.

I predict that construction for Project Exodus will go vertical on Monday 9th October. I reckon the first supports will go in sometime between 11am and 1pm that day.

Looks like a load of dumped shingle/hardstanding to me, almost certainly for storage, site offices etc. One would assume the loggers trough that's underneath it next to the CFM/LL station building will be the very last piece of Loggers that'll be removed (and then cut into slices to sell as merch innit). I eagerly await the Peepy Poop guy to say something along the lines of: Exodus has something in STORE, and the ROAD maybe shorter then you think. Buckwheats or out of luckwheats Rocky or just rocks Time will tell. Who's Ghost Train is it? (oh hold up went off on a tangent there)

I imagine next year will be a near repeat of this year. TWD, DBGTROTD, BM all closed. Capacity issues elsewhere. If only they had a nice open space like a farm to relax in, a large capacity train ride to take you there, an event space like an arena where people could be spread over a large searing area, or a log flume where each riding group could have their own socially distanced ride vehicle.

So here's the Thorpe problem in a nutshell. Their investment in the 2000's was big. it was exciting, it was dynamic, it was a dream to be a Uk theme park fan with rides left right and centre. But the Thorpe problem comes down to a lack of space and a lack of diversity. They've got themselves into a rut when The Swarm kind of failed. Their target audience demands the newest, most exciting attractions. Who cares about Colossus and its measly ten inversions when The Smiler has fourteen.So then when they fail to grow, they start to downsize. The problems start to increase. The lack of investment means a lack of return which just spirals until we get to now. Thorpe doesn't have the advantages of the family market. Chessington went through a similar slump when it left the thrill market altogether and turned to family. The difference there though is that the family market spends money. Kids demand toys and treats. Ap family holders are all too happy to grab a nice meal and a pint with their family. They like staying in an over-priced hotel. Kerching. Thorpe's target audience doesn't. Thorpe AP holders are happy to only spend a pound in the park all day. It starts to cost too much money to remove the SBNO attractions. Just build a wall. Who do you target at now when the bulk of your attractions are thrill heavy. Really there is absolutely no reason why the park couldn't build a family rollercoaster or some entry level flat rides (give me a breakdance you cowards). But they won't because all they want are headlines and aren't interested in sustaining the park beyond the end of the financial year. So we get short term rubbish like I'm a Celeb or Black Mirror instead of attractions that stand the test of time. I'm amazed that Chessington actually replaced Black Bucaneer and are replacing Rameses with a generic drop tower AND redid Tomb Blaster AND built a Rainforest area, refurbishing Toadies and building a Log Flume at the same time. This stuff never happens at Merlin, it will certainly never happen at Thorpe because the idea of cookie-cutter attractions would never fly. So instead the current attractions just age away and nothing gets built or done. If you were to ask me what Thorpe should do, I'd go with refurbish attractions, build rides that attract a wider audience and beef up that awful entrance with a new look and better security stations. Inferno shouldn't be turning green, family rollercoasters are awesome additions and a stabbing should never be able to happen again. There is absolutely no point in building an RMC or B&M Hyper if the rest of the park looks like a rubbish dump. Putting a bow on trash is still trash. And that for me is the Thorpe problem.

Hopefully it will be used to show replays of live streams where YouTubers say a ride name 50,000 times.

I would sell my soul for Exodus to open tomorrow just so we never have to listen to this nonsense ever again.

You might want to avoid supermarkets for the next couple of months m8

Not once did D.M.K mention crowds or the park being busy as a source of disappointment. All the issues raised were operational and customer services ones completely in the parks control.

Where have I heard these things before? Let me ask my buddy, Derren: "I don't know Josh, I just don't know..."

I have said this time and time again. A fan forum will almost certainly reflect the current state of what it is dedicated to which in this case is Thorpe Park. If Thorpe Park was performing and delivering to its potential, this forum would reflect that with members getting real excited about the place. As it is, the park has been a shadow of its old self for a few years now to the point where many who once loved it are now staying away as they are fed up. So ofcourse this forum reflects that. It would be nice to see positivity.....but when the park is leaving little to find positives in, its hardly surprising that you see more constructive criticism on here

We can’t all be positive when there is nothing to be positive about.

I went on the BTS tour of the park today. Great tour it should be said; it was headed up by Russ, who is a fantastic speaker. I did mean to ask about the screen, but honestly forgot. It does seem like it won't be fixed for start of season (I believe the park said this in the passholder group a few weeks back too). A real shame. Hopefully they can hide the dead pixels with whatever they put on the screen. Okay, now time for some updates. Everything is still a Work in Progress it should be stressed Toilets Loo enthusiasts rejoice. All the toilets have received some love. Swarm toilets. The walls have been painted green (originally white), and no more foot pedal sinks Megastore toilets are nicely themed Tidal Wave The rebuilt bridge, with the original Pier 13 style. The fire effect is proving very tricky to implement, but is being planned still Big Easy Boulevard Stealth Colossus The park have released that the entrance is a bit flat, and so are looking to add more colour/depth to it, although this will happen mid-season. The shop front looks nice. In terms of the rest of the repaint, and indeed a Sparkle Project continuation, the park hope to do that either next closed season, or the closed season after. The park want to do it regardless, and recognise they need to keep up appearances - literally - now that they've started to do this. Personally, I hope it happens next closed season, as it does look a little jarring in places. The park is looking lovely though, with the Hyperia area coming along and looking smart. There's other small updates too, such as KFC getting refitted and other new food places. Some parts of the park are still a bit tired looking / haven't really been touched. Rumba/Inferno is the big example I would say. And the Sparkling up does highlight how tatty some parts of that area, and the likes of Swarm and Saw, look. I do wonder if this means that, come opening, some enthusiasts will focus too much on those and not the fab stuff that we've seen heavily documented and shouted out about. But yes, it's clear to see the park have put time, effort and money into things this winter, and they're taking strides in the right direction. I'm excited to see what will happen and hope their plans pay off!

Pretty cool how clearly you can see the inversion from Staines Lane. Just walking to the site now to take some pics. 😁 EDIT: Extra track piece going in This part's gonna be so weird but thrilling 🤩 Other piece going in now Slowly but surely Final photo before I post the rest. They positioned originally but then took it back down after. Looks like they're securing it into place now.

Being serious for a moment though. I sense most of the negativity towards the name is because of it being similar sounding to Hyperion at Energylandia Lets be real though, what percentage of the people walking through the gate at Thorpe on any given day actually have heard of even Energylandia let alone Hyperion??

It'll be called Big Bird.

That's gone well then.

I mean, she had such a huge impact in Haunted House and Duel. Pivotal almost.

You've had some fun silly posts, but there comes a point when you cross a line and it just reads like a spam bot. This is the point. Let's stop the overt obtuseness now please.

Piff paff wipee woo waaa. Upppppp and awayyyyyyy. Someone's knocking at your door, someone's ringing the bell. I'm loving it.

So I was recently lucky enough to head across to Poland to visit Energylandia In Zator. The main reason to visit the park ofcourse was the hotly anticipated new for 2019 RMC Hybrid Zadra. So for this write up, I will be sharing my full thoughts on this well received in the coaster community coaster and where it matches up to my top coasters. A brief history and background!! Zadra is Rocky Mountain Constructions second “hyper hybrid" ibox track coaster with the first being my personal number one coaster Steel Vengeance. It is also the third RMC installation on the continent behind Wildfire at Kolmarden and Untamed at Walibi Holland. Zadra is also the very first RMC Ibox track coaster to be a ground up installation. Previously, RMC would use the “topper track” design that features on rides like Lightning Rod and Wildfire for their ground up designs whereas the “Ibox" track design would be used on conversions of pre-existing wooden coasters. So this was the first use of Ibox track for a ground up model. At opening, Zadra would break the records set by Steel Vengeance for the tallest and fastest Hybrid coaster by a whopping 1 FOOT and 1MPH. Zadra will lose the record for fastest when Iron Gwazi at Busch Gardens Tampa opens (also by 1mph!!) and will see its height record matched by the new Florida hyper hybrid. It will also lose the record it shares with Steel Vengeance for steepest drop (90 degree) on a hybrid when Iron Gwazi opens by 1 degree!! Zadra initially was going to open at the park in 2020. However, as a result of it being completed ahead of schedule, the park was able to open it at the end of August 2019. This is even more impressive given a portion of the structure was blown over in a storm during its construction!! Heading to Zadra/ Dragon Zone Zadra is located at the very back of the park in the new expanded area the park has built into. So on entering Energylandia and walking through what could best be described as a glorified fun fair, you will find an underpass to take you to the other side of the road and into “Dragon zone" (or Dragon Castle) and you will find a new Medieval themed village with a few stores and eateries with Zadra towering above the lot of it on the right hand side. This area is charming enough with its audio (featuring an appearance from Hall Of The Mountain King!!) and the odd show going on. This area also features two family coasters and a kiddy flat ride. To get to the star attraction, you will walk through the entirety of this themed area where you will then find the entrance to Zadra on the right. The queue!! There has been a lot of enthusiasts who have visited the park and cried blue murder over the sheer length of Zadras physical queue line and I can now safely say, they are not unjustified in their comments!!. I have ridden many coasters in my time and not once have I found a coaster that has a queue of such a ridiculous length to walk through than what Zadra takes to navigate. Coupled with the fact there are NO short cuts whatsoever to cut off some of the queue, you WILL have to deal with this walk every single time you ride Zadra. This massively hurts the rides reliability unless you are as fit as a fiddle and just enjoy walking for a ridiculous amount of time. The queue takes 5-7 minutes to navigate and I kid you not, equates to half a mile worth of walking when you convert steps into mile. If you are familiar with the FLY queue and the length of that queue than that may give you a slight idea what to expect with Zadra. It also does not help when theres a fair few stairs to climb up and down to get to the ride aswell. So yes. I would advise getting fit before heading out to ride this thing However!! Whilst the queue is insanely long, it is relatively aesthetically pleasing on the eye with the medieval style walls in certain places and also allows for some wonderful views of the coaster. So this is a big positive for those who enjoy video taking and photography. The lockers So after finally reaching the station buidling for Zadra, you will be faced with the locker area. Energylandia offers a fairly decent locker set up in where you pay around the same as £1 and you are given a wristband for all day lockers. You will scan your wristband and then you will be allocated a locker to store bags and loose belongings in. The lockers are double sided so you will collect your belongings from the other side of the wall on exiting the ride. No belongings are allowed to be left in the station. Operations/batching On placing your items in your locker, you will climb the stairs and head to be batched. Zadra (as well as Hyperion) uses a pretty neat loading system where there are four screens which count down the amount of riders who can go through into the station. One screen is for the front row line. Another screen is for single riders and two more screens are for the rest of the train. Once the counter shows theres seats for you, you will go through to board the coaster. A tip if you want the back row. Try to make sure you get yourself in a position where you are in front of the door to the station and as soon as it opens, make a beeline for the back. You can NOT request a row from my experience whilst in the station. Depending on what mood Energylandia are in, they will run it on one or two trains. So if you are wanting the front row, be aware that you will be waiting a long time if they opt to run it on one given the length of the coaster. Operations on Zadra was very bizarre on my visit. They opened on one train and then when the queue got longer it put a second on but then half an hour later, they took the second off when the queue went back down. Then the real “what the hell!!?” moment came later on where one hour before closing, they swapped trains around which wasted well over 15 minutes of my time. Its also worth noting that if the ride is walk on, they will wait until the train is near full until they send it. So abandon any hope of a “zen ride" on it before going to ride!! A part of me feels the train swap I mentioned earlier was a way of building the queue up a little. The trains So after all the effort it took to get to this point, it is now time to head into the nicely styled station of Zadra and board the train. Zadra ofcourse uses the standard RMC trains so you will be greeted with the usual policy of fasten your seatbelt but let the operator put the bar down. Although on my rides, the staff insisted on doing the seatbelt aswell. The trains feature the standard RMC restraints of a lapbar and a pair of shin guards. As I have mentioned previously with my reviews on the other RMC coasters, these restraints cause me personally no bother at all. However, if you are a larger rider or have larger legs then they can cause major discomfort. Its also worth noting that the shinguards on Zadra are slightly thicker than the ones on Untamed and Steel Vengeance. So be aware of this if you found the restraints on those two painful. The operators on my visit also seemed to be hell bent on causing me as much pain as possible. As in, literally slamming the restaint down on me and trying to put it as far down as possible. Compared to how I was treated on Steel Vengeance and Untamed, this left a very sour taste in my mouth. Hopefully in future visits, this wont be the case. The coaster itself After being given the clearance to dispatch, you are on your way!!. The train glides out of the station and dips down to the right before latching onto the loud (the mark of a Hyper Hybrid lift hill!!) 206 foot lift hill. Ascending this hill, you are greeted with some amazing views of the area around you. With the local countryside to the right and front of you and the new Dragon zone area to the left. You also will get some views of the all new Aqualantis area. The train ascends this lift hill at a quick speed and sooner than you think, you reach the top and hit the 200 plus foot vertical drop!! This drop is a pure and utter stunner!! You are raised out of your seat the whole way down regardless of where you sit and as it drops into the wooden structure, it creates one hell of a head chopper moment. This drop feels exactly the same as that on Steel Vengeance in terms of the physical sensation and you WILL feel the force at the bottom of this drop but given the head chopper at the bottom, this rides drop just about edges that on big Steve!! Speeding through the woodwork, you will turn slightly to the right over a small speed hill where the camera for your onride photo is to the right. This speed hill is then followed by the highlight of the coaster. At a massive 76mph, you will bank upwards aggressively to the left in a massive turn around before levelling up at the top before plummeting back down to ground level. This element is an amazing combo of intensity and airtime. As you bank upwards, you are right on your side feeling grey out level of force and when you hit the top and drop down you get a beautiful sustainted pop of ejector airtime. This is the absolute show stealer on Zadra. On exiting this element, the train will shoot up into the Zero G Stall and boy is this a cracker of an inversion. You enter and exit the element at a great speed and experience some stunning hangtime. The height of this element also adds to that hangtime sensation massively. The best inversion on the coaster. Still travelling at a breakneck pace, the train then sharply turns left into its outwards airtime hill which sharply throws riders from right to left before navigating some turns before hitting the massive airtime hill. This airtime hill is utterly brilliant. Going through it offers a good mix of ejector and floater airtime and is a good solid intense moment. Following this, the train shoots up into its second inversion which is a Zero G Roll in the middle of the wooden structure. It takes this element at a quick pace and coupled with the rider being surrounded with the structure, it is a real disorientating element and offers great headchoppers. Yet another great element. Speeding out the structure, the train shoots through a double down element which offers two pops of solid ejector which feels like shades of the Untamed and Steel Vengeance airtime. The ride will then race through an S turn which throws the rider around even more before it enters a very fastly taken Zero G Roll before turning to the left and into the very aggressive breaks. Brace yourself for these breaks as you will be lunged right forward into your restraint. Let the speed it hits the breaks at tell you how fast this coaster navigates its 1316 metres of track!!. The ride then heads back into the station and you are free to exit and ride again!!....if you really want to make that walk again that is!! Overall thoughts Zadra is incredible. Absolutely incredible. I at the time of updating this have now done three trips to Energylandia and each time it has got better and better. Whilst I do not think Energylandia is a particularly great park (for now!!) Thanks largely to its glorified fun fair feel, they have absolutely struck gold with Zadra. Zadra is a perfect mix of intensity,airtime,hangtime,speed and transitions. Loads of people have been dismissive of the airtime on Zadra by watching POV videos of it but let me tell you that the airtime on this should not be underestimated. It is not all about the airtime like what Untamed is but my lord it still has some strong moments of it. What makes Zadra great to me is its use of speed throughout the whole course. It really does not lose any steam from drop to breaks and of anything, it could have gone on much longer if it wanted to with the speed it hits the breaks at. It really is paced wonderfully and has a flawless layout. Surprisingly, I found the front row of this coaster to be the best row on it by an ever so slight margin. With Untamed and Steel Vengeance, I go for the back but on Zadra, I found the front to be where its at. You still get a good drop there and you feel the speed and airtime very well in the front. The back row however gives one heck of a pull over the drop and over the massive turnaround element. So both rows definitely excel over the other in some regards. The million pound question when Zadra came around was “is this going to be the Steel Vengeance killer?”. In my own personal opinion, the answer to that is no as Steel Vengeance has all of whats great about Zadra AND Untamed in one package. The extra 30 plus seconds on Steel Vengeance is to me is what clinches it. Whilst I prefer Steel Vengeance, it is by an ever so slight margin and if Zadra lasted an additional 15-20 seconds, it may well have been the coaster to displace Steel Vengeance. On my initial rides on Zadra in 2020, I was also convinced I also preferred Untamed over at Walibi but having now done additional trips to both of these hybrids, it really is now a no contest that Zadra is not only the best RMC in Europe but also HANDS DOWN the best coaster overall in Europe. It really does offer such an unrelenting ferocious coaster in what is a relatively short ride time. I personally would rather a 40 second coaster that has no dead spots and ferocious pacing than I would a coaster that is a minute and a half and farts about for most of it. So Zadra to me is just ideal. One negative as I mentioned earlier is that the rerideabillity of Zadra is greatly harmed by the excessive length of the queue. Even if you love riding a coaster over and over, its just so hard to motivate yourself to walk all the way back round Zadra to do so. The other silly negative negative is the fact front row riders are required to wear goggles in the front. This is also present at Hyperion. To the best of my understanding, this was in place BEFORE Covid but was bought back post Covid (it we can call it that) so makes zero sense how we could do without them for two years but magically need them now That being said, Zadra is a stunning coaster and takes its place at number 2 on my top coaster list. It really is a great coaster from start to finish and once again showcases that RMC are the top dog in the coaster industry and that other manufacturers need to up their game to keep up with them. Please get yourself out there to ride it whenever you can and you will not be disappointed in this absolute masterpiece. 10/10

Has there really not been a post here for over a year, even with Velocicoaster opening. Wow. So I managed to get over to Florida after a two year delay and part of the trip was to give Universal a bit more time to enjoy. I usually give the whole resort a day to do everything but this time each park got a day. Which I think is more than enough as with good planning you can get on everything you want really easily. Whilst everyone rushes to Hagrid's and Velocicoaster, we started with Hulk, Spiderman, the Seuss rides, Forbidden Journey and Jurassic Park before 10:30. Which is the ideal order as it covers over half the major stuff before going into the longer waits. Baring in mind, the last time I went, the Dragons had only just stopped duelling so majority is new. So:- New Hulk- Rides better then the previous version and the soundtrack really adds to the ride. I still maintain that the last third of the ride are a complete waste of time but the first two thirds are so snappy, precisely paced and hit after hit that I am more forgiving than I was in 2012. Spiderman is great, still remains a revolution in dark ride design and is a lot of fun. Seuss land is nice. Forbidden Journey has aged really well. It is a lot of fun and now that it doesn't command an hour queue at a minimum, its so much easier to ride and a lot less is hanging on the ride experience to deliver. My fiancé doesn't understand a thing about Harry Potter but appreciated the effects and ride experience. I'm completely biased in saying River Adventure is one of my favourite rides at the resort. I love dinosaur themed attractions, I love Jurassic Park and I love the variation and story telling of this attraction. It's so much fun and the physical precense of the dinosaurs really adds to make this a 10/10 attraction. So there. So to start.. Velocicoaster. So this is one of the best rides in the world. I think we all saw this coming but it further refines the successes that Intamin have had with Maverick, Taron and Taiga and I think adding this in a Universal park, one that commands huge attention in the theme park industry will bring Intamin a lot of success. We got four rides in various rows and it delivers in every seat. It feels like what would happen if Taron were more refined. Thats not to say that I think its better then Phantasialands ride (The jury is still out on that front) but the two are very similar in terms of sensation and pops or airtime litter both rides. Pacing is important to me and this ride has it in droves. The theming is okay, I think the story itself is a bit forgotten the moment you complete the first launch and it just becomes another rollercoaster albeit this has a beautiful location over the lake. Next Hagrid's motorbike thing. We waited an hour each for both of our rides and this ride is okay. It throws every Intamin trick in the book at you and its frankly a miracle that this works. I don't think its the greatest ride in the world because the Harry Potter implementation is a tad too weak for a Hogsmeade ride and frankly a lot of it is just a bit meandering. I admire the ambition if nothing else. So thats IoA for another decade. A great visit. 26F85C4E-CCD9-4EB2-801F-3CFE4F83D57B.heic

It's loggers, isn't it? 😄

I believe it is currently waiting on a part. I think it's been removed from the app, so will probably be down for a while. Rotten timing given the weather and it being half term. This is a dreadful idea in my opinion. Despite what many people think, queue prediction is hard. Few parks actually manage to do it well in my opinion. At the moment, it is even more volatile thanks to Covid and social distancing (or lack thereof). I imagine this idea is being tried for the following reasons: 1. They don't know what the queue times are when they're very long 2. They're getting a lot of complaints because of long advertised queue times When it comes to solving problem 1, there's not much they can do short term. The park is busy, queues will be long. But that in itself is a problem. A quick look on social media suggests that plenty of people feel that numbers aren't being restricted enough for Covid. Should the park, in future, be restricting numbers more? Should they now be looking at relaxing social distancing measures on rides (filling up all seats / rows)? The second problem is more insightful to their thought process. Anyone who's filled out one of the park's survey machines will know that you're asked a question to the effect of 'Did queueing spoil your day?'. This is a pretty big KPI that all the Merlin parks (and likely parks outside of Merlin) are interested in. Presumably, at the moment, they're getting a very high percentage of people answering "Yes" to 'Did queueing spoil your day?'. They've probably also noticed that "Rides per head" (the average number of rides each person has ridden) is low. As such, one possible conclusion that could be drawn is that "People aren't riding rides and saying that queueing has spoilt their day. We're advertising long queue times, so maybe people are put off by the long queue times". The solution there is then to not advertise long queue times, but instead advertise a minimum waiting time. That might not be what has happened. To be honest, I'd be surprised if there's people looking into KPI scores and probing in that way to come to that conclusion in that way. But it's a possible thought process. Equally, it could just be that they're getting a ton of complaints of 'The queues are all saying they're 2 hours'. As Matt says, people will not see the '+' here, and just assume a 90 minute queue. People leave common sense at the door when going to a theme park. There's another problem I've skirted around here. Operations in general. In my experience this year, they've been a mixed bag. Certainly not as bad as they have been in recent years, but not as good as they should be. Why that is, I don't know. But they need to come up with practical solutions to be able to get more consistent operations that are sensible and in line with what the rides can achieve, and with what the park needs. As for the more specific topic at hand... 1. If this is a trial to see if '90+' works, I hope they see it doesn't work, and they see that quickly. 2. If there's concerns about accuracy, introduce broader time frames, especially for higher values. 3. Work on actually make queue times accurate. More on this below. 4. The park need to understand that, ultimately, long queues are happening To expand on these points... 2. Perhaps they should introduce ranges like '90-100', '100-120', '120-150', '150-180'. When a queue is at that high level, it doesn't matter if it's 120 or 140 really, it's still a 2-2.5hour commitment of your day. Next to no one is going to enter a 140 minute queue, and then check their watch just before boarding and go 'Ooh, well that queue only took us 137 minutes, great job!' 3. I'm sure some remember a trial that happened on Saw a few years back to improve queue time accuracy. This would display queue times accurate to the minute, rather than in increments of 5-10 minutes. There's more details on this technology, provided by a company call Headmapper, here: http://www.headmapper.com/case-studies Interestingly, there is also a report which outlines how successful the trial was in 2015, which is largely positive. The technology was again used in 2017 for another trial. One reason why it didn't seem to carry on was costs involved with the product. Another is because it's a bit of faffy system which requires fixed cameras at certain locations (when usually, cameras are need to be moveable for security purposes)....so it would involve the costly installation of more cameras. So if the park really wants to improve queue accuracy and have a positive impact on people's day out, they could put their money where their mouth is and fork out for this. But then that still doesn't address the above point. And why spend out so much for something that doesn't tackle all the issues here. There are alternatives though, which are much cheaper. However, getting people within the park to get on board with the idea that queue accuracy is important is much harder than one might expect. So unless there's a shift in philosophy on that, this will never happen. 4. I'm not saying that the park don't know that long queues happen, or that they're bad or anything. But from my experience, there's a certain fear in acknowledging that the park will have long queues, and that this impacts that all important aforementioned KPI. Instead, there's an over-focus on improving queue accuracy, short term incentives to ride staff for improving throughputs and other weird stuff. Instead, there should be an acceptance that queues will be long as it stands and looking at ways to sustainably ensure that this causes minimal impact to someone's day. This should include making queues more interesting to be in, investing in the park so there's more things to do and making the park a more pleasant place to be in outside of the rides. And that should happen on top of the park improving queue accuracy and throughputs. Even if that should be a secondary focus. --- Wow, that was a bit of rambling rant. I'm sure some people on here know this is something I've had prior involvement in in one way or another. and even if not, it's probably clear I have some level of interest in this at a deeper level. Obviously there's many issues here, and many of them are long term, costly things to sort out. It's worth looking at short term alternatives, as well as little things that can be trialled in the short term to get a gauge on if they work. But honestly, this is the equivalent of sticking a used plaster on a wound that needs stitches. In short, the park need to acknowledge that they will always have long queue times, invest in the park to improve the number of things people can do, have queue lines be more interesting to be in and put some actual thought into how to estimate queue lengths over just picking a number out of thin air

2021 Edition Part two. The other day, someone said Steel Vengeance was over-rated. I'm going to stand out here, shout to the world that if you decide to refer to something as over-rated then you have no critical discourse whatsoever and you need to pick up a thesaurus and learn some new descriptive language. Saying something is over-rated is the laziest critique anyone can possibly muster up because it requires no explanation and only looks to disregard peoples opinion. It says to others, 'sure you like a ride but thats only because you're following the crowd. No, I am the only true oracle, the only one that can see past the rose tinted glasses of hype and I stand before you now to tell you that you're a blind sheeple. Follow me, I declare that Steel vengeance/Taron/Nemesis/anything people quite like isn't as good as you think it is'. Under-rated is different. There are so many attractions out there (Alpina Blitz at Nigloland for example) that fall completely under the radar and deserve to be spoken about more. The term under-rated is actually quite nice because it can be used to inspire people to try something or go somewhere they wouldn't necessarily go to without the recommendation. Over-rated is an awful awful phrase and looks to just belittle others viewpoints and enjoyment.

You also get a prime view of the mass refurbishment that is happening to transform Tomb Blaster back into Terror Tomb for the 2021 season.. I heard dan from the donut stall is happy to give more info

I love it when Jack comes back every year or so to complain about Fastrack at Thorpe. It's like when Steve posts every now and then to tell us how **** Merlin are. It's like a comfort blanket.

2 years. A lot can happen in that time, and for me that has involved a baby. So that has also meant 2 years without theme park trips (unfortunately a 2021/22 New Years Trip to Europa Park got spited by Covid rules changing) and it's been a interesting time. So behold a trip report to Chessie. My first theme park many a year ago, felt only right to continue such a rite of passage to my own spawn who will be forced to endure terrible football (already done) and varying quality theme parks. Chessie has changed a lot since my last visit over 7 years ago, or has it? First stop (after many toing and froing from the entrance to Guest Services), was the new hot thing in [b]Mandrill Mayhem[/b]. I've posted some brief comments on this in the relevant topic, but will do a little bit of deeper looking here. The area is... lacklustre. Obviously not helped with the small area upon which it resides, completely encircled by the cred itself and security fences, nor is it helped by the jungle theme and distinct lack of actual jungle currently present. The single pathway around also seems to be a problematic bottleneck, since the central area is cut through with planting and activities, it's certainly a design choice and not one that particularly works for a dead end area hosting the first coaster seen since 2004. The jaguar centrepiece is typical Merlin fair, and due to the layout of the coaster itself lends to great views of it. The coaster itself is just, ok. It is a good addition for the park it sits in, but as the new headline coaster fails to solve the issues that have plagued the park over the years. The queue looks god awful (presumably why the virtual queue system was put in place), and not being able to stand in the air gates until the train is coming into park confuses me. Remember when many were claiming the John Wardley said they had solved the throughput issue? Still waiting for the answer there, as the ops are still fairly slow and not helped by the single train (also, they sent RAP queuers to the right side via stairs, which is just... no guys). The actual experience is fun, but doesn't stretch much further beyond that. The launches are surprisingly punchy (yet the beginning backwards one has zero fanfare?) and it's very floaty. The helix spike is uncomfortable as predicted. It's a missed opportunity. I think a clone of the Wing-Rider built at Lego Germany would've been just as good an addition, with potential for decent throughput. I guess Swarm's existence put paid to such a thing, but there's so many potential options out there these days that whilst it's fab to see a B&M at Chessie, why did it have to be this one? Anyway, up next we headed over to [b]Gruffalo[/b]. Big old change from Bubbleworks and baby's first ever ride, so a big milestone that. She enjoyed it, and actually I did too. Almost cosy I think is a good description of it, even if it's fairly basic in terms of things to look at (compared to the older days of things EVERYWHERE). Cutesy and twee and the moved ORP makes far more sense than the original location. Have the middle fountains been taken out in the finale section as well? In traditional fashion, followed up with [b]Vampire[/b]. Running 2 trains but the operations were slow. Running fairly well though so that's something at least? Also what have they done to the station music? Awful. Went to Pizza Pasta for lunch. Doesn't seem to be a great deal of options for proper sit down meals at Chessie if you don't want to get poisoned at Burger Kitchen and I got out-voted for Smokehouse. God the prices are obscene for food there now, but guess it's just a reflection of modern life now. It was acceptable. Wandered around the zoo for a bit. Forgot how much got spited by the addition of the second hotel around Amazu which is a bit depressing. Zoo hasn't really changed beyond that though, though Wanyama's area is poorly designed in terms of pathway width and the ridiculous walk to Zufari. Which I sat out of to babysit but apparently is even more of a Depressing Cave these days. Went to see the Tigers and whilst out that whole area seems really oppressive with the giant fencing now. Didn't do Tiger Falls either cos weather. Decided to go on [b]Tomb Blaster[/b]. My gun didn't work but jeez the ride is in a bit of a mess. Another shoed-in storyline which... Yeah. The boulder seems to be missing completely and the areas around the Anubis statue and Snake are just... lacklustre without the old soundtrack. Feels like it would need far more than the Alty Mans treatment to make it somewhat more acceptable. Bit annoyed that they've changed the cars on [b]Jungle Truckers[/b] to reduce the number of adults. Toadies used to be a staple in the day! It was fine and the Capybaras were out. Also did [b]Sea Dragons[/b] which made me nostalgic and [b]Dragon's Fury[/b] where had just 2 adults and it was spinning like mad. Cemented as the best coaster in the park by miles. Did the [b]Carousel[/b] and [b]Jumbos[/b] as well to up the baby ride count as well, but very little to really say on those. Back to other new things, [b]Room on the Broom[/b], where the ride host got plus points for keeping us separated by the awful group of teens who were going on it. This was a real surprise here, especially compared to what Hocus Pocus Hall used to be. Lots of interaction for the kids and didn't feel like it was put together for about £5. Sure baby would enjoy it when older should it still exist in the future. Did Sea-Life where the staff were very chatty, then hit up [b]Blue Barnacle[/b] after some did the Vile Villager walkthrough which was apparently good. The best thing about the new ship (which looks really small) are the goats that watch over you. After some drinks it was back over to Gruffalo and one more spin on Mandrill Mayhem. Must note here that the booking vanished for me the second time around but the staff member was able to find it so at least was solved. Would've put a really bad spin on the day if hadn't been able to ride it. Second time round was really bouncy which is concerning for a ride not even a year old. And that was it. As we were very out of the theme park mode called it about 6:30 and went to Monkey Puzzle for dinner. I've certainly missed the theme park experiences over the years and going around with the additional mindset of baby (on top of the wheelchair using aspect) makes things a bit different. Chessie was always good for a meander and giggle though over the years when visiting and at least it still is in that respect. Although I must admit the park is very hit and miss in terms of the quality. Croc Drop wasn't spinning and generally didn't bother with it, and don't even think we went into Mexicana more than just to walk through it. Areas like the old Alpine Cafe which is now extended depressing cattlepen land and others are just really weird to look at in terms of a distinct lack of decent thought processes to make it look half decent. The two Julia Donaldson rides are really sweet but even on a quiet day the operations were little to be desired. Jumanji probably should've been a big step for the park in the right direction. I mean it's the biggest addition since Zufari (maybe even Wild Asia) and yet it does little to solve the flaws of the park. The reliability also didn't seem great as Kobra was dead all day, as well as Griffins and Scorpion Express. Rattlesnake opened late as well. I dunno, it's itched the theme park bug and hopefully next year will be a bit more substantial in terms of numbers. Though having to go to Thorpe does depress me somewhat. We shall see.

Nailed it 😎

I can't believe the ride that everyone hates is being adjusted and everyone hates its even more.

I will not be contempt until I see JK SLKSTN in a neon Thorpe branded T-shirt riding a wrecking ball into Loggers Leap shouting “EXODUS EXODUS EXODUS EXODUS EXODUS EXODUS EXODUS EXODUS EXODUS…” 1000 times. I hope Shane Sandwich gets first dibs on the obsolete signage.

I dunno, I think it was a nice refreshing addition to the thread.

Natural England have today Withdrawn their objection(s) to project exodus. If I have got this correct, this is separate to the environment agency’s objection which relate more to flooding then anything else. One less hurdle and hopefully stuff starts to pick up as we reach September. Maybe a sign of things to come…. Or maybe not 😝

I wouldn't say that Californias Great America is a park that anyone has a huge itch to get to. Unlike some others in the Cedar Fair group, its investments are on the lower end of the scale. Flat rides are the name of the game and even its planned hyper that it was rumoured to get was given to another park instead (Orion). Eight years ago, it was either this or Discovery Kingdom and bizarrely I chose DK. I thought that was a great little park, but this time it was CGA's turn. It's relatively easy to get to, sitting in San Jose and it took about two hours of train journey from San Francisco. I'd heard very little about this place before so upon arriving I didn't really know where anything was or what support rides there were. The entrance for example looks very similar to other Cedar Fair parks but also Six Flags Great America. I've since learned that and CGA were once owned by the same group. Our first destination was Flight Deck which has the distinction of being B&M's first custom inverted rollercoaster. Built in 1993 the ride features three inversions and is a very old school B&M. It looks stunning in its bright red attire and the ride looked well maintained. My first reaction was how small the station was. It's very cramped and its the same with Patriot and many of the original gang of B&M's are the same (Batman clones tend to have tiny stations too). Also, for all the criticism I saw that Emperor has no station at Seaward, well.. there isn't a station here either. Geek, be consistent. Once getting on, after waiting one train off we went. Very positive G Force heavy, really nice inversions and a well paced layout. There is an odd bit in the middle of the ride where the train travels in a straight line over the station which felt at odds with everything else. The ending is particularly great with an intense helix over a small lake. There was no second train. Unlike Cedar Point which runs three trains to a fault or Silver Bullet which had its second train in bits scattered all over the break run, Flight Decks second train doesn't seem to exist. This isn't an extra-ordinary inverter and neither is it a dud. It's a good, solid B&M which has clearly served the park well. It just made me so glad we have Nemesis. I know its very easy to compare every inverter to Nemesis but the reality is, Nemesis is outstanding. From a layout perspective, a theming perspective, an efficiency and capacity perspective. Every park could learn a lesson from our grubby white alien. I next wanted to get on Patriot but we went the wrong way and ended up exploring all the park instead. Some of my favourite flat rides passed (KMG Afterburner, Huss Breakdance) before we just ended up getting lost. I checked the app and it said that Railblazer was 0 minutes. Staying cautious we decided to take a chance. Now this has two trains running. Which is good as at 8 people a train it has serious capacity issues. We ended up waiting half an hour which I was pretty happy with. To be honest, as good as it is, it's too fast. It zooms through the layout at break-neck speed and it feels very hard to take it all on board. Air time hills, inversions. it's like a blur. No major park should get the off-shelf model. It's too popular for what it is and it just cannot handle a park with crowds. The legend that is Josh C has been tweeting about Jersey Devil, so when he reviews, I'll be very interested in that one. With that out the way we took a ride on Demon, an arrow looper. I like the old arrow loopers. Whilst rougher then most modern rides there's something about a ride with janky track design that just appeals to me. As they start to arrive at the end of their lives, I'm just glad to have got on some of them. Next was Patriot. This used to be a stand up before it got converted to a floorless (like Rougarou and Firebird). Whilst I do get why parks are running away from stand up, I dunno. The floorless train doesn't add much beyond making the ride rideable? Maybe thats the point. My husband made the observation that if it wasn't for the height restriction, this would be an excellent 'starter' rollercoaster for an aspiring thrill seeker. And it got me thinking about rides like this and Daemonen at Tivoli Gardens. And he's so right in the observation. Very few inversions, mildly intense without being mind-blowing. Considering this is a B&M from 1991, its aged pretty well from what I could tell. Still, no second train to be found. After lunch it was time for the wooden coasters. We started with the CGI Wooden coaster, Gold Striker. This had a second train! wow. This was a fantastic ride. Really fast and intense. And with most of the ride hidden from the walkways, it took me by surprise. It probably sits just under Wodan for intensity. Some of the turns it was doing, for a traditional woody, were fabulous. Heavily recommended and the best ride at CGA by a country mile. And onto our final new rollercoaster Grizzly. Quite easily the worst operations I have ever seen on a ride. It took over seven minutes to unload, load and dispatch a train. Part of this seemed to be staff training, the other part was sheer incompetence. You're running one train around your mildly interesting rollercoaster. This shouldn't be that difficult. But it was. What looked to be a twenty minute wait ended up taking around 70. I was done after this, Didn't even want to attempt the low capacity Arrow wild-mouse which was displaying a 40 minute wait. So instead we went on two flat rides including the breakdance. Every park should have a breakdance. They are the best flat ride by far. And we called it a day around 4pm. This park needs investment. On the surface everything looks fine. But it provides a middling day out in a state that has Disney, Knotts & Magic Mountain. Hard to compete, yes, but CGA isn't really even trying. It has great support rollercoasters in Flight Deck and Gold Striker but it needs that killer, triple A attraction to make the difference. And two trains on its rides.

Just to say what I did on Twitter - this drilling is for soil sampling so they know what they are dealing with when putting in footers/excavations etc. It will categorically, 100% NOT be being used to drill holes for construction itself and is purely for investigative purposes. Still - progress is progress, and is exciting to see.

Roses are Red Violets are Blue I have limited patience... ...for lame cryptic Clues

Closed by 2023 is all I could think of to be honest.

You seem like the competitive type Mark; why don't you have a crack at winning this one?

Nothing much to add to this discussion really, other than it's been an interesting read! I can't see the future looking too bright for DBGTROTD and would agree with @JoshC. to be honest... can't see that it will open in 2020 at all. It would take quite some retheme to change it to something else minus VR. It has been, and is going to continue to be, a huge problem for the park. One thing I will say - and have always said - the show building exterior (generally), the pre-show, and above all else, the Victorian carriage exterior, the tube train interiors, the Underground station and the fake shop (minus the guy in the white t-shirt) are all pretty much world class - and I say that without a sense of irony at all. They've nailed those. It's just such a shame that the rest has always been a bit of a confused mess. Maybe that bodes well for keeping it and rehashing it to something else, I don't know. For it to be removed in it's entirity after the Derren IP expires, or before, would be unheard of - but I don't think it's out of the question. The money pot isn't never ending, and there comes a point where you have to admit defeat, especially with the added complication of coronavirus (and the very valid points about the storyline featuring corona symptoms, plus people probably not wanting doom and gloom when they can finally go to a theme park after all this has passed) - it's going to be morbidly fascinating what happens next.

Prior to launch in 2016, the park drew up a rough contingency plan for what would happen if the VR totally failed. And I mean totally failed. As in they got to a point where using VR was a complete impossibility, and they *had* to get the ride open. It was a rough plan, and I doubt the park ever would have truly considered it, but it effectively made use of planted actors (who would become 'infected' by the gases and turn crazy), the screens near the top of the carriages to communicate a story and a more 'live' experience in generally. As I say, and as far as I understand, this was very much a quick and rough plan drawn up in case absolutely everything failed, but wasn't exactly considered as a serious option. It would certainly be feasible for the park to implement something like this. It effectively just requires to hiring of extra actors and the writing of more scripts. Again though, I highly doubt the park actually would do this, especially given the feedback to the ride so far. Ghost Train was meant to have more effects that did not make it into the ride. Leg ticklers I believe were bought but never installed, for example. The point early on in the process where the windows were meant to be screens is another example. These things are much harder to solve and introduce retrospectively too. What does this means for Ghost Train's future though? I believe the Derren Brown IP contract is multiple years (6 I heard). Whether there's any break in the contract is anyone's guess. Obviously things like a global pandemic aren't top priorities to be talked about when drawing up contracts for IPs for rides. So it would be interesting to see what happens. But then, what do they do with the space? Do they totally gut it out and put something new inside? Transform the ride system into some form of immersive tunnel (which, with the ride system currently in place isn't impossible, but likely expensive)? Completely remove the whole thing? They *could* leave it SBNO and transform the inside for Fright Nights attractions, but again that's costly and also leaves a giant elephant in the room. Another potential issue: could there be a negative public reaction to the theme of the ride? If you piece and twist it together, it's all about a respiratory thing causing illness. In this day and age, I could see some people trying to twist it... In my opinion, it's very hard to see Ghost Train opening in the mid-term. Certainly not this year, even if the park reopens. If we work on the timeframe of no vaccine till autumn next year, it's hard to see it reopen next year. After that, the contract could be up. There's the more global problems as well about what this means for VR in the entertainment and leisure industry in general. But also, what about 3D rides? It's less of a problem as they've been around a lot longer and cleaning them is easier. But I still reckon many people will feel less comfortable wearing them. And it does mean parks have to be more careful and thorough washing them (and I'm sure there's plenty of parks who aren't..). That's going to be an interesting step for the industry. So yeah, tl;dr. I can't see Ghost Train reopening any time soon. A true reimagining of it will cost millions to do well. They're left with a giant elephant in the room which completely screws them up any way.